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Old Jul 05, 2012, 11:42 AM
kin
Composite factory
Joined Sep 2007
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Originally Posted by teamdavey View Post
I just checked the website for the 650 mm blades. Is the weight a typo??
The weight for the blades in the website is 90 , it is roughly weight about 89-92 g . it is a range only , you know the blades is hand make . so we have match the blades in a blades balancer . the balancing work labour cost is very high . because we make it very precision balance need many many many piece to choice the same weight and same c/g point . So all the blades you get is plug and play ! you just add a colour sticker to make the tracking only , after you set well the tracking , you have no need the sticker anymore . Blades weignt range is less than +/- 0.25g , so no need balance again .
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Old Jul 05, 2012, 12:25 PM
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Sunnyvale, CA, USA
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So at only 90 gms for a 650 mm blade do you have any tip weight, cg correction weight or safety wire?
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Old Jul 05, 2012, 01:22 PM
kin
Composite factory
Joined Sep 2007
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Originally Posted by teamdavey View Post
So at only 90 gms for a 650 mm blade do you have any tip weight, cg correction weight or safety wire?
I have study the composite blades since many years before when i was young and fly models with Funkey together. we are 100% understand what we need in the blades inside .
Smartmodel we are design the blades have no weight (no lead matel) inside , so it mean we have nothing parts will get out from the blades when the blades over speed .The blades are fill with a hard wood cord inside full fill inside the blades . so the blades is a solid status . wood have the structure is one direction from root to tip .The first surface is a 3K carbon cloth in X and Y direction .(normal 3 K carbon cloth) . and the full surface is a one direction carbon structure cloth . and than is the hard wood cord.The blades grip position is a special 16 layer (16 piece) carbon structure cloth(one direction) , but it is X and Y direction .
Align carbon blades . the inside structure is 3K cloth in the fist layer , second is same with me one direction structure cloth. and the balsa wood cord (same idea with smartmodel blades ).Because my engineer is from their blades factory ! Ha ! Ha! ,But Align blades in the blads grip position inside have a plastic (injection mold plastic )piece inside the blades grip . size is similar your hand nail size about 18mm width x 30mm length . It have a lead bar near by the tip and near by leading edge . The first version is a straight lead and have fly out case . so after the lead fly out . they bend the lead matel like a wave or we call it (snake shape) . the snake can hold with the wood well . but it is no cable to hold the snake . if the blades crash . the snake still fly out and let see who is the lucky guy ! But the blades grip materil plastic is a different kind material with the epoxy resin , so i am not sure the epoxy resin can hold a different material well or not . so we have no follow their idea . Because we belive ,one king of the epoxy to build the blades is good and top and bottom side can stick together is no problem .so our blades grip postion can call it (one piece material ) .
Funkey blades is a similar concept , the first layer also 3 k cloth and second layer is a one direction structure cloth . the inside lead is make with a small mols (pre-molded) , and with a small wire from the root to the tip .and stick(pre-molded ) together with the lead matel . and inside fill with a pvc foam cord . it can let the weight match easy and the cost and quality stable . we have to make this foam cord soon , But for the safty level . Funkey is first ! But for us . we have strong enough for the scale blades . we have cut the blades grip position in the screw hole . we have 10 mm thickness solid carbon cloth (two direction) mix together . So even you have over speed of the blades , still safty . and we are recommend head speed is below 1800 . So please enjoy your scale flying !
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Old Jul 05, 2012, 01:28 PM
kin
Composite factory
Joined Sep 2007
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All the blades before sent out to customer . we have balancing it each piece and pair match in a seesew balancer . it mean we already finished (your work) . just plug and play . So it is nothing to do in out blades .But we have match the blades are slow , because we need big quantity ti choice match . so the blades come out slow in this monent . but we will add the mold number soon , so please order more . let me make more mold .
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Old Jul 05, 2012, 01:36 PM
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So - if I understood you correctly, you are not incorporating any weight to get the CG outboard or forward but rely on the mix of wood and epoxy density to get the Cg far enough forward.

Also the weight is as advertised at 90 gms.

So, could you share what test flying was done, particularly in gusty conditions to confirm the flying characteristics of the blades? I would like to know what head, how many blades, what rpm and the overall weight of the model used.
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Old Jul 05, 2012, 01:51 PM
kin
Composite factory
Joined Sep 2007
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Yes ! we have no extra weight (lead matel ) in the blades , we are special use a hard wood to keep the blades have a weight for stable flying . but i can let you know now new generation flybarless system are working with the mutil blades head very very well . so the flying characteristics we are very diffcult to feel and it hold your models very stable event strong wing and light wing and light blades and weighted blades . If you use smartmodel scale carbon blades in a normal head (no flyberless system ) . you need make a little higher head speed , because it is too light in this blades .But my customer also use it in flyberless system and mutil blades head . so we have no need add the extra weight . and this (light blades can offer more flight time and loading is less . it is semi-sysmmetical . , it can let you fly more longer time and less the pitch angle to grain the lift force . i have some test piolt testing it . so they will post here and you can read here . we have many topic about scale blades head , parts . tail drive system........fuselage , photo video,....so very happy here in RCG !
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Old Jul 05, 2012, 01:55 PM
kin
Composite factory
Joined Sep 2007
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[QUOTE=kin;22081615]Yes ! we have no extra weight (lead matel ) in the blades , we are special use a hard wood to keep the blades have a weight for stable flying . but i can let you know now new generation flybarless system are working with the mutil blades head very very well . so the flying characteristics we are very diffcult to feel and it hold your models very stable event strong wing and light wing and light blades and weighted blades . If you use smartmodel scale carbon blades in a normal head (no flyberless system ) . you need make a little higher head speed , because it is too light in this blades .But my customer also use it in flyberless system and mutil blades head . so we have no need add the extra weight . and this (light blades can offer more flight time and loading is less . it is semi-sysmmetical . , it can let you fly more longer time and less the pitch angle to grain the lift force . i have some test pilot testing it . so they will post here and you can read here . we have many topic about scale blades head , parts . tail drive system........fuselage , photo video,....so very happy here in RCG !
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Old Jul 05, 2012, 02:39 PM
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Kin,

Thank you for the reply. However, I do not see any indication of where the for/aft CG Is located. Those with long memories will remember Kalt's "heavy wood" and they didn't fly worth a hoot. I remain skeptical that a 90 gm 650 mm blade will work well on a heavy scale model other than at very high revs.

You reference the Rotortech blades in your posts. As you state, they include tip weight to improve handling and they work well. I would also point out that their pricing is more attractive.

A number of folks got burned by the plastic TF blades you used to sell and are unlikely to take the risk again. I know from a good friend in the UK who has visited your operation that you are committed to producing good product, and it would be nice to be able to source a cost effective alternative to Spin blades but based on what you are saying here I will let someone else do the experimentation.
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Old Jul 05, 2012, 06:54 PM
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kin was supposed to send me a two sets, one for my 600 blackhawk, one for my 600 apache, the deal was i'd pay for one set, and the other set would be sent to correct an order i made 5 months ago for a motor which never arrived, and he would cover the rest. i feel like a chump now seeing how freely hes giving the bloody things away on here....

when the arrived, the blades were grey when he said theyd be black, poor quality looked poorly manufactured, and clearly they were factory seconds, yet kin insists these are the final product and that he has NO complaints. im waiting for my money to be refunded and will send them back.

look at the chips and delaminations



the bevel along the leading and trailing edge was uneven and got even wonkier as it gets closer to the blade grips. id be very very cautions any of you folk out there planning on dropping 135usd+shipping on these blaes until he has finished tested stock.
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Old Jul 06, 2012, 12:43 AM
kin
Composite factory
Joined Sep 2007
3,266 Posts
Jay ! it is the first batch and now the quality not that you show in photo . i can show some normal products photo here . let see the quality is imporve a lot . the tailing edge is the cutting machine rpm too lower , we have adjust the machine now are very nice quality , and this is not effect safty . I have le the quality check guy set the standand again . customer will see again the best quality in coming blades . we will let you see the quality is better . One thing , you see market only germany products and me use the scale colour (gray) it is so easy( obvious) let guy see the leading edge carbon metarial . it effect the looking quality , if the blades is black colour . the defect not obvious . the market rotor blades especial the full show carbon colour (see through 3 K cloth ) . the leading edge all paint in black .let same colour in black , if you see detail . it have many small bobble and space and defect . but if the good quality (mold) , the seam line is very very small . the quality look better , My uh-1 800 blades the seam line is a line only , ver very thin . like the plastic injection quality . I have see another good quality products , it also have some bobble in the surface , but i have no feel it quality bad , i still feel quality ok , because i know . the rotor blades is hand make (we call hand layer) . so it is normal , of couse a consummer is not think like me , The rotor blade Jay you get it in hand is my problem . we need choise the best for you and this set is not yet poilshing and not yet complete in proccess .because it just come out two week .So we should have a light sanding and polishing it , let you a nice image . but the blades is no problem . just the surfacing defective . but i can sent you a best quality again ..So if we have compare some products quality here , i think not good .Ha ! Ha! because so effect their business . Thankyou !
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Last edited by kin; Jul 12, 2012 at 08:39 AM.
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Old Jul 06, 2012, 12:52 AM
kin
Composite factory
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Can guy have a commend for scale blades manufactor ! What is the colour for a scale blades ????
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Old Jul 06, 2012, 04:52 PM
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well top marks for admitting that you knowingly sent me defective blades from a test batch and charged me full price for them. says a lot really.

by the way, any idea when you will refund the money? this week would be great. cheers
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Last edited by JayNZ; Jul 06, 2012 at 11:21 PM.
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Old Jul 06, 2012, 11:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kin View Post
Can guy have a commend for scale blades manufactor ! What is the colour for a scale blades ????
it would be great to have options to choose from to match the heli kin, a flat gun metal grey for standard scale blades would be great,

and also

flat gun metal grey with white leafing at the tip
flat gun metal grey with yellow leafing at the tip for military heli /apache/blackhawk
flat gun metal grey/ or gloss white with either black / yellow/ white or red leafing at the tip and half way along the blade for hughes/civilian style heli

for a scale builder/pilot, having options like that to choose from all at one place, of an affordable quality product, would certainly help put smartmodel at the top of the list for scale heli blade manufacturers. i have one of each of the helis i described, and if i could find affordable blades with color options i'd buy them. simple.
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Old Jul 07, 2012, 03:23 AM
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The Netherlands, FR
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JayNZ View Post
it would be great to have options to choose from to match the heli kin, a flat gun metal grey for standard scale blades would be great,

and also

flat gun metal grey with white leafing at the tip
flat gun metal grey with yellow leafing at the tip for military heli /apache/blackhawk
flat gun metal grey/ or gloss white with either black / yellow/ white or red leafing at the tip and half way along the blade for hughes/civilian style heli

for a scale builder/pilot, having options like that to choose from all at one place, of an affordable quality product, would certainly help put smartmodel at the top of the list for scale heli blade manufacturers. i have one of each of the helis i described, and if i could find affordable blades with color options i'd buy them. simple.
Totally agreed with the above mentioned.

Jan,
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Old Jul 09, 2012, 12:17 AM
kin
Composite factory
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let go arrange it soon . ! Jay ! i will refund you this week .
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