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Old Feb 17, 2012, 01:21 PM
LiPo-Sucker & Airframe EMT
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Charlottesville, Virginia, USA
Joined Aug 2010
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Originally Posted by Devin McGRath View Post
.....Please excuse my poor explanation.....
Makes sense to me!

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Old Feb 17, 2012, 01:23 PM
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USA, WA, Bremerton
Joined Mar 2009
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So Devin, How do you like the plane overall?
Keith
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Old Feb 17, 2012, 01:23 PM
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Canada
Joined Aug 2009
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No mine didn't come this week either

Oh well; im hoping the delay means I'll get one of the good ones lol


Would those added fine slow the plane down?
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Old Feb 17, 2012, 01:33 PM
Heli collector
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United States, MI, Livonia
Joined Apr 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Devin McGRath View Post
That is correct but you have to look at why it is tail heavy at that point it is tail heavy because the elevator is no longer acting like a lifting surface. The center of lift is just as important as the center of gravity. You are changing the center of lift while in flight so drasticly that you would have to add a ton of nose weight to compensate and then you have another problem. You are flying around 99.9% of the time with an airplane that is unhappily nose heavy

Also The ventral fins because of there angle in relation to the direction of flight, help to push the airplane back into its normal AOA when you have gone to far.

Please excuse my poor explanation typeing on your phone never comes across correctly.


Devin McGrath

Sent from my android
You miss my point that to be a selfstablizing plane the stab should be pushing the tail down not lifting it up. Your way is fine if you have a computer actually flying the plane and you are only asking the computer to have the plane do what you want as the computer can figure out what's needed faster than I can standing on the ground looking at the plane.

Now I bet the HH Mig 15 will be able to get away with being tail heavy.. As some of us have found out the GP Saber can't..
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Old Feb 17, 2012, 01:55 PM
Team Futaba
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Rochester New York
Joined Oct 2004
940 Posts
Keith, I really like my F86 its my first EDF of this size and Its allot of fun. I leave it in my car now just in case next to my mini mx3!

Razor, I really haven't noticed it being slowed down by them.


Bob, I guess I don't really fallow what you mean. You prefer your elevator to not be a lifting surface? because that is all I am saying is that the elevator is a lifting surface and with that lifting surface not contributing to the balance of the airplane (center of gravity and center of lift) at a certain point that balance is no longer correct. No amount of nose weight can change this.



Devin McGrath

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Old Feb 17, 2012, 01:56 PM
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United States, CO, Longmont
Joined Nov 2011
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Originally Posted by livonia bob View Post
I'm going to try this first,,, I don't care for planes that use the elevator to hold the nose down I like mine to be used to hold the nose up,, that way if the elevator gets blanked out by the wing the nose will drop and pick up speed lowing the AOA and regaining flying speed and not pitch up into a stall..

On my scale stock battery is 13.47g, Hyperion 240 is 16.08g and the HK 400 is 22.78g.

Yes the canopy still fits.. CG isn't really moved that much but I'm still checking it..
Looking forward to your flight with the 400mah lipo
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Old Feb 17, 2012, 02:13 PM
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United States, MI, Livonia
Joined Apr 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Devin McGRath View Post
Keith, I really like my F86 its my first EDF of this size and Its allot of fun. I leave it in my car now just in case next to my mini mx3!

Razor, I really haven't noticed it being slowed down by them.


Bob, I guess I don't really fallow what you mean. You prefer your elevator to not be a lifting surface? because that is all I am saying is that the elevator is a lifting surface and with that lifting surface not contributing to the balance of the airplane (center of gravity and center of lift) at a certain point that balance is no longer correct. No amount of nose weight can change this.



Devin McGrath

Sent from my Android
YES you are right I don't want my horizontal stabilizer to be a lifting surface but a pushing down one, the more I push down the higher the AOA of the main wing and the more lift. If it stops pushing down because the airflow is blocked by the wing then the nose goes down and no stall. The way you control if it's a lifting or pushing one is by the location of the CG on the plane.

Now for controlling the plane you use the elevator to decrease the down force which lifts the tail and lowers the wings AOA and the plane will go down.. To make the plane go up you increase the down force forcing the tail down which increases the wings AOA and the plane will climb.

This is why canards are more efficient flying machines as they do use it for lift along with the wing, If the canard stalls it drops the nose.
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Old Feb 17, 2012, 02:54 PM
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after all this reading, it looks like flying Jets is much different that what I'm used to!
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Old Feb 17, 2012, 03:49 PM
Just some guy
D Johnson's Avatar
Joined Aug 2006
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Just keep the nose down till the speeds up!
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Old Feb 17, 2012, 04:42 PM
Team Futaba
Devin McGRath's Avatar
Rochester New York
Joined Oct 2004
940 Posts
I think we are getting a little off topic.

Keep the nose down till the speed is up is good advice and if you care to try it out try the ventral fins they have worked well for me

Also I have flown my f86 with a number of packs even as small as 180mah a few grams lighter than stock.


Devin McGrath

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Old Feb 17, 2012, 06:40 PM
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United States, MI, Livonia
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Well this one was pilot error I guess, one minute the sun was behind the clouds next it wasn't.. I wear Transitions grasses that self darken but when looking right into the sun everything turns into a gray reflection in front of my eyes, I can't see a thing if it's down in the tree line..

Good thing the F-86 came in a nice box to put all the pieces in for the trip home..

But till the end I was very happy with it,, it was flying with the feel that a jet should have a nice and smooth/firm feeling. I need to increase the elevator throws now as it's no longer jumpy like it was before with the lighter battery....

Untitled (2 min 49 sec)
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Old Feb 17, 2012, 07:21 PM
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Originally Posted by livonia bob View Post
Well this one was pilot error I guess, one minute the sun was behind the clouds next it wasn't.. I wear Transitions grasses that self darken but when looking right into the sun everything turns into a gray reflection in front of my eyes, I can't see a thing if it's down in the tree line..

Good thing the F-86 came in a nice box to put all the pieces in for the trip home..

But till the end I was very happy with it,, it was flying with the feel that a jet should have a nice and smooth/firm feeling. I need to increase the elevator throws now as it's no longer jumpy like it was before with the lighter battery....

http://vimeo.com/36997295


Oh man!
dang sun...

how do you think that bigger lipo do for you?
thanks
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Old Feb 17, 2012, 07:35 PM
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The woods
Joined Feb 2011
104 Posts
OK finally got my anylink cable made and working with my dx7. I am noticing the elevator is lifting both surfaces differently causing it to roll like ailerons. Has any one else noted this with there's?
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Old Feb 17, 2012, 07:35 PM
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Indianapolis, IN
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Man Bob you can't catch a break, sounds like you liked how it was fly for you, minus the weak elevator rate.
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Old Feb 17, 2012, 07:51 PM
Heli collector
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United States, MI, Livonia
Joined Apr 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brushless55 View Post
Oh man!
dang sun...

how do you think that bigger lipo do for you?
thanks
I'm getting ready right now to make up another one... If that tells you anything.. But keep in mind what I want this plane to fly like might not be what others are looking for.. I want a smooth flier that can do scale like flight and loops and stuff on days where I wouldn't fly a lot of my other stuff because of the wind. So I needed a plane that was set up and balance right for this type of flying.. Where before I had to use low rates and a lot of EXPO as it was to jumpy between wanting to dive or climb it just didn't track good at all, now it's on rails.. Just the way I want my jets to fly.. It has a nice feel to it but needs to get back to a more normal elevator throw now so I'll set up L=85 and H=100 for the next flight..




I also flew the Champ a couple of times today doing in-place flight, also flew the Fokker Dr-1 but that was a mistake to windy for it and I was screwing around to much with it having fun,, it make a hard landing OK it wasn't planned to be a landing at all, knocked the battery off but took of again with it dangling by the wire to fly it closer to me and the wind got it and flipped it over hard. This knocked some landing gear struts loose and the top wing inner struts.. You know that if those struts aren't attached to the wing that the wing flutters up and down really neat??

Not a Great day for my Great Planes planes. The Champ is sleeping in her box in the back of the truck the F-86 has been repaired and the fuselage washed out inside as it was packed with grit and mud.. I'm going to make up another 400mAh battery and then glue up the Fokker..
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