HobbyKing.com New Products Flash Sale
Reply
Thread Tools
Old Nov 18, 2012, 08:22 AM
Guz
Gutless wonder
Guz's Avatar
Tempe, AZ
Joined Dec 2005
3,132 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by breakwater View Post
One of my dreams for this class has been that someone took the lines plans from larger boats, and scaled them to the 50/800 platform.
They would look pretty, but from an aeronautical perspective scaling down doesn't work well. Reynolds numbers and such.
Quote:
Originally Posted by martin richards View Post
Or you could work from the other end and scale up by 2:1 the wealth of RG65 designs available.
Oddly enough, scaling up does work from an aeronautical perspective. Go figure
Guz is offline Find More Posts by Guz
Reply With Quote
Sign up now
to remove ads between posts
Old Nov 18, 2012, 08:58 AM
Registered User
United States, MA, Wenham
Joined Jan 2007
1,409 Posts
[QUOTE=Guz;23298604]They would look pretty, but from an aeronautical perspective scaling down doesn't work well. Reynolds numbers and such.

Sure, You might have to manipulate the design a little bit. Just like the AMYA J-Class added a 2" keel extention over scale for sailing qualities.
The Sail area wouldn't scale exacly to 800 sq inches either....

So what that's not to say it can't be done.




Imagine a M-Class race with every single J-Boat, Every single 12 Meter, IODs, a few Madcaps, etc etc etc...

Just a dream I guess.
breakwater is online now Find More Posts by breakwater
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 18, 2012, 09:08 AM
Registered User
United States, MA, Wenham
Joined Jan 2007
1,409 Posts
[QUOTE=Guz;23298604]They would look pretty, but from an aeronautical perspective scaling down doesn't work well. Reynolds numbers and such.
/QUOTE]


The only thing that would acutally matter would be the scaled boats Vs a non-scaled.

A boat designed to sail at 50" (I.E. the Madcap) should excell in comparison to those scaled down to 50".
But, a plan scaled to 50" and properly manipulated for sailing qualities (Keel Extention) would be pretty darn cool, and I'd bet sail pretty well. There are a few classes that have done this. AMYA J being one of them.
breakwater is online now Find More Posts by breakwater
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 18, 2012, 01:13 PM
Registered User
Dick L.'s Avatar
Minnesota, USA
Joined Aug 2002
2,055 Posts
The RG-65 is a class that was scaled "down" from the Marblehead class - just an FYI, - so scaling back up to it's original size might prove to be workable.
Dick L. is offline Find More Posts by Dick L.
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 18, 2012, 09:09 PM
Registered User
Joined Jan 2006
562 Posts
Only problem is a doubled rg-65 is a 16 lb M. Not really where the designs are today. Fwiw I am building a double sized Doppler to be used as a vane M in the SF fleet which has a 15 lb minimum weight.
slotracer577 is offline Find More Posts by slotracer577
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 19, 2012, 08:39 AM
Registered User
Wick Smith's Avatar
United States, MI, Grosse Pointe Woods
Joined Aug 2011
42 Posts
Ted has a point.

In Detroit we have 23 Marbleheads. Only a few are registared. The group here sails as a limited class and has no inerest in traveling or spending the money to be competative.

Also, does anyone have any comments on Stanley's last AMYA article. Are there truely no USA manufaturers left? If there was, is anyone interested in new boats anymore? Or is the class just sailing locally with whatever they can get used.
Wick Smith is offline Find More Posts by Wick Smith
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 19, 2012, 11:54 AM
Registered User
United States, MA, Wenham
Joined Jan 2007
1,409 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wick Smith View Post
Ted has a point.

In Detroit we have 23 Marbleheads. Only a few are registared. The group here sails as a limited class and has no inerest in traveling or spending the money to be competative.

Also, does anyone have any comments on Stanley's last AMYA article. Are there truely no USA manufaturers left? If there was, is anyone interested in new boats anymore? Or is the class just sailing locally with whatever they can get used.
Wick, it's awesome to have you join the conversation. You are another of the respected names to join, and with time we'll get more, and more means more interest.
More interest means more activity.

In regards to no USA manufactures, I understand there now is One. Word is the Bob Sterne Viper/Venom series has recently been transferred to Tippecanoe boats. I have not verified that.



If you have 23 active Marbleheads in Detroit, this is exactly what I am talking about. You don't HAVE to have the latest and greatest to have a big-fleet of fun in my the M class, you just need a fleet of boats that are from the same era.


It's a shame that these boats are active, and not registered. They should be. They are still Marbleheads, and are part of the same class of model yachts that encompasses designs from the Arrow 7 to a Bantock Paradox.
Yes, no kidding the designs are different, but we are all on the same Marblehead "Team".
Lets get on the same page, and make an already strong class stronger.
breakwater is online now Find More Posts by breakwater
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 19, 2012, 12:21 PM
GLMS
mav913's Avatar
Michigan
Joined Jan 2007
567 Posts
Being from that M group here in Detroit I would love to registrar the 4 M class boats ( 2 which are Vintage Fisher, Bob Irwin's) I have, if there was a reason for doing so. Since we are an ODR fleet and race our M's outside of the "norm" I don't see the need other than to send the AMYA $28.00 to support a fleet that I am not active in. I could be wrong but.....

I understand the desire for having them showing up in the registry but with the budget I have the money goes elsewhere better spent in my opinion.

John
mav913 is offline Find More Posts by mav913
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 19, 2012, 12:53 PM
Registered User
ToniGe23's Avatar
United Kingdom, London
Joined Jun 2005
821 Posts
RM Worlds 2012

a link to Youtube Ah I give up!
ToniGe23 is offline Find More Posts by ToniGe23
Last edited by ToniGe23; Nov 19, 2012 at 02:30 PM.
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 19, 2012, 01:16 PM
Registered User
United States, MI, Bloomfield Hills
Joined Feb 2010
536 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by mav913 View Post
Being from that M group here in Detroit I would love to registrar the 4 M class boats ( 2 which are Vintage Fisher, Bob Irwin's) I have, if there was a reason for doing so. Since we are an ODR fleet and race our M's outside of the "norm" I don't see the need other than to send the AMYA $28.00 to support a fleet that I am not active in. I could be wrong but.....

I understand the desire for having them showing up in the registry but with the budget I have the money goes elsewhere better spent in my opinion.

John
It is just a matter of supporting the association and the class.
TedFlack is online now Find More Posts by TedFlack
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 19, 2012, 01:18 PM
Registered User
United States, MI, Bloomfield Hills
Joined Feb 2010
536 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by ToniGe23 View Post
All I got was this:

"This video contains content from BMG_Rights_Management, Warner Chappell and EMI, one or more of whom have blocked it in your country on copyright grounds."
TedFlack is online now Find More Posts by TedFlack
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 19, 2012, 01:47 PM
Don't lie to my dog.
Gregg28's Avatar
United States, DE, Wilmington
Joined Jun 2005
3,062 Posts
The Marblehead is a development class. Putting all these restrictions and limitations on them makes them a "not Marblehead class." That is fine if that is what you want to do, but it is not Marbleheads.

I have seen it a hundred times. Some one comes out to the lake with a brand new boat that they just dropped a boatload of cash on, and it is fast. They are happy and proud. Until some one else comes out to the lake with a brand new boat that they just dropped a boatload of cash on. All of a sudden the class is too expensive and is a boat of the month class. Then they want to restrict everything faster than what they have.

One design racing is great, don't get me wrong. My big boat is a one design. But that is not what the Marblehead is. If you want to make a one design that fits the Marblehead or IOM rules, that is great. If you live near me I will put one together too.

But Marbleheads are development.

OK, rant over. Sorry. It was not aimed at anyone in particular and may not even belong in this thread.
Gregg28 is online now Find More Posts by Gregg28
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 19, 2012, 02:02 PM
Registered User
United States, MA, Wenham
Joined Jan 2007
1,409 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gregg28 View Post
The Marblehead is a development class. Putting all these restrictions and limitations on them makes them a "not Marblehead class." That is fine if that is what you want to do, but it is not Marbleheads.

I have seen it a hundred times. Some one comes out to the lake with a brand new boat that they just dropped a boatload of cash on, and it is fast. They are happy and proud. Until some one else comes out to the lake with a brand new boat that they just dropped a boatload of cash on. All of a sudden the class is too expensive and is a boat of the month class. Then they want to restrict everything faster than what they have.

One design racing is great, don't get me wrong. My big boat is a one design. But that is not what the Marblehead is. If you want to make a one design that fits the Marblehead or IOM rules, that is great. If you live near me I will put one together too.

But Marbleheads are development.

OK, rant over. Sorry. It was not aimed at anyone in particular and may not even belong in this thread.

I agree 100%
The Marblehead, In any form should not ever be restricted. an OD Marblehead is not a restriction. it's a solution to a local area's un-willingness to spend more money on the class. And, it's a great solution.
At the end of the day, Those boats are Still Marbleheads, and all 23 of them, while not on the podium, are still part of this bigger picture.

The "Modern" boats should be pushed to the limits in terms of design. And, if the wealthy want to drop a boat-load of cash on pushing these designs to that limit, I will support them whole-heartedly.
There is absolutley, positively nothing wrong with spending money to win.


But, You don't have to. it's not for everyone.
The point is, The M-Class has something for everyone.




Traditional
High-Flyer
Classic
Modern.
breakwater is online now Find More Posts by breakwater
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 19, 2012, 02:07 PM
Registered User
United States, MI, Bloomfield Hills
Joined Feb 2010
536 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gregg28 View Post
The Marblehead is a development class. Putting all these restrictions and limitations on them makes them a "not Marblehead class." That is fine if that is what you want to do, but it is not Marbleheads.

I have seen it a hundred times. Some one comes out to the lake with a brand new boat that they just dropped a boatload of cash on, and it is fast. They are happy and proud. Until some one else comes out to the lake with a brand new boat that they just dropped a boatload of cash on. All of a sudden the class is too expensive and is a boat of the month class. Then they want to restrict everything faster than what they have.

One design racing is great, don't get me wrong. My big boat is a one design. But that is not what the Marblehead is. If you want to make a one design that fits the Marblehead or IOM rules, that is great. If you live near me I will put one together too.

But Marbleheads are development.

OK, rant over. Sorry. It was not aimed at anyone in particular and may not even belong in this thread.
Gregg,

What you say is true, except in Detroit the class was dying a rapid death so they came up with a few rules that everyone thought would help keep interest up. Simple really, they/we use a B or C rig with sails that Wick makes at a very reasonable cost and an aluminum mast that Wick had made and sells very cheap. Guess what, the Marblehead class is now the biggest fleet in our club. They are still Marbleheads just with a almost one design rig, but that rig is class legal. It is the cheapest way I know of to have such a high performance boat and have a good size fleet to race with, 8 to 10 boats is the average turnout.
TedFlack is online now Find More Posts by TedFlack
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 19, 2012, 02:09 PM
Registered User
United States, MA, Wenham
Joined Jan 2007
1,409 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by mav913 View Post
Being from that M group here in Detroit I would love to registrar the 4 M class boats ( 2 which are Vintage Fisher, Bob Irwin's) I have, if there was a reason for doing so. Since we are an ODR fleet and race our M's outside of the "norm" I don't see the need other than to send the AMYA $28.00 to support a fleet that I am not active in. I could be wrong but.....

I understand the desire for having them showing up in the registry but with the budget I have the money goes elsewhere better spent in my opinion.

John

I understand your perspective entirely.

While each individual's situation, stance, perception or whatever will vary, there are two main benefits to registering your boats.


1. You support the "Numbers" of our class populations, making a strong and powerful class within the AMYA.
2. Your yacht is registered to be entered into AMYA Sanctioned events. While your boats are not "Podium" material based on what current designs allow, There still is no reason why you shouldn't participate. If someone's boat is better than yours, does it mean that they themselves are better than you?
breakwater is online now Find More Posts by breakwater
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Similar Threads
Category Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Sold Marblehead/10r/IOM etc Keel for Sale breakwater Boats (FS/W) 5 May 24, 2014 01:26 PM
Discussion Marblehead Help Needed.- Whirlwind Olympic Winch eurosystem0 Sailboats 17 Apr 12, 2012 03:01 PM
Question Plans for vintage Marblehead? john_k Sailboats 4 Dec 29, 2011 01:53 PM
Discussion Homemade silicone Marblehead bowbumpers Art Gallagher Sailboats 5 Nov 12, 2011 10:06 AM
For Sale RC Marblehead racingyacht cheddarcaveman Boats (FS/W) 0 Oct 02, 2011 01:52 AM