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Old Feb 15, 2012, 12:38 AM
RobertTHaas
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Elf dlg was stolen design of a 2010 concept of the thermal spec micro

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Old Feb 15, 2012, 12:41 AM
RobertTHaas
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Old Feb 15, 2012, 12:44 AM
M Seid
Solana Beach, Ca
Joined Sep 2006
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Just when things were closing up quietly for the night.....

A quote from Othello...

Good name in man and woman, dear my lord,
Is the immediate jewel of their souls.
Who steals my purse steals trash; 'tis something, nothing;
'Twas mine, 'tis his, and has been slave to thousands;
But he that filches from me my good name
Robs me of that which not enriches him,
And makes me poor indeed.


I was also thinking of saying.... "Ahhh, fellow scotch drinker! rejoice!"
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Old Feb 15, 2012, 05:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M Seid View Post
Just when things were closing up quietly for the night.....

A quote from Othello...

Good name in man and woman, dear my lord,
Is the immediate jewel of their souls.
Who steals my purse steals trash; 'tis something, nothing;
'Twas mine, 'tis his, and has been slave to thousands;
But he that filches from me my good name
Robs me of that which not enriches him,
And makes me poor indeed.


I was also thinking of saying.... "Ahhh, fellow scotch drinker! rejoice!"
Othello has the correct approach and so have you Michael, and since we're not for conflict inflation, let me just add : Amen and Cheers (for the scotchdrinkers)

Yves
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Old Feb 15, 2012, 11:58 AM
Yes..ok..maybe..lol.....
Tucson Avra Valley, Arizona, United States
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Believe me ..the Elf flies much better then your Thermal spec....
dave
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Old Feb 15, 2012, 02:40 PM
let's FLY!
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Old Feb 15, 2012, 04:40 PM
hass-alfed and bass-ackwards
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United States, AZ, Chandler
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Of course it is. Carbon D-Box w/ monokote covering, and we all know Vlad couldn't make a good plane on his own.
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Old Feb 15, 2012, 06:25 PM
launch low, fly high
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Looks to me like Drela gets "prior art" credits...

http://www.charlesriverrc.org/articl...apogee40Mb.pdf

His plans are from 2001.

It appears that Vladimir applied the same construction processes that are on his planes such as the Organic, Ava, etc. to an Apogee style airframe. The original Elf design even had a v tail very similar to the Apogee, but converted to a cruciform tail a few months after the introduction of the Elf.
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Old Feb 15, 2012, 10:24 PM
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Jeez,

I was flying my mini-G long before that.

Apogee derived, of course.

Gary
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Old Feb 16, 2012, 02:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GaryO View Post
Jeez,

I was flying my mini-G long before that.

Apogee derived, of course.

Gary
Ray Charles could rock long before they named it rock and roll. Simply because that's what he does
Donald Fagen What I Do (0 min 0 sec)
.

Same goes for Mark the eternal Drela for his generous contribution laying the basis for the modern DLG concept, and the Supergee being cloned by all until the 12th of never.

And of course let's not forget Wolfgang the eternal Zach in Austria.

Look at the positive side : who would have suspected Othello to be involved in DLG ? Next thing we read is Oscar Wilde this and that ...

Cool is the rule,

Yves
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Old Feb 17, 2012, 06:49 PM
RobertTHaas
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THE PLAN WAS TO HAVE A MOLDED ELLIPTICAL D-TUBE SPARE AND A VACUUM FORMED POD.. This was discussed with the last individual to pick up a prototype. I showed him the CAD drawings, he was interested in getting it built.. I dont know if its just a coincidence, as such things have happened many times over.. THOSE WERE THE PLANS.. My apologies.. Im very impressed with the ELF.. Just a bit frustrating to see almost exactly what you had intended to create come to pass.. It seemed the only way to make the things cost efficient was to create a vacuum formed pod.. anyways, i have about 50+ CAD drawings of all different types of TSM glider concepts.. Forgive me.. Cheers to the ELF... I guess everyone has contributed something...
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Old Feb 17, 2012, 07:57 PM
a.k.a. Matt Nelson
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The few pictures I saw of the TSM showed a structural pod, with a boom attached to it via bulkheads and formers. Servos and radio gear is supported by the pod former, and the wing is attached to the pod atop a pylon - much like a Supergee. I've attached some of your pictures from the FS/W section for reference. If there were other designs, they don't seem to have been published - the attached pics are pretty much all I could find in this forum.

The Elf is quite different - the pod is only an aerodynamic fairing - the boom goes all the way from the tail to the tip of the nose, with the radio gear attached directly to a flattened section of the boom itself. The wing bolts directly to the boom as well. Again, see the attached pic from the kennedy composites website.

As for the wing, they both are carbon d-box with carbon capped ribs and light transparent covering. Lots of planes have been built that way for a long time (Photon, etc).

I understand the frustration of seeing ideas "stolen", but its really tough to make a compelling argument that this is one of those cases. These two planes are pretty obviously using rather different fundamental approaches.
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Old Feb 17, 2012, 08:26 PM
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I dont follow

What is this thread about? Sorry but I am unable to connect the dots.

What was "stolen"
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Old Feb 17, 2012, 11:23 PM
launch low, fly high
New Zealand, Hawke's Bay, Havelock North
Joined Dec 2004
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Vacuum formed micro DLG pods circa 2004 (got this link from an RCG thread):
http://homepage3.nifty.com/nono3/rc/...isal/index.htm

The Elf that I received last year in Sweden has an injection molded plastic pod with details for the bolt on wing, and a slide on nose cone. It is not a vacuum formed pod.

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/attac...mentid=3387014
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Last edited by Joe W; Feb 17, 2012 at 11:26 PM. Reason: add link to elf pod picture
Old Feb 17, 2012, 11:59 PM
M Seid
Solana Beach, Ca
Joined Sep 2006
3,151 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Air Head View Post
What is this thread about? Sorry but I am unable to connect the dots.

What was "stolen"
Much ado about nothing.
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