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Old Dec 14, 2012, 01:15 AM
An Aussie in Chicago
Joined Apr 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ImJeffW View Post
I find that once my plane is dialed in I only adjust the gain knob based on the speed I'm flying. My Reno racer does 100 mph+ and I was constantly fiddling with the gain control. Rather than assigning the gain to a POT (knob) I have my gain mixed with throttle position and use a custom curve to set gain end points and lower stabilization at higher speeds. I also set-up a slowed response on down throttle to avoid over-stabilization if I drop the throttle at high speed. It took a little doing, but once set-up my gains are automatic so I don't need to make consent adjustments.
Nice way of doing it
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Old Dec 14, 2012, 04:49 PM
Registered User
United States, KY, Madisonville
Joined Mar 2011
550 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by ImJeffW View Post
I find that once my plane is dialed in I only adjust the gain knob based on the speed I'm flying. My Reno racer does 100 mph+ and I was constantly fiddling with the gain control. Rather than assigning the gain to a POT (knob) I have my gain mixed with throttle position and use a custom curve to set gain end points and lower stabilization at higher speeds. I also set-up a slowed response on down throttle to avoid over-stabilization if I drop the throttle at high speed. It took a little doing, but once set-up my gains are automatic so I don't need to make consent adjustments.
Care to share settings?
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Old Dec 15, 2012, 05:15 PM
Your customer
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Berkley, MI
Joined Dec 2009
1,408 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jakethedog View Post
Thanks for the response when the unit is on (plugged in) I have no led light even if I switch from 2d off and 3d 2d being down on the three position switch , and yes I considered it working because when I move the plane around it response to the movement with no light , I did black out my garage to insure that the light was not just dim. I flew it a couple hours ago it seemed to respond to what ever what I put it through for the exception with the switch in the up position didnt seem to get much correction. My understanding is 3d is the up position and I really didn't see much help from it when in flight thanks again for your help I hope I answered the question George
Hi George,

Please email EagleTree directly for technical support. You may need to send in your unit so they can inspect it thoroughly. No one else here seems to have experienced the same thing....at the moment.
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Old Dec 15, 2012, 11:36 PM
Rick
United States, CA, Santa Clara
Joined Mar 2011
2,196 Posts
I can see why people new to the Guardian sometimes get confused or have trouble. I have been reading and contributing to this thread since last spring and I still found some behavior I can't sort out.

Has anyone noticed creep/drift in their Guardians? I have one unit which, no matter how many times I reset it, exhibits creep in both modes. In 3D the rudder slowly creeps left, it would probably take two minutes to reach full deflection. In 2D the rudder is fine but the heading very slowly creeps left, evidenced by the ailerons. If left to do so, it would probably take 10 min to fly a full circle. Neither of these has much impact in the air, the rudder is constantly being reset by any stick movement and the heading creep is too slow to notice. Still, it's disappointing that these can't be eliminated.

Another unit does not exhibit this creep but seems to perceive major trim settings that aren't actually present during the first few seconds after connecting the battery. If the Guardian is in either mode when powered up or is switched on in the first couple of seconds, it drives all three channels to the stops. This effect fades away in about 10 sec. To do a reset, it's necessary to wait as long as possible in the 15 sec window or the imaginary trims will mess up the setting.

Has anyone else experienced problems like these? I'm not completely convinced that these symptoms are being caused by the Guardians but I haven't been able to identify any external problems either.
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Old Dec 16, 2012, 12:20 AM
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Prof100's Avatar
Canton, Michigan USA
Joined Jul 2007
16,653 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by choochoo22 View Post
I can see why people new to the Guardian sometimes get confused or have trouble. I have been reading and contributing to this thread since last spring and I still found some behavior I can't sort out.

Has anyone noticed creep/drift in their Guardians? I have one unit which, no matter how many times I reset it, exhibits creep in both modes. In 3D the rudder slowly creeps left, it would probably take two minutes to reach full deflection. In 2D the rudder is fine but the heading very slowly creeps left, evidenced by the ailerons. If left to do so, it would probably take 10 min to fly a full circle. Neither of these has much impact in the air, the rudder is constantly being reset by any stick movement and the heading creep is too slow to notice. Still, it's disappointing that these can't be eliminated.

Another unit does not exhibit this creep but seems to perceive major trim settings that aren't actually present during the first few seconds after connecting the battery. If the Guardian is in either mode when powered up or is switched on in the first couple of seconds, it drives all three channels to the stops. This effect fades away in about 10 sec. To do a reset, it's necessary to wait as long as possible in the 15 sec window or the imaginary trims will mess up the setting.

Has anyone else experienced problems like these? I'm not completely convinced that these symptoms are being caused by the Guardians but I haven't been able to identify any external problems either.
Yes, there is some creep drift in the four that I fly. I don't worry about it. It only means there is only so much you can expect out of a $75 system.

I always connect the battery with the Guardian off and then turn it on. I used to have the surfaces drive to max until I limited the servo throws in the Guardian.

Bill
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Old Dec 16, 2012, 01:21 AM
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USA, KS, Derby
Joined Mar 2003
1,476 Posts
I never experience any creep/drift in my 2 units but I also make sure the model is acclimated to the sorrounding where I am flying., for at least 10 minutes, before I power it ON. Not sure if that helps but just an old habit when dealing with electronics and gyros.
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Old Dec 16, 2012, 01:38 AM
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m_beeson's Avatar
United States, UT
Joined Jan 2011
3,411 Posts
With Guardian expander,
Heading hold feature will make the control surfaces travel to their endpoints.

If you hit the sticks, they will seek neutral, until you move the model sideways, tilt it, or move it backwards. then you hit the sticks and it seeks neutral again.

Other people like that mode, but it gives me the creeps, so I keep heading hold off...



Also:

another thing to consider with creep and drift, is if you are using a foam airframe, it will change shape with different temperatures.

This could cause the symptoms that you describe.


Quote:
Originally Posted by choochoo22 View Post
I can see why people new to the Guardian sometimes get confused or have trouble. I have been reading and contributing to this thread since last spring and I still found some behavior I can't sort out.

Has anyone noticed creep/drift in their Guardians? I have one unit which, no matter how many times I reset it, exhibits creep in both modes. In 3D the rudder slowly creeps left, it would probably take two minutes to reach full deflection. In 2D the rudder is fine but the heading very slowly creeps left, evidenced by the ailerons. If left to do so, it would probably take 10 min to fly a full circle. Neither of these has much impact in the air, the rudder is constantly being reset by any stick movement and the heading creep is too slow to notice. Still, it's disappointing that these can't be eliminated.

Another unit does not exhibit this creep but seems to perceive major trim settings that aren't actually present during the first few seconds after connecting the battery. If the Guardian is in either mode when powered up or is switched on in the first couple of seconds, it drives all three channels to the stops. This effect fades away in about 10 sec. To do a reset, it's necessary to wait as long as possible in the 15 sec window or the imaginary trims will mess up the setting.

Has anyone else experienced problems like these? I'm not completely convinced that these symptoms are being caused by the Guardians but I haven't been able to identify any external problems either.
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Old Dec 16, 2012, 08:14 AM
Southern Pride
everydayflyer's Avatar
Haralson County GA. USA
Joined Oct 2004
34,839 Posts
Quote:
With Guardian expander,
Heading hold feature will make the control surfaces travel to their endpoints.


This is the Guardian 2D /3D stabilization thread which often gets confused with othe Eagle Tree devices.
Thre Guardian 2D/3D is a stand alone device and does not support at present the advanced feactures of other ET device used in FPVC.


Charles
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Last edited by everydayflyer; Dec 18, 2012 at 09:33 AM.
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Old Dec 16, 2012, 09:45 AM
GOTTA FLY STRIGHT UP
WILLIAM M's Avatar
United States, FL, Lake City
Joined Jun 2012
366 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by ImJeffW View Post
I find that once my plane is dialed in I only adjust the gain knob based on the speed I'm flying. My Reno racer does 100 mph+ and I was constantly fiddling with the gain control. Rather than assigning the gain to a POT (knob) I have my gain mixed with throttle position and use a custom curve to set gain end points and lower stabilization at higher speeds. I also set-up a slowed response on down throttle to avoid over-stabilization if I drop the throttle at high speed. It took a little doing, but once set-up my gains are automatic so I don't need to make consent adjustments.

ImJeffW

I have just installed a 2D3D In my Senior Sportwin http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...767479&page=14
I have a fataba 10c TX and was wondering if anybody knows if this mixing can be done on it??
Since my plane is in the 100mph class. I need to adjust the gain with the slide lever on the left side of the TX .

Bill
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Old Dec 16, 2012, 01:54 PM
Sopwith Camel's Cousin
Between my tx and crashed aircraft
Joined Mar 2006
3,803 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by choochoo22 View Post
I can see why people new to the Guardian sometimes get confused or have trouble. I have been reading and contributing to this thread since last spring and I still found some behavior I can't sort out.

Has anyone noticed creep/drift in their Guardians? I have one unit which, no matter how many times I reset it, exhibits creep in both modes. In 3D the rudder slowly creeps left, it would probably take two minutes to reach full deflection. In 2D the rudder is fine but the heading very slowly creeps left, evidenced by the ailerons. If left to do so, it would probably take 10 min to fly a full circle. Neither of these has much impact in the air, the rudder is constantly being reset by any stick movement and the heading creep is too slow to notice. Still, it's disappointing that these can't be eliminated.
....
From what I have read about single-axis (tail) gyros for heli's, this slow creep in head holding mode is fairly common in gyros. The usual solution was to either buy a more expensive head holding gyro (over US$100 for a single-axis gyro) or just put-up with the slow drift.

Quote:
Originally Posted by m_beeson View Post
...
another thing to consider with creep and drift, is if you are using a foam airframe, it will change shape with different temperatures.
....
This I have experienced, as well as gyro drift from temperature changes (a heli that is warming-up while flying, or falling temperatures with sunset).
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Old Dec 16, 2012, 03:06 PM
Rick
United States, CA, Santa Clara
Joined Mar 2011
2,196 Posts
Thanks guys. I guess you're right that that there is only so much you can expect. It doesn't seem like temperature could be a factor though. The planes are stored in my garage and the observations were made in the garage on a table not touching the plane after the battery is plugged in.
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Old Dec 16, 2012, 03:36 PM
FPV junkie
m_beeson's Avatar
United States, UT
Joined Jan 2011
3,411 Posts
I'm not confused, but if you feel that this is not a posibility, then disreguard it as being a possibility.

-Mike

Quote:
Originally Posted by everydayflyer View Post
This is the Guardian 2D /3D stabilization thread which often gets confused with othe Ragle Tree devices.
Thre Guardian 2D/3D is a stand alone device and does not support at present the advanced feactures of other ET device used in FPVC.


Charles
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Old Dec 16, 2012, 04:58 PM
Registered User
Discovery Bay, Calif
Joined Mar 2006
20 Posts
I now have two quotes printed out above my desk

"We make a living with what we get. We make a life with what we give."
Churchill
“I'm not confused, but if you feel that this is not a possibility, then disregard it as being a possibility”
Mike m_beeson RCGroups
Mike is it OK to quote you?
Keith
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Old Dec 16, 2012, 05:13 PM
Your customer
Silverexpress's Avatar
Berkley, MI
Joined Dec 2009
1,408 Posts
Like what others have already stated - what I've read and experienced is the same with hh gyros

The creep in HH can be caused by...

1. The system senses a minute rotation and starts adding a correction. It continues to do this expecting feedback - roll, pitch, and or yaw. It will continue to add more correction until it senses the counter rotation or the servos reach their limit or you switch to rate and back or you move and then recenter the sticks. The latter two sets or resets a new heading

2. User added trim.

3. No dead band.

Whats interesting is that the AS3x is the only system with software I know that keeps the system off until you increase the throttle.

More primitive alghorthims make it detrimental to rog and takeoff in HH. Not so with the Guardian.
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Old Dec 16, 2012, 05:40 PM
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Galand's Avatar
Long Island, NY
Joined May 2010
1,615 Posts
USB Connector

Bad crash yesterday. Something slammed into the front of the Guardian and broke loose the USB connector from the board.
Cut open the celluloid to have a look at how this could be fixed.
It looks like a combination of two crimp and maybe two solder points.
Beyond my capabilities. What a poor setup!
Is this a lost cause?
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