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Old Feb 28, 2012, 04:57 PM
Rocky Mountain High and Higher
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Question
Fabric and dope covering

Anyone know the weight difference per sq/ft sq/m between iron on film type and fabric and dope covering.
The reason I ask is a while back, maybe a year or two ago in some thread someone mentioned using fabric and dope instead of film.
I was thinking about it and I do know that fabric and dope with outlast Monokote by many, many years.
Of course there is a bit more work too it but can be worth it.

Thanks
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Old Feb 28, 2012, 06:55 PM
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United States, TX, Leander
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I dont know the weight difference or even where to find it, but living in the south the main advantage is that doped fabric doesnt wrinkle as bad (if at all) in the heat like a mylar covering does. Along with that, when doing a quarter scale or bigger I think the cost can be cheaper. Just my opinion though. I'm more into sigs Koverall.
Edwin
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Old Feb 28, 2012, 07:04 PM
Rocky Mountain High and Higher
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I will check out SIG.
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Old Feb 28, 2012, 07:19 PM
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Koverall is great, shrinks like anything, goes around tight curves, and once shrunk up and doped (or some use minwax polycrylic) it never sags. BUT, it does not have any adhesive on it. I use sigs Stix-it, thinned with Home Depot brand acetone. Stix-it is really really thick unthinned, like pancake syrup or STP oil treat (if any of you remember that). I thin it down to a milky consistency, not quite water. Dont use Lowes brand acetone (Crown), its too hot and will cause the stix-it to turn to a cottage cheese type mix.
An alternative would be solartex, but in my opinion its the heaviest of fabric coverings, sticks real good, and shrinks real good. Expensive (at least to me). In the sun's heat it will still wrinkle a bit. You can fix it by reshrinking. It also takes paint real good.
Edwin
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Old Feb 28, 2012, 09:43 PM
Rocky Mountain High and Higher
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I looked it up and I find
Koverall 1.25oz sq yd plus weight of paint (not bad)
Coverite 3.oz1 sq td
Monkote 1.8oz sq yd

I was thinking fabric covering like on real aircraft where the dope shrinks the covering, maybe can't find that type of fabric which is lite enough for model applications.
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Old Feb 29, 2012, 05:53 AM
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Traverse City, Michigan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PROACE View Post
I looked it up and I find
Koverall 1.25oz sq yd plus weight of paint (not bad)
Coverite 3.oz1 sq td
Monkote 1.8oz sq yd

I was thinking fabric covering like on real aircraft where the dope shrinks the covering, maybe can't find that type of fabric which is lite enough for model applications.
This is an unfair comparison.

For Koveral, you need to add in the weight of the adhesive, the sealant, and the final, color coats. When you do, I believe that you'll find the weight to be on a par with other products, such as 21st Century Fabric.

I like to use natural Solartex. It requires no adhesive, and no sealing of the weave. It's easy to apply, and accepts paint easily. I have no idea of how much it weighs. Frankly, I don't care. I like the ease of application, and the fact that it is less work than Koveral.
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Old Feb 29, 2012, 06:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PROACE View Post
I looked it up and I find
Koverall 1.25oz sq yd plus weight of paint (not bad)
Coverite 3.oz1 sq td
Monkote 1.8oz sq yd

I was thinking fabric covering like on real aircraft where the dope shrinks the covering, maybe can't find that type of fabric which is lite enough for model applications.

You can still buy silk.
http://www.thaisilks.com/index.php?cPath=1_2
5mm, or 6mm if you want heavier weight fabric.

Pat MacKenzie
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Old Feb 29, 2012, 06:17 AM
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I like Solartex. You can cover a orange with it and it is much lighter than doped fabric in most cases.

It all depends on how a person applied the dope. If you put it on thick, or make multiple coats, you could have a really heavy plane. If you thin the dope properly I'm sure you could keep the weight down. But add the dope with paint and the ounces really add up. I don't know if they still make colored dope? I'm sure they do? The last kit I built many years ago I used silkspan and dope mixed with thinner, and it came out very well.

I once built a plane with that stuff and I forgot to open the windows because it was so cold outside.

All I know is I killed a few brain cells that day and I was stooooned! Ahhh the colorssss... Hey, is that Uncle Bob? Hey, you aren't supposed to be here? You died 5 years ago didn't you?

That stuff is stronger than Balsarite Balsa Conditioner! And that's bad all on its own!

Pete
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Old Feb 29, 2012, 09:57 AM
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The contraversy ...

... rages on! Google "Dharma trading Co., they sell silk for much less than anywhere else I've seen.

Sig has dope, clear & colored, in nitrate & buterate, there's also Brodiks for dope.

There's another thing to consider, silk & dope are much much stronger than plastic film, at any weight.

Laramie.
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Old Feb 29, 2012, 10:09 AM
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Most other coverings will outlast a silk/dope finish by far, especially if it gets much exposure to the sun. The silk will get very weak and will be very fragile after a few years. If you first put on a coat of silver paint under the final paint coats, it will last a bit longer as that will protect the silk from the sun's ultraviolet rays destruction.
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Old Mar 01, 2012, 04:11 AM
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Eh, I agree that doped silk covered aircraft is stronger than plastic film covered aircraft. But I don't agree it's stronger than Solartex.

People think my Fokker Dr1 was done in silk and dope until I explain it's just bare Solartex. Also, with Solartex you can sew it with a little CA on the backside of it where we want to add that fine details on the opposite side that's going to show.

Matter in fact some of todays aircraft is covered in Solartex type material. ( I think there's a different name for it )You glue all the edges down, then iron the rest to get any loose areas tight, tack it all down, add the rib and leading edge tape, seal and paint.

If Solartex is good enough for the full sized aircraft, then it is good enough for my scale models.

It's only my opinion, but when Solartex came out, doping aircraft became a bygone era tradition that's almost a thing in the past. But I do admitt that doping silk the old fashion way makes a WWI, Golden Age Aircraft that more realistic to what was done to the full sized original aircraft.

The only bad side other than the fumes is trying to remove the covering when it's time to rebuild, or recover. The old doped cloth is a pain to remove. Much harder than Solartex, Mono or Ultra to remove in my opinion.

The good side of doped aircraft is it does last, you don't have to re-hit it with a iron, and it does look good.

Pete
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Old Mar 01, 2012, 07:24 AM
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Silk and dope, or Solartex ???
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Old Mar 01, 2012, 09:24 AM
Rocky Mountain High and Higher
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So all-in-all if a person wants a lasting finsh on an model (take into account minimal accidents) then the cost and weight of doped fabric, Solortex or Coverite justifies itself over the use of iron on films.
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Old Mar 01, 2012, 09:51 AM
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real deal

I use Sig Koverall a lot.But I build miniature aircraft in large scale. At the present time I'm considering the Stits light system....unadulterated fabric,glue,sealer and finish paint.Ala the full scale planes.
I believe all the fabrics are made about equal,aside from silk,so you should get the same result,in finish and weight.
I especially like the usefulness of the fabrics....after a crash,all the parts are contained in the fabric "bag"... nothing escapes !!!
It's 'apples and oranges'again...try what you haven't tried .....see for yourself.!
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Old Mar 01, 2012, 11:30 PM
Balsadustus Producerus
Escondido, CA USA
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There is also the special sound silk makes on impact to consider
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