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Old Mar 03, 2012, 07:50 AM
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Covering with Sig Koverall

I am going to build a Sig 1/5 Scale Cub. I am wondering about covering it with Sig Koverall and have a few questions?

Sig offers a number of approaches.

Should I use Stik It or Nitrate Dope to adhere it?

About how much of the Nitrate, Butyerate, and final Color will I need?

Will this approach not distort the structure?

Will it weigh a lot more than say Monokote assuming I go for a fabric look and not overdo the paint?

I may have some Stits Polytone and Polytone Yellow from an old project. Will that work and is it nitro proof?

Thanks!
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Old Mar 03, 2012, 11:28 AM
TFF
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Polytone should work but better if their glue is used. If you read the Full scale Polytone manual and the Randoph manual it takes about 2 times the dope if you are spraying it thinned correctly. Polytone costs twice as much so the average cost is the same. I use stik it but nitrate will do just as good; better if undercambered. Depends if you like to iron the edges down or use the nitrate. Stikit is fabric glue from a different full size process for dope. I bought 3 gal each of Polybrush and Spray for a real airplane, to start covering a real plane, so I am using it too. Polytone thinner smells just like Aerogloss dope.
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Old Mar 03, 2012, 11:40 AM
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Thanks. Are you planning on using Stik-It to apply the fabric, and then Polybrush followed by Polytone Color?

Or Polytak to stick the fabric?
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Old Mar 03, 2012, 11:50 AM
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straight talk

I use Koverall on almost all my airplanes.I have been using nitrate dope to adhere it,then using rustoleum spray cans for final finish..Once the Koverall is securely applied,then you use a film covering iron to shrink it. I've been using nitrate dope thinned 50-50 to 'seal' the weave.go carefully or some dope will wick through and cause'scarring' several light coats are better than a runny one.
keep going until all pinholes are faired over.That usually takes 3 or 4 coats.
You can use avariety of paints to finish off the airplane to your satisfaction..

Keep in mind,if you use butyrate dope,you can't add more nitrate over it,or it wrinkles and peels.
I believe it's a bit heavier,but so much nicer looking,and we're only talking ounces ,here,not pounds,in the total weight.
Just give it a try....we'll help you.
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Old Mar 03, 2012, 04:04 PM
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What Earl says mostly, I use Stix-it thinned to a watery mix with acetone from Home Depot. Dont use Lowes acetone, its too hot and will give you a cottage cheese consistancy. My last plane was done with Warbird Colors Paints, WBC. Their primer then paint. Works good, but he's having supplier problems so I'll use Nelsons Paints which applies the same way on the next one. I've heard of someone using Minwax Polycrylic to stick the koveral down, then more polycrylic to seal the weave before paint. I'm gonna try that on a test wing and see how it does. I like WBC and Nelsons paints cause its glow fuel resistant up to 20%. I use glow 4-strokes on my cubs done with koveral.
Edwin
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Old Mar 03, 2012, 07:11 PM
TFF
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I am using polytak on my big plane. I am sure stikit would be ok but the MEK in the Poly might make the stikit soften as it is nitrate based. I am pretty sure this is stikit http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalo...s/sureseam.php and SIG dope is their stuff; it use to be Randolph. Brodak dope is Randolph.
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Old Mar 03, 2012, 07:33 PM
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Thanks TFF, I might as well stick with the Polytone system all the way. I have some color and polybrush, but need to order some reducer and might just as well get the polytak and have it done with. I've had this paint sitting around for about 15 years but I popped the lids and it looks perfect. I did an ultralight with it back in the day, so I should remember it well enough to do a model. It should be interesting to try fabric on a model. It would differentiate the plane from the typical ARF Cub which costs less than my kit costs! My Sig kit is $222; I saw an Ebay Cub ARF of the same size for $122, well, er, sort of a Cub anyway.
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Old Mar 04, 2012, 05:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by u2builder View Post
Thanks TFF, I might as well stick with the Polytone system all the way. I have some color and polybrush, but need to order some reducer and might just as well get the polytak and have it done with. I've had this paint sitting around for about 15 years but I popped the lids and it looks perfect. I did an ultralight with it back in the day, so I should remember it well enough to do a model. It should be interesting to try fabric on a model. It would differentiate the plane from the typical ARF Cub which costs less than my kit costs! My Sig kit is $222; I saw an Ebay Cub ARF of the same size for $122, well, er, sort of a Cub anyway.
I'm glad you recognize the "sort of Cub" point.I don't know your motives yet,but there's no 'YOU' in an arf...and I'm not knocking them here,...you just seem to want to do your own thing. And I encourage that.
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Old Mar 04, 2012, 06:54 AM
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I have always built most of my planes. I love the process. I savor it. I dream about it and loose sleep about it.

Still, given the time it takes to build a plane, I am amazed at the "value" there is in the ARF's. Even with cheap labor it is hard to fathom how they can build and sell the ARF for less than the price of a kit. And I know the kit makers are not getting rich, but rather are struggling to survive. And the quality the good ARFS looks to be very good, and even the EBay ARFs are sometimes pretty decent. The Ebay Cub I was looking at, however, left a lot to be desired, but hey, what would one expect for $122 for a big Cub.

It is great to tune into the Scale Builders forum where people build planes. There aren't a lot of builders here in the backwoods of NH. I belong to two clubs, each with about 25 members. At one club I am the only fellow who builds the planes he flies; at the other club I think there are a couple of old timers (like me) who build planes. One is extremely talented and "designs and builds". But three out of 50 is a small percentage. Most folks think building a plane is putting on the tailfeathers, installing the servos and engine.

I am quite excited about trying fabric covering. Usually I struggle with the creative aspects of covering. With a Cub that should be easy: Yellow everywhere. I am hoping I mix some of my Stits Yellow and Red to get an approximation of Cub Yellow.
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Old Mar 04, 2012, 10:17 AM
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I use Stix-It and Koverall. I use Stix-It like the others use dope to adhere fabric to framework. I don't use the iron to stick fabric to framework. The iron is only used to shrink fabric and it won't be needed much with Koverall (or similar fabrics). I use 50/50 nitrate dope and nitrate dope thinners applied with a roller to seal the fabric. Takes me 2-4 coats. Very lightweight and ready for paint! The Fokker Drl middle wing was covered with one piece of fabric. The Piper PA-12 fuselage was covered with 2 pieces.
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Old Mar 04, 2012, 11:13 AM
TFF
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I would say the percentage of builders to ARF fliers is the same everywhere. What they are missing is not a secret, but they never seem to get it.
I am not going to say putting fabric on is easer, but I find it less frustrating, and I love the process. http://www.stits.com/ sells Stits for models and big planes.
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Old Mar 04, 2012, 11:24 AM
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There is something very nice about the look of the fabric, like in ARUP fine pictures above.

I have probably covered 4 dozen planes in Monokote over the years. Some have come out pretty good, some less good. But they all tend to look a little less good over the years, and need attention with the iron to get rid of sags that develop. But I build most of my planes over the winter and don't have a place to spray so the film is good. But Spring is coming and I can spray outdoors with a mask for this one. It will be a good experiment.
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Old Mar 04, 2012, 01:03 PM
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I've just come from a full scale roll-out of a PIPER J-3,completely rebuilt.

Arup posted his pics while I'm in WOW! mode. There isn't an ARF that can evoke the feeling of awe in a well built model...But those guys are so touchy,I hate to even say "ARF"..Like the electric fliers,they always have a defensive comment.."I don't have the time',I don't have to clean them up,"

I understand there are few of us left,who build from the ground up,but you won't forget us for a long time...We have that indefinable something,that makes you 'feel'our aircraft.,that you cannot get otherwise..

Park any twenty ARFS alongside ONE well-built scale model and see where the crowd gathers..I'm not saying DON'T build arfs,I'm saying do build scale.
You're cheating yourself if you don't.
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Old Mar 14, 2012, 03:18 PM
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I like using Minwax polycrylic for sticking down Koverall. It is wife-friendly (I.e., no odor) and it dries fast. You can help the fabric adhere in stubborn areas (like wing tips) with a covering iron, which accelerates the drying of the Minwax. Pull the fabric down hard around compound curves while heating and stretching it, and use the iron to stick it down good... just like you would with film.

Once shrunk nice and taut, I then give it a couple of coats of nitrate dope (outdoors), for a drum tight finish. Give it a week to thoroughly cure, and you are ready for primer and paint. I use Rustoleum or Krylon.

By the way, i think you'll find that secret blend of yellow and orange to make Cub yellow will require a shot or two of black (add it slowly!).
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Old Mar 28, 2012, 06:15 PM
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Covering with Sig Koverall

I Have Covered a Bunch of planes with sig Koverall.
I love the stuff, I have used both stik it and nitrate dope, plus used sig lite coat, I like nitrate best myself..
After ur final sand, apply 2-3 coats thined with either Sig dope thiiner or I use MEK from home depot cause its a bit cheaper..
When dry, sand lightly..Then just drape the koverall on and use the thinned dope to paint around the edges. Work out the wrinkles the best ya can.. Let dry, then using a very sharp razor, trim around the edges, use care..use yr monacoat iron to go around the edges and press it into the frameing. i use mild heat for this.Shink with your iron..
Then 2-3 coats more dope of yr choice,..
From there, I have been spraying 2- 4c oats of house paint , latex ,and a final coat of nelsons clear coat poly with crosslinker.

Just Dope Works good to if ya want to, and dont mind the smell..

Good Luck and happy landings to ya
Cheers
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