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Old Sep 17, 2012, 12:53 AM
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HK now have a Hitec section in the Rx's area.

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...idCategory=701


http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__27174__FrSky_2_4Ghz_A_FHSS_Compatible_5CH_Micro_ Receiver_Hitec_Minima_compatible_.html



Interesting on two levels:

1) Frsky might had got the idea from here?
2) Who want to test it out and see how it compares to Simon's code!
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Old Sep 17, 2012, 01:06 AM
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Your first link above is broken.
Frsky receivers runs Simon's code.
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Old Sep 17, 2012, 01:19 AM
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Link above fixed ....

Nice work Simon and Frsky!!!
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Old Sep 17, 2012, 02:25 AM
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Compatible with Minima radios??
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Old Sep 17, 2012, 02:33 AM
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Fortunately, the manuals are written by Simon himself, and are very well done.
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Old Sep 17, 2012, 03:05 AM
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What about the 8-ch? Are those by Simon too? Are the voltage telemetry, SPC and data port available there too?

chewy
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Old Sep 17, 2012, 04:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roguetrooperau View Post
1) Frsky might had got the idea from here?
2) Who want to test it out and see how it compares to Simon's code!
Couldn't possibly (or allowed to) comment if I'm involved or not.

I know if I was involved with it, I would be pretty annoyed that they put the text Minima on them... The word doesn't appear to be a trademarked word in the context of receivers, however you have to be a bit careful that there isn't any confusion that they are made by Hitec or not.

Seem a pretty good price once you put the logged in discount on.

Cheers,
Si.
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Old Sep 17, 2012, 04:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chewytm View Post
What about the 8-ch? Are those by Simon too? Are the voltage telemetry, SPC and data port available there too?

chewy
Again, see statement above.

However I would have thought that, as they are Minima compatible, they are non telemetry receivers. The Hitec Minima line is non-telemetry. The problem with telemetry is that it requires extra regulatory radio type approval (i.e. FCC, CE, etc testing) which is more expensive than just the basic EMC (electromagnetic compliance) testing - that a receive only receiver requires.

I'm sure if those sell well, that telemetry receivers could be next in the pipeline.

Si.
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Old Sep 17, 2012, 05:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eosglider View Post
Si,
How confident would you be to place one of these in a DLG?
Sorry, almost missed this.

No I wouldn't recommend putting the micro based version in anything larger than 500mm wingspan - especially as a glider your likely to be soaring pretty high.

I was hoping to convert the V8R4-II - which should fit nicely and (I believe) it has a preamp - so would be full range. However HK sent me the old version 1 instead which uses a different chipset not compatible with the existing firmware.

If this fits, it would be suitable. According to my calipers, out of the case the PCB is 20.5mm x 9.6mm x 42.5mm - including the end pins.

Cheers,
Si.
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Old Sep 17, 2012, 08:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SimonChambers View Post
Again, see statement above.

However I would have thought that, as they are Minima compatible, they are non telemetry receivers. The Hitec Minima line is non-telemetry. The problem with telemetry is that it requires extra regulatory radio type approval (i.e. FCC, CE, etc testing) which is more expensive than just the basic EMC (electromagnetic compliance) testing - that a receive only receiver requires.

I'm sure if those sell well, that telemetry receivers could be next in the pipeline.

Si.
FrSky has quite a number of telemetry certified rx. I think changing the protocol will NOT invalidate the FCC certification of the RF section, accroding to Jim Drew of XPS fame. Why not use one of these telemetry capable rx to mod for the Optima series instead? I would buy a few of them in a heartbeat!

I thought you have already decoded the telemetry functions for your version ( and maybe FrSky's too) of the Optima.

chewy

chewy
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Old Sep 17, 2012, 09:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chewytm View Post
FrSky has quite a number of telemetry certified rx. I think changing the protocol will NOT invalidate the FCC certification of the RF section, accroding to Jim Drew of XPS fame.
The FrSky receivers operate at different frequency channels, bandwidth, modulation type, etc than the Hitec system. So the FrSky technical file for their receivers would be different for one that works on the Hitec system. So it would require a retest to be legal. For CE-approval (and not FCC, which is more expensive and be in addition), at UK prices, your looking at around the 4000 (~$6500) mark to just have the RF tested and report written for the technical file. So this would obviously be a factor that needs to be considered.

Quote:
Originally Posted by chewytm View Post
I thought you have already decoded the telemetry functions for your version ( and maybe FrSky's too) of the Optima.
I've got a working telemetry receiver firmware for the same chipset as in the Minima equivalents as a proof of concept. However the FrSky telemetry receivers use a different processor (ST Micro ARM based device) than in the non-telemetry receivers (TI CC2510). Hence it requires a rewrite/port of the firmware to support this processor. I have started to do this (and also a Futaba S-FHSS compatible receiver), but recent work commitments have prevented me from finishing this just yet.

Cheers,
Si.
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Old Sep 17, 2012, 09:09 AM
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That doesn't quite make sense. An RX requires no FCC certification in the first place, so invalidating something that doesn't exist...

If FCC requires a cert on any TX, and you put a TX on the receiver for telemetry, then it would now be in their jurisdiction.

He must mean that the whole RF link requires a cert, and once certified, a protocol change doesn't invalidate it. I would imagine that the telemetry rx/tx portion would still need to be in the original cert, though.

CE is a euro thing, and has no bearing on US products, unless they are sold in Europe. It's just a scam to keep small businesses out of their markets. We sell sat equip to Europe, and pay $10k -$20k per product for CE certification; and that's for non-transmitting equipment. Most of that cost would still be there if we were selling a $15 desk lamp...
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Old Sep 17, 2012, 09:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jtaylor996 View Post
That doesn't quite make sense. An RX requires no FCC certification in the first place, so invalidating something that doesn't exist...

If FCC requires a cert on any TX, and you put a TX on the receiver for telemetry, then it would now be in their jurisdiction.
That's the problem. The receive only receivers (i.e. non-telemetry) don't require FCC certification for the RF side. However the telemetry receivers have a transmit section in them too. Hence require certification.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jtaylor996 View Post
CE is a euro thing, and has no bearing on US products, unless they are sold in Europe. It's just a scam to keep small businesses out of their markets. We sell sat equip to Europe, and pay $10k -$20k per product for CE certification; and that's for non-transmitting equipment. Most of that cost would still be there if we were selling a $15 desk lamp...
I prefer CE certification to FCC, and that's not just because I'm sitting on this side of the pond! CE is self certified, so along as you have the equipment and can prove in a technical file, you can do it all yourself. Also I much prefer getting CE approval for the whole of Europe, than having individual requirements for each country in the EU (which would be the case otherwise). The problem with CE approval is that its not very well regulated. Your technical file is only scrutinised if a competitor has tested your product and takes you to court, and/or if the authorities ask for proof. Very few cases exist where this actually happens for most consumer type products.

Where as to get FCC certified, its very expensive to file listings and going to approved testing houses. Even if your widget doesn't require FCC approval, you still need to get the product testing by UL or similar - if you want to be covered by your product liability insurance.

Si.
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Old Sep 17, 2012, 11:14 AM
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If it is like the minima there should be atleast voltage telemetry from the SPC port.
I'm gonna order a few, they are a factor 5 cheaper than the "real" ones!
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Old Sep 17, 2012, 11:22 AM
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Minima's don't have any telemetry.
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