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Old Sep 17, 2012, 07:17 PM
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livonia bob's Avatar
United States, MI, Livonia
Joined Apr 2009
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Originally Posted by Valkpilot View Post
Already fixed, and had the battery velcroed as far forward as possible
Are you using the 250 size battery? Was it held in place with Velcro? Did you check the CG as per the correct way?? Did you have the Dime under the battery??
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Old Sep 17, 2012, 08:50 PM
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Originally Posted by livonia bob View Post
Are you using the 250 size battery? Was it held in place with Velcro? Did you check the CG as per the correct way?? Did you have the Dime under the battery??
Stock battery that came with it, yes, though it was the wafer and not the clear you guys mentioned, yes, no president Roosevelt was not on board.
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Old Sep 17, 2012, 10:15 PM
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eltreato's Avatar
Canada, BC, Vancouver
Joined Oct 2011
547 Posts
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Originally Posted by Valkpilot View Post
Stock battery that came with it, yes, though it was the wafer and not the clear you guys mentioned, yes, no president Roosevelt was not on board.
So it was your maiden wasn't it? You were tail heavy. When i got mine it came with a crappy 200mah battery that puffed after the third charge. It was way too light even full forward and I suspect your battery isn't much better. I use Hobbyking 180mahs now with a quarter velcroed on them and it is perfect. Try doing the c of g and you'll be all set.
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Old Sep 19, 2012, 10:50 AM
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tware's Avatar
Little Rock, AR
Joined Nov 2005
254 Posts
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Originally Posted by Valkpilot View Post
Has anyone else had problems with the F-86 and the Anylink? I'm using a DX6i, and haven't
had any problems flying any other aircraft that utilized the TR624 rx. Has me contemplating on purchasing the Tactic TTX402 4-Channel SLT 2.4GHz Mini Transmitter, which is the one that comes with the RTF version.
why wouldnt you buy the OrangeRX 410 instead? couldnt be easier. On that note, I have an spare Anylink and Tactic RX if anyone needs it.
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Old Sep 21, 2012, 06:17 PM
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Originally Posted by eltreato View Post
So it was your maiden wasn't it? You were tail heavy. When i got mine it came with a crappy 200mah battery that puffed after the third charge. It was way too light even full forward and I suspect your battery isn't much better. I use Hobbyking 180mahs now with a quarter velcroed on them and it is perfect. Try doing the c of g and you'll be all set.
I'll try the quarter thing with my Anylink. Thanx.
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Old Sep 21, 2012, 06:19 PM
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Originally Posted by tware View Post
why wouldnt you buy the OrangeRX 410 instead? couldnt be easier. On that note, I have an spare Anylink and Tactic RX if anyone needs it.
Because there seems to be more negative reports on the Oranges, and
my HK dealings haven't been too great either.
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Old Sep 21, 2012, 06:50 PM
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United States, MI, Livonia
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Originally Posted by Valkpilot View Post
I'll try the quarter thing with my Anylink. Thanx.
Make sure you are using the correct CG location this one. Measured from the bottom. NOT what the printed instructions say from theTOP.

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...postcount=1273
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Old Sep 21, 2012, 07:19 PM
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barmonkey's Avatar
Evansville, Indiana
Joined Jan 2005
1,576 Posts
So you arre saying the CG needs to be measured right-side up rather than inverted as most low wing warbirds are?
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Old Sep 21, 2012, 07:27 PM
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livonia bob's Avatar
United States, MI, Livonia
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Originally Posted by barmonkey View Post
So you arre saying the CG needs to be measured right-side up rather than inverted as most low wing warbirds are?
No I'm saying that it has to be measured upside down as in the picture in the link. This is a Photoshop one.. NOT as the GP instructions say with it right side up.. UNLESS they have changed the instruction book. Check your manual that came with the plane as see if the instructions are the same as what I posted..

But either way the plane will still want to flip over, nose going up if you slow it down to much. But with the more forward CG it happens a lot less and at a lower air speed.. BUT with a to forward CG and you can't get a good flare on landing..
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Old Sep 21, 2012, 07:46 PM
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Evansville, Indiana
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Thanks for the clarification...for a moment I thought that I was measuring it wrong. I will definitely check the CG before the re-maiden!
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Old Dec 06, 2012, 09:29 PM
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Nitro, WV, 25143
Joined Apr 2001
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Mine does the nose up thing too. Hasn't caused a crash yet, they are usually high. What I've noticed is that I have to cut the power to bring the nose down, if I pour the power on, it just keeps pointing upwards. It usually happens on a 5+ second upline with plenty of speed. Loose control authority and it just wallows nose up til I cut power, recovery takes me about 15 feet of altitude. It seems to happen at higher throttle, as it doesn't do it at lower throttle. It's pretty weird, but to me pretty predictable. The behavior IS scale, it was known as the "Sabre Dance" to USAF pilots. According to the article I read, the wings tip stall, are behind the CG, and as they fail to produce lift, yet the inner wings still flying and producing lift ahead of CG, the plane will pitch nose up. To recover, you must stall the inner wing, hence cut power. It's not an airspeed or power thing, it's angle of attack. Mine does it on extended 45 degree uplines. The official full size recovery is to apply full power, full opposite rudder, and slam the nose down.

F-86s were notorious for doing this, and apparently so is our model. The F-100 was supposedly in FULL afterburner during this wreck.

Here is a F-100 Super Sabre doing the Sabre dance into a crash...

F-100 Super Sabre Jet Crash (0 min 6 sec)


Another view and article.

http://www.historynet.com/deadly-sabre-dance.htm

It snap stalled today. All of the sudden the plane fell out of a turn and spiraled at the ground. Took about 3 rotations before I realized what had happened and recovered. What I learned, when you bank and yank you have to kick the throttle.

What is happening to our planes is as the wingtips stall, the lifting center gets shifted forwards due to the sweep, and dynamically, we now have a severe tail heavy condition. You can't adjust it out with weights or CG shifts, you just have to cope with it. I've seen it said that the F-86 had problems going low and slow, so we don't go low or slow.
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Old Dec 07, 2012, 12:20 AM
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Canada, BC, Vancouver
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My Sabre would nose up when I applied hard throttle until i got the cg setup properly by throwing a quarter in with my 180mah Nanotechs.
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Old Dec 07, 2012, 01:09 AM
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Nitro, WV, 25143
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Originally Posted by eltreato View Post
My Sabre would nose up when I applied hard throttle until i got the cg setup properly by throwing a quarter in with my 180mah Nanotechs.
This is different. This is seemingly random. I usually don't notice it, until I'm trying to come out of an upline, notice that the elevator, ailerons and rudder aren't responsive, then the nose points straight up and wallows. Cutting power and falling resumes command authority.

A quarter in mine and I can't get the nose to rise in flight. A dime and it's tail heavy and won't fly, a penny works a charm in mine.
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Old Dec 07, 2012, 09:25 PM
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USA, WA, Bremerton
Joined Mar 2009
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There were all kinds of aircraft in the US's arsenal during the early jet age that had this problem. On some planes like the F-100 and F84F it was so severe it was non recoverable below 10,000 feet! The pilots manual stated that the only way to recover from this type of "Super Stall" was to actually deploy the drouge shute used for landing. This would slow the plane down and lower the nose. Our little sabre sometimes exibits this tendency and we loose control authority at lower speeds, then pitches up causing the wings to block any remaining elevator control you have left. So Keep your speed up!!! Avoid making sudden changes to the planes angle of attack at relatively low speeds. (i.e. speeds where you have already determined the control authority is lacking. these are jets there is no prop wash over the controls) Good Luck.
I also have a penny taped under the canopy of mine.
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Old Dec 08, 2012, 11:41 AM
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Nitro, WV, 25143
Joined Apr 2001
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I can recover, it hasn't caused a crash yet. My recovery is to pull throttle back, stall the rest of the wing and recover from a normal stall. The plane will fall backwards for a few feet, but as it gains speed, the nose will come around, and it will be in a straight dive, that you can level out. When the nose comes down, add power back and when back to flying speed (about 10 feet) pull out.

Of course, you have to have altitude, just like any other stall recovery.

I also noticed that entering stalls at slower speeds, the plane doesn't exhibit this behavior. My guess is that at higher speeds, the airflow across the bottom of the wing separates from the undercamber and at lower speeds it does not separate. At slower speeds it just mushes forward, as expected, unless you hit rudder, then you get a spin. Entering the stall from higher speeds and you get the Sabre dance.
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