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Old Mar 18, 2012, 07:46 PM
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Freddie B's Avatar
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Thanks Pinky, It is also the best stuff I ever used to sand on EPP foam. I'll try it on regular foam as that is something I never tried believe it or not!

Fred
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Old Mar 18, 2012, 10:10 PM
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Waltjg's Avatar
Crystal River Fl.
Joined Jul 2008
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Your wings look great John! And yes his method is the best, like John, I used to skin them the old way also, and now have used this method a few time,, this is MUCH easier! W.
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Old Mar 19, 2012, 10:50 AM
Now in TN!
J Morgan's Avatar
Chapel Hill, TN USA
Joined Apr 2001
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Yep Walt, it's a quick and easy way to do it.

Trying to make some progress here. I'm afraid it will slow down some. Have a birthday coming up for my daughter , checking off an item on my bucket list when we go to the Master's practice round to see Tiger in the flesh, and man, SEFF is only a month away! Where did the time go?
I have several things to get ready for SEFF and will have to start by cleaning this messy shop up so I can find everything.
But I'm trying to make some progress. Have the canopy plug almost ready to pull.
The LE & TE are on the wing panels and shaped. Still some work to do with the TE because no matter how hard I try, I tend to get the TE of the foam cores a little too thin to match the commercial balsa TE. But it's an easy fix, little sanding, little spackle and the airfoil will match up.
Working on getting the dihedral set too. As far as I can tell from the 3 view, it is 3" per panel. Made ply dihedral braces and cut them in. The dihedral breaks will get a second layer of 3 oz glass to for add'l strength.
Hope to get a canopy pulled today if I get the framing on it.

J
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Old Mar 19, 2012, 01:06 PM
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J Morgan's Avatar
Chapel Hill, TN USA
Joined Apr 2001
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Made a pull on the canopy plug. Got the plastic a little hot and damaged the plug some. I'll have to repair and make another pull.
But it does allow one to throw all the parts together, make some motor noises, and take some pics to keep the juices flowing.

J
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Old Mar 19, 2012, 01:35 PM
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United States, NV, Las Vegas
Joined Dec 2004
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Looks great John, on the canopy plug second pic from the left is that a coating you put on it then sand it. I think I read in your blog that befor the pull you also coat the plug with vasoline ?
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Old Mar 19, 2012, 01:42 PM
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Omaha Nebraska
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Moving right along, at light speed! Looking great and I can hear those engine noises all the way to here! Keep up the outstanding job.

Fred
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Old Mar 19, 2012, 02:21 PM
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J Morgan's Avatar
Chapel Hill, TN USA
Joined Apr 2001
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Thanks Andy,
In the first pic it shows the plug with bondo on it and rough sanded. Second pic shows where I sanded, recovered bad places, and then sanded again. I have a very thin coating of bondo on it, too thin. I'll have to strip the framing tape and redo it with another coat.
I didn't coat this one with vaseline. If you do, smear a light coat on and then wipe it all off. Of course you won't get it all off and that's the idea. Just as minimum as possible. If you have too much vaseline, it will get hot, bubble , and can affect the pull. Plus it could sort of get into the plastic so very very easy on the vaseline if you use it.
I just love the look of the Sandy. Although it is a 75" ws I'll bet it looks small next to my Skyray.

Thanks Fred

J
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Old Mar 19, 2012, 07:06 PM
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United Kingdom, Northern Ireland, Belfast
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Wow John. I have to check in on you all the time. Just yesterday I built my own table top hotwire cutter from something I saw you doing once and I felt pretty good about myself. Now just reading the 6 pages I've learned how to make a mould for a canopy and a cowl. Compare this to high school and I tell ya....high school taught me jack.

Please never stop. Skyraider looks beautiful btw.

Shane
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Old Mar 19, 2012, 09:11 PM
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Southwestern VA
Joined Nov 2009
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J - Thanks again for taking the time to share. I started out using West System's resin to glue balsa sheeting but then tried the brown gorilla glue when I did the wings for the Ohka I'm working on. Don't think I'll go back to using resin. The only problem I ran into was that I used sand bags to weigh down the beds and didn't get even pressure over the leading edge. Nothing a little more gorilla glue and tape didn't fix.

Maybe I'm following your examples too closely though. I usually end up with the trailing edge too thin as well. I have found an alternative to sanding and spackling to get commercial trailing edge stock to fit though. This is probably nothing new to anyone here but thought I'd share just in case. What I did was pick up some over-sized (both in thickness and width) TE stock and measure back from the leading edge of the stock to where the thickness matched the TE of the sheeted wing core. Then I ripped the TE stock lengthwise on the band saw. Last step was to mark off the desired width (front to back) from the TE stock's new leading edge and rip the stock again lengthwise. Did that make sense?
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Old Mar 19, 2012, 10:07 PM
No Hangar Queens!
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Absolutely... That is what I do. Not sure if J uses this or not but it works quite well.
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Old Mar 19, 2012, 10:23 PM
Fly it like U stole it
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Champaign, Il
Joined Mar 2008
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No, LOL, I need pictures
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Old Mar 19, 2012, 10:24 PM
Now in TN!
J Morgan's Avatar
Chapel Hill, TN USA
Joined Apr 2001
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Compare this to high school and I tell ya....high school taught me jack."

Now that's funny. Appreciate the kind comments, glad you are finding something useful here Shane.

Jeremy,
That makes complete sense. I'm using basic hand tools. No bandsaw, no table saw ( well, a little bitty one from Micro Mark) and the last time I got TE material in it felt like it was made from oak. Didn't feel like fighting it with an exacto or scroll saw so I went the easier route. It will work, just some cosmetic work with sanding and spackle. I wish they would make TE sock for electric planes instead of just for slimers.
On the LE pressure, with Gorilla glue you have time to tape the beds tight along the LE and TE if you desire. But you will have to trim the overlap up to the foam to get the tape tight.That will ensure that those edges get glued down tight. Of course after taping then load the beds down good with a bunch of weight.

I think I will get the TE on the wing panels fixed and then cut out the ailerons and flaps. Need to balsa cap everything that needs it and then glass before joining the wings with the middle section. It's so much easier to do it that way than if it is all one piece.

J
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Old Mar 20, 2012, 09:26 AM
Fast Jets for Fast times
Lmeano_from_MO's Avatar
St. Peters MO.
Joined Nov 2007
1,210 Posts
The Raider is looking great John,

Your detailed wing build up explanation timing is perfect. I am getting ready to do the same so on the Tiger. You have a lot of balsa in them. I was wondering if you have ever given a thought to use other 1/16 wood laminates? I know weight is always a factor in our builds. I was thinking of going to our local specialty wood shop and check and see what is available. I think I will need 8 4inch wide sheets per wing of balsa at about $45 not including LE/TE and boxing ailerons. I guess I’m trying to save a buck or 2 if I can.

Jeff
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Old Mar 20, 2012, 11:00 AM
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J Morgan's Avatar
Chapel Hill, TN USA
Joined Apr 2001
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Hi Jeff,
Weight is important, less so on a bigger build. My weight concern here is behind the CG. I know from the other two I've built that the old short nose Spad needs a lot of weight up front to balance.
On the balsa skins, obechi is nice, hard and not much heavier than balsa because you can use a thinner skin. But if you can find it it isn't cheap either I wouldn't think. You could use 1/32" ply, it comes in very large sheets. But neither of the previous two give the flexibility or ease of use as balsa. Balsa lets us be less than precise and sand to get where we want.
Yep, price of balsa is going up and I guess as long as Obama and the Chinese keep building wind turbines blades out of it, it won't get any cheaper. Just part of the game.
I'm cutting out ailerons and flaps and capping them as we speak.

J
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Old Mar 20, 2012, 11:48 AM
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United States, KY, Sturgis
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Quote-Yep, price of balsa is going up and I guess as long as Obama and the Chinese keep building wind turbines blades out of it, it won't get any cheaper. Just part of the game.

Seems like I read somewhere that it was used as insulation on some super tankers also. I think maybe the ones carrying LNG. Now that would definitely be using a 'boat load' of balsa.

Tony
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