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Old Jul 14, 2012, 11:31 PM
Rick
United States, CA, Santa Clara
Joined Mar 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by epoweredrc View Post
No one has found a way to do gain on the old DX7 yet....
Can't you use the gear switch for gain and set a high and low value in the tx travel settings? OK, its not a continuously variable knob but if you get the settings where you want them it may be all you need. If you need more settings,isn't there a 3 pos aux on ch 7? That could be mixed to gear to give potentially 6 gain values.
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Old Jul 14, 2012, 11:47 PM
Rick
United States, CA, Santa Clara
Joined Mar 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John.T View Post
The Guardian should be mounted on your airframe, not your camera tray.
Well I cobbled together a jerry rigged setup to test the concept and no one will be surprised to learn you were right. With the Guardian on the camera tray, runaway jitters pretty much kill the viability. With the Guardian on the airframe, it works pretty well. There's some lag and overshoot so it still wiggles a bit as can be seen in Alros_100's gimbal video. I guess this can be partly controlled by tweaking the derivative gain but that setting is not available in 2D.
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Old Jul 15, 2012, 01:32 AM
Registered User
Great White North
Joined Jun 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by choochoo22 View Post
Well I cobbled together a jerry rigged setup to test the concept and no one will be surprised to learn you were right. With the Guardian on the camera tray, runaway jitters pretty much kill the viability. With the Guardian on the airframe, it works pretty well. There's some lag and overshoot so it still wiggles a bit as can be seen in Alros_100's gimbal video. I guess this can be partly controlled by tweaking the derivative gain but that setting is not available in 2D.
The lag on pitch you are seeing is due to a crappy servo, but having said that i am pretty sure ET will make a gimbal page in the software so we can fine tune movement. Currently gain is setting a few variables including a sort of servo travel, as well as a sort of compensation for gear ratios. My gimbal has a reduction gear of about 3:1. Even with that the gimbal behaviour is getting pretty good. If it stops raining here i will post a test flight video with gimbal controlled by the guardian

Al
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Old Jul 15, 2012, 05:55 AM
Southern Pride
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Haralson County GA. USA
Joined Oct 2004
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Quote:
I have got an eagle tree system together with the Guardian.
You posted in the Guardian 2D / 3D Thread which is a new device just released.

Eagle Tree has had a different Guardian that many use for FPV for a veryy long time and perhaps that is the one you have and if so you need to post in that thread.
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Old Jul 15, 2012, 08:06 AM
24 yrs. of Aircraft flying
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United States, GA, Rockmart
Joined Oct 2004
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Quote:
Originally Posted by choochoo22 View Post
Can't you use the gear switch for gain and set a high and low value in the tx travel settings? OK, its not a continuously variable knob but if you get the settings where you want them it may be all you need. If you need more settings,isn't there a 3 pos aux on ch 7? That could be mixed to gear to give potentially 6 gain values.
Maybe and the aux switch is only a 2 way should have said using a 6 ch rx i do not even own a 7 channel rx
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Old Jul 15, 2012, 12:55 PM
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Joined Jul 2012
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Hello Forum,

Pls help me with Guardian issue.

I am from Vietnam where FPV is very new hobby. I have got an eagle tree system together with the Guardian. At first everything work without any problem but later after some testings, the elevator doesn't work when guardian is enable. Gradually the aileron is also died. I have tried to rerun servos analys wizad many times but nothing is better. When Guardian is disable, everything is back to work normally.

Pls kindly share me your solutions.

Thanks.
Nhut
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Old Jul 15, 2012, 02:11 PM
Registered User
Great White North
Joined Jun 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NhutSgn View Post
Hello Forum,

Pls help me with Guardian issue.

I am from Vietnam where FPV is very new hobby. I have got an eagle tree system together with the Guardian. At first everything work without any problem but later after some testings, the elevator doesn't work when guardian is enable. Gradually the aileron is also died. I have tried to rerun servos analys wizad many times but nothing is better. When Guardian is disable, everything is back to work normally.

Pls kindly share me your solutions.

Thanks.
Nhut
Nhut

You are asking about a different guardian product. Please post your question here at the guardian Add on page

Al
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Old Jul 15, 2012, 03:25 PM
Rick
United States, CA, Santa Clara
Joined Mar 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by epoweredrc View Post
Maybe and the aux switch is only a 2 way should have said using a 6 ch rx i do not even own a 7 channel rx
You don't need a 7 ch rx. Your transmitter doesn't know you don't have a 7 ch receiver and ch 7 still operates. If you mix the switch on ch 7 to your gear ch (5?), by playing with the mix ratios and subtrim you can get multiple gain values on the gear channel. Think of it as a bicycle with 2 sprockets in front and 2 or 3 sprockets in back. By changing both sprockets (switches) you can have 4 or 6 gear ratios (gains). Even just using the gear switch alone it doesn't have to be 0% or 100%, it can be any low and high gain value you want by adjusting the travel limits on the gear channel.
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Old Jul 15, 2012, 04:39 PM
Southern Pride
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Haralson County GA. USA
Joined Oct 2004
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Guardian 2D/3D Gain

OK I finally hooked up Guardian to an 8 Ch. receiver bound to one of my Ace MicroPro800 Transmitters so that I could learn how the remote gain works.

Ace MP8K is a bit strange as it does not have EPA or Reverse per say but uses 1.10ms / 1.50ms / 1.90ms as normal ( full ,100%) servo range 1.50ms being centered /netural.

With Guardians Pots turned full C.W. and Remote gain disconnected ( 40% default) the Guardian has to be turned up on its' edge(rotated) 90 degrees to get full servo defelction ( correction) in 3D mode.

With Remote Gain connected and 1.10ms input there is no responce (corrections) from the Guardian. It is same as if it were set to off or not even connected at all.

With remote gain set at 1.50 ms the Guardian provides max. servo deflections(corrections) when rotated 45 degrees or roughly twice as sensitive as the default ( no gain connected).

From 1.50ms to 1.90 ms supplied pulse there is no change ,that is 1.50 ms will provide enogh gain to enable Guard to move servo full travel one direction when Guardiad is tilted to a 45 degree angle from level.

Now the tricky part. If remote gain is greater than 1.50 ms Guradian does not seem to respond any faster even if you increase gain to 1.90 ms with guardian starting level however if gain is set at 150 ms then raised to 45 degree angle where full servo deflections is obtained and then yo start to lower Guardian to say a 22 degree angle and then increase the gain to 1.90 ms the Guardian will cause the servo to regain part of the correction it gave up during the lowering from 45 to 22 degrees.

If anyone understands this I will really be surprised. Everyone really needs to do as I have done and use an extra receiver,battery and Guardian out of the aircraft so that there are no dangers of binds linkages/ control surfaces etc. and just play with it.

I intend to leave this test setup connected for a while so I can perhaps answer questions as the come up.

Charles
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Old Jul 15, 2012, 05:56 PM
Static Model Collector LOL
Katy, TX
Joined Dec 2009
1,448 Posts
Charles from what you described, I would assume it because guardian response is greatest at the initial moment is senses roll or pitch

A very simple way to see how quickly the servos react and initial range of motion would be to have the plane level with normal gain, tilt or pitch see what the control surfaces do,

Put plane back to level, increase gain then tilt and pitch again. Bet you will see a faster response and greater range of travel

1 of my units will be going up next weekend, let's see how the guardian performs in a solid 170mph fun jet

FCA
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Old Jul 15, 2012, 09:10 PM
Team Wack-a-Mole
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Maryland
Joined Oct 2008
8,439 Posts
I agree with Flame, quite often, gyro response can't always be viewed statically. Many heli gyros I've used WON'T difflect in a way you expect them to even in heading hold mode. What I see almost always is when I wiggle the plane, the more gain, the more the surfaces move. Wiggle the plane in a consistant manor say 30degrees ore more movement then flip the switch to see if the speed of the control surface movement is more with a higher gain. I know this is not yeild something you can quantify to others but I expect it should be visible.
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Old Jul 15, 2012, 10:55 PM
Southern Pride
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Haralson County GA. USA
Joined Oct 2004
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OK explain to me how so,meone wiggles a 20 pound aircraft 30 degess or so or simplie any larger than say 5 foot WS.for that matter.

I do not have any issues and never have. Please remember I was / am a beta tester and posted about excellent Guardian performance months ago. Since John Q has started receiving their's there have been post which complained of extremlty little or even no control surface movement with Guardian enabled .

I believe those who are experiencing issues rather real or just do to lack of understanding wopuld like to have a repaeat means to varify if their unit is functiong correctly and to the extent of a know functioning unit.

Charles
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Old Jul 15, 2012, 11:10 PM
Static Model Collector LOL
Katy, TX
Joined Dec 2009
1,448 Posts
That's a little testy, everyones been following your post and appreciate all of your input on this unit

For those who are having issues I am pretty sure they will iron them out of they go over the manual and do a proper setup

Some also like me did not have the previlage of having a test unit, I doubt you got it right the 1st day

We did not just get up oneday and became experts

My units will arrive shortly, I will do my best to provide other users will advise once I have it installed

FCA
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Old Jul 15, 2012, 11:12 PM
Southern Pride
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Haralson County GA. USA
Joined Oct 2004
34,834 Posts
Quote:
Can't you use the gear switch for gain and set a high and low value in the tx travel settings?
One issue with this is even if it were possible many if not most DX7 electric flyers use the Gear switch for Throttle Lock as the transmitter does not have a built in one,also unless one in fact owns a DX7 it is extremely difficult to appreciate just how limited its' mixing abilities are and that the mix switchs are not freely asignable. Months ago I even tried moving throttle lock mix to the Mix / Rudder Duel Rate Switch so Gear Switch could be used for rates and tried numerious combinations of Gear / Mix / AUx 2 ,started threads requesting help with mixes explaing what I needed as far as output values in the Radio Forum and received extremly little input and sad to say no suggestions which I could manage to get to work for me.

I did find one combination of two position switches which would control the three Gaurdian Modes but problem was both Sw. had to be move in combinations and if one was in the wrong position results could be extremly unpleasent. I did not want to have to be sure of fliping two switches to the correct position under emergency situation.

Charles
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Old Jul 15, 2012, 11:19 PM
Southern Pride
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Haralson County GA. USA
Joined Oct 2004
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Quote:
That's a little testy,
Perhaps but I find unsupported WAGs very counter productive and mostly just thread clutter.

Quote:
everyones been following your post and appreciate all of your input on this unit
I find that most do not in fact read all or even most of the post in a thread but instead only read the last one or two post. Most do not ever even read the first post in a thread which by the way often has the info they seak.

Perhaps I should crawl back under my rock and leave this thread to those with more people's skills.



Charles
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