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Old Jun 15, 2012, 08:26 AM
Blu-Core is my friend
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La Crosse, WI
Joined Apr 2006
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/\ /\ thats what I was just thinking when bungee was brought up.

Later,
Gundy
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Old Jun 15, 2012, 10:03 AM
Southern Pride
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Haralson County GA. USA
Joined Oct 2004
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Quote:
Originally Posted by choochoo22 View Post
I would think you could set up the catapult at a good climb angle, set 3D mode, and launch hands-off. Don't touch it until you get to altitude. Testers, wouldn't this work?
No bungee / canapolts but long ago I posted about hand releases of my Lil Banchee 3D level, nose up 45 degrees ,nose up 80 degrees, upright ,inverted , nose up 45 defgees and tilted ar 30 degrees (semi knife edge) and every angle I could think off other than toward the ground. All these were in 3D and all were perfect launches in up to 15 MPH cross winds.

My Lil Banchee has extremluy light wing lading and without the Guardian I did not fly it in over 6 MPH winds. While testing the Guardian I wanted the wind to blow harder everyday.

I posted that for some flyyers and some aircraft the Guardian was worth its' cost if only used for the first and last 30 seconds of a flight.

I have a Mini Gremlin combat flying wing which can be a real bear to launch in gusty winds and thith the Guardin it is automatic. How much difference does it really make, well I stopped flying the Gremlin until I get the Guardians I have on order as I get tired of replacing $2 props due to bad lauch or an unexpected high gust of wind.
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Old Jun 15, 2012, 02:33 PM
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Joined Nov 2003
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All, the manual is now posted online, here.

Please do let us know if there's anything in the manual that needs clarification, correction, etc. Really anxious to get your feedback on it!
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Old Jun 15, 2012, 03:39 PM
Team JetiUSA
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Santa Clara, CA
Joined Nov 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by billpa View Post
All, the manual is now posted online, here.

Please do let us know if there's anything in the manual that needs clarification, correction, etc. Really anxious to get your feedback on it!
Hi Bill,

Couple of questions come immediately to mind:

1. What's the maximum voltage that the Guardian can handle? Can it handle a full HV setup with a 2S lipo powering the RX + servo electronics and therefore the guardian as well?

2. Only one Elevator servo connection, so dual elevator models need to use a matchbox or something?

3. The diagram on the use of an analog pot on the radio to control stablilization seems reversed to me, wouldn't -100% be on the left and +100% on the right?

Edit: #1, I see it on the last page of the doc now, you should mention it in the main section on voltage and amp handling.

4. On the 5a servo current limit, is that per servo channel or total? A plane with modern digital servos can draw more than 5a in heavily loaded maneuvers involving more than one control surface, particularly if there are many servos (i.e. one for each elevator half) on that control surface.

5. Does it "remember" level in non-volatile memory or does it reset level every time it's powered on?

6. When setting level for a taildragger, should the tail be propped up to present a straight + level flight attitude for the plane?

Peter+
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Old Jun 15, 2012, 08:32 PM
Southern Pride
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Haralson County GA. USA
Joined Oct 2004
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5 Yes it remembers.

6 Wing(s) and stab level so yes prop up the tail.

After initial flight and you do in flight triming with Transmitter you can reset level ,it remembers new trimed positions. This is really easier than adjusting the linkages if it is a touchy 3D aircraft.
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Old Jun 15, 2012, 10:36 PM
Registered User
Honolulu
Joined Jul 2003
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Hi Peter

2. Dual elevator's yes match box. I'm testing using the dual elevators on my jets as tailerons for roll and pitch correction. I have both conventional elevator, and full flying stabs that I will be testing. I have a Skyray F-4D turbine flying with it now and its an awesome unit, I don's see a issue with using it this way.

4. For high loads you can use Y connectors to shunt the power load to your power system, or if your really paranoid like me, use something like the EMS Jomar glitch buster, I know total overkill. But I had it laying around.

Aloha

Duke C.
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Old Jun 16, 2012, 04:04 PM
Static Model Collector LOL
Katy, TX
Joined Dec 2009
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My planes are set up with various Dual rates and trim setting assigned to each flight mode position

Will guardian retain the settings for each flight mode?

Thanks,

FCA
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Old Jun 16, 2012, 08:28 PM
Southern Pride
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Haralson County GA. USA
Joined Oct 2004
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Simple answer yes.

Guardian does not really care what setting you have programed in the Transmitter other that the Gain input if used. It passes the primary flight control from the receiver thru Guardian to the servos and merely modifies these signal as necessary to maintain either 2D (straight and level) or 3D ( last aircraft orientation.)
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Old Jun 16, 2012, 11:04 PM
Registered User
Honolulu
Joined Jul 2003
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Hi Flame747

I found when I was testing 3D direct rate, dual rates worked to adjust response to stick angle which was nice.

With the multiple trims you might have some issues with heading hold modes as you normally would center trims when you start up. Differences in stick position from stored neutral trim in the guardian would be interpreted as new headings / positions to attain which might lead to slow roll, slow pull up etc...

I don't think that the trim would be a issue with 3D direct rate mode.
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Old Jun 17, 2012, 12:27 AM
ancora imparo
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Melbourne, Australia
Joined Jul 2005
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So just to be absolutely clear, Charles. This means the Guardian does not ever change the incoming pulse width that it passes on to the servos if it is not applying corrections derived from the acceleration sensors?

This is certainly not the case for some (many?) single axis gyros and will be a big improvement. It is a source of frustration IMO, particularly on dual servo aileron setups where there is a gyro on one servo but not the other.

Nice to see something specifically designed from the outset for fixed wing rather than heli use.
John

Quote:
Originally Posted by everydayflyer View Post
Simple answer yes.

Guardian does not really care what setting you have programed in the Transmitter other that the Gain input if used. It passes the primary flight control from the receiver thru Guardian to the servos and merely modifies these signal as necessary to maintain either 2D (straight and level) or 3D ( last aircraft orientation.)
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Old Jun 17, 2012, 04:27 AM
Southern Pride
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Haralson County GA. USA
Joined Oct 2004
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Quote:
So just to be absolutely clear, Charles. This means the Guardian does not ever change the incoming pulse width that it passes on to the servos if it is not applying corrections derived from the acceleration sensors?
Correct to the best of my knowledge and based on my experience of real world useage.
I have not owned a O Scope in many years now and I never asked no such question of ET. I was more interested in how it performs not why.
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Last edited by everydayflyer; Jun 17, 2012 at 04:37 AM.
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Old Jun 17, 2012, 04:35 AM
Southern Pride
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Haralson County GA. USA
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Aero65

While I agree with you up to a point how about the simple point that each aircraft will have its' own Guardian 2D/3D and will be setup (intilized) to that Model Memory?

If you move a single Guardan 2D/3D from model to model you will have to reset it with each move. You can use the computer interface to provide a reference for adjusting the Pots. and checking aircraft leve but I can not think of a case where one would use a single Guardian 2D/3S in multi aircraft and not have to alter any of the settings.

I also subscribe to the proper way of setting up an aircraft trim wise and that is to do mechanical adjustment not electronic trims and subtrims. I will on rare occasion make an exception and use minor Sub Trim to get a servo arm at 90 degrees if it can not be mounted other wise and is part of a paired set of servos (split elevator) or a heli swashplate.

IMO to many these days never properly trim their aircraft and you know what with a G 3D/3D many are likely to do even less physical linklage trimming..
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Old Jun 17, 2012, 04:40 AM
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Canada, NS, Halifax
Joined Feb 2010
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I don't want to speak for ET but I recently had a discussion with them on travel adjustment and dual rates so thought this may be useful to share...

Quote:
Ah, this is an interesting problem, because the intuitive solution of limiting the throws on the controller isn’t an option.  The best way to limit your throws with the Guardian is through the PC App.  Under the Servo Config tab, there is an option “Output Servo Ranges Custom” that allows you to specify your max servo throws for each output in microseconds.  Changes made here will apply to any fixed wing configuration and flight mode. 
Quote:
Dual Rates, which I take to describe expanding the servo travels on a model through the controller will not cause any harm when used with the Guardian, but I am of the belief that they are not needed and here’s why.  As you increase the gains on the Guardian, the servo throws are automatically expanded up to 125% of normal (this is the max D/R on a Spektrum radio), unless you specify your own limits in the UI as stated below.  When the model is in flight, all this does is allow the Guardian some extra room to work with in order to stabilize your airframe as well as it can. 
 
In 2D Mode, since by definition you’re not doing aerobatics, the user doesn’t have a need for the higher response of D/R.  That said, if an air pocket or a stall occurs, the Guardian will use full servo deflections to recover as quickly as possible in accordance with your gains and defined endpoints.  So, in other words, D/R is still used, it’s just abstracted away.
 
In 3D Mode, Direct Rate 3D Control will use computed servo throw ratios to give high responsiveness while directly correlating stick movement to angular rate.  The maximum angular rate is specified in the PC App.
 
To sum things up, it has been my experience that the Guardian makes it so you don’t need to worry about your Dual Rates so much as it simply does what it needs to do to get the airframe to perform optimally.  Instead of tweaking your mechanical parameters, you can specify in calibrated angular rates how you want your model to perform.
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Old Jun 17, 2012, 10:59 AM
Registered User
Honolulu
Joined Jul 2003
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Hi Everyday flyer

Quote:
While I agree with you up to a point how about the simple point that each aircraft will have its' own Guardian 2D/3D and will be setup (intilized) to that Model Memory?
True, however Flame747 was asking if he had different trims for different flight modes. In some of the high end computer radios your trims can change (transmitter memory) as you change flight modes. IE: "Takeoff mode", "high-speed", "landing". These different modes could all have different trim settings.

Although thinking about it now that might not be as necessary with a properly tuned Guardian it could make up for some minor trim changes due to speed / configuration.

Quote:
If you move a single Guardan 2D/3D from model to model you will have to reset it with each move. You can use the computer interface to provide a reference for adjusting the Pots. and checking aircraft leve but I can not think of a case where one would use a single Guardian 2D/3S in multi aircraft and not have to alter any of the settings.
Nice feature of the unit, you can reference your old setup so you can replicate it by loading it, nice!

Quote:
I also subscribe to the proper way of setting up an aircraft trim wise and that is to do mechanical adjustment not electronic trims and subtrims. I will on rare occasion make an exception and use minor Sub Trim to get a servo arm at 90 degrees if it can not be mounted other wise and is part of a paired set of servos (split elevator) or a heli swashplate.

IMO to many these days never properly trim their aircraft and you know what with a G 3D/3D many are likely to do even less physical linklage trimming..
I agree, I remember when we were excited to get servo reversing lol. My first radio was a Futaba FP-4L in 1978
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Old Jun 17, 2012, 11:40 AM
Electric baptism 1975
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Vernon, BC, Canada
Joined Dec 2000
2,795 Posts
I have some concern about aileron (range of)movement when landing a warbird. Can low gain be automatically mixed from the gear or landing mode channel?
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