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Old Oct 12, 2012, 03:14 PM
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Originally Posted by groundfx View Post
Don't tell that to all the Old Timer Free Flight fans out there. Most Free Flight planes from the 30's and 40's had lifting stabilizers and they flew fine.

In modern times, the Telemaster and Lazy Ace both had lifting stabilizers and flew great and were loved by many who flew them.

http://forums.hobby-lobby.com/telema...lemaster-4967/
http://rcadvisor.com/tag/lifting-stabilizer
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=648093

Don't be afraid to experiment... it could have been made to fly just fine; maybe even great, like the Telemaster or Laze Ace.
My memory is getting a little hazy, somehow I don't remember those old free flight planes having RC systems in them with throttle controls. Most used DT (dethermalizers) based on a fuze which flipped the stab up at a predetermined time, some would DT the wing, and most had a very small tank on the engine, allowing only a very brief engine run, the engine was either on or off.

As far as what I said about flying characteristics, that's all based on standard aerodynamics theory, backed up to some extent by looking at most full size aircraft, on most the stab is an upside down airfoil, some use a symmetrical airfoil on the stab, the incidence set for down force instead of lift, a lifting airfoil on a stab might be found but it would be very rare.
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Old Oct 12, 2012, 03:25 PM
Ed @ Experimental Airlines
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United States, AZ, Phoenix
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In case there are any friends on the thread who might not be EA subscribers on YouTube, here is the current contest to build a tricked-out cool airplane design representing your team, state, country, whatever. Use official colors, flags, seals, emblems, mascots, anything to show your pride. Just under 3 weeks to go until the deadline.

SCRATCHBUILDING CONTEST - "PRIDE PLANE" (3 min 6 sec)
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Old Oct 12, 2012, 04:23 PM
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Motor Mount Mod

For starters I must once again give a big " Thank You " to Ed for developing this new style of $ tree foam build, and making RC flying more accessible, not to mention affordable for all of us.

That being said, I would like to explain what brought about the different motor mount installations for all my Experimental Airline builds. It all started because around here, it’s impossible to obtain plastic gift cards without having them authorized and paid for at the cash register, other then stealing them outright, and hell I am much to old for that.

I needed to find a way to attach the metal mount ( as per Ed’s instructions ), without being able to glue it to the inside of the tube on a plastic card. What I came up with, turned out to be very beneficial for me, and would most probably help out a lot of other flyers, if they like me, are one of those who often experience some " Close Encounters of the Earth Kind ".

I used a small piece of 1/32 inch plywood that I glued to the bottom inside of the tube with a generous application of Gorilla Glue, and epoxied two nuts to the plywood surface. Then since I didn't have access to the same type of metal strapping that Ed uses, I used a piece of .040 thou aluminum that I bent to the correct shape, drilled two holes on the bottom, and then installed the motor on the front of the plate. Now, all that was left to do was to bolt the aluminum mount to the exterior of the tube on the bottom.

Initially it was for me just a stop gap solution, however in hindsight this turned out to be a much better way to install motor mounts on these tube type builds. Now when I come down too hard, rather then bust up the nose, the plane just slides across the surface on what has become for all intents and purposes, a metal landing skid.

Now repairing damage, or even swapping out motors for that matter has become a non issue. I can replace the complete motor and mount in less then one minute at the field just by removing the two small hex head bolts that are on the bottom. I can also try different combination of motor/esc's with out having to damage, or unglue anything at all on the aircraft and do so in less then a minute.

Sorry for going on for so long, but I couldn’t explain the modification in, as they say " 25 words or less "

Since I don't post too often, I have included a few extra photos of two other projects I am presently working on. The long Red thing is a $ tree foam board copy of a C-130 Hercules Transport plane. For now looking at around 100 inch span with four engines. The little Gray thing is for the F3P aerobatic indoor contests. I used 3mm gray Depron, and all the control surfaces are made from $ tree foam, with paper removed. Everything installed my weight came in at 137.3 grams including all electronics , motor and lipo.

Fly safe
Uncle Bob
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Old Oct 12, 2012, 05:18 PM
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I've started bolting my motors in as well, it makes it easy to reuse the motor and mount without tearing everything up.
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Old Oct 12, 2012, 09:31 PM
FPV maniac
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Colorado
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Onboard GoPro footage during the maiden flight of my new 56" Foam Board FPV airplane.

56 inch Foam Board FPV Airplane GoPro on maiden flight (2 min 6 sec)
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Old Oct 12, 2012, 09:56 PM
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@Stepinwolf and @Wingman26 : Every time I see a post on using a combination of Ed's metal mounts and plastic bolts, the ideas get better and better --- what a super way to be able to remove/swap-out/repair a motor and mount without having to wreak havoc on the fuselage (and I have destroyed a few too many fuselage noses trying to do just that!). I use 18ga. (.040") aluminum too and have some Simpson Strong-Tie strapping (18ga. steel at .048") in reserve if something heavier seems appropriate.
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Old Oct 12, 2012, 10:52 PM
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United States, AZ, Chino Valley
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Sources?

Could you post your sources for and specify the type of aluminum and steel brackets you are using? Some aircraft aluminum spec on plans for planes I've built in the past was difficult to find.....

Thanks!
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Old Oct 12, 2012, 11:02 PM
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The Simpson Strongties are available at Lowes (http://www.lowes.com/pd_108803-72913...uge&facetInfo=) and the 16ga. aluminum sheet is at most hardwares as flashing and that sort of thing, or in furnace ducting, etc.
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Old Oct 12, 2012, 11:44 PM
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bah7566,
Is that western Colorado, kinda looks like some of the land around Grand Junction, desert, but mountains in the distance.
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Old Oct 12, 2012, 11:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Mackenzie View Post
@Stepinwolf and @Wingman26 : Every time I see a post on using a combination of Ed's metal mounts and plastic bolts, the ideas get better and better --- what a super way to be able to remove/swap-out/repair a motor and mount without having to wreak havoc on the fuselage (and I have destroyed a few too many fuselage noses trying to do just that!). I use 18ga. (.040") aluminum too and have some Simpson Strong-Tie strapping (18ga. steel at .048") in reserve if something heavier seems appropriate.
I went to take the motor out of my original Noob to put in another plane, I was quite impressed, that thing was really in there! It pretty much destroyed the fuselage to get it out.
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Old Oct 12, 2012, 11:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by justj View Post
Could you post your sources for and specify the type of aluminum and steel brackets you are using? Some aircraft aluminum spec on plans for planes I've built in the past was difficult to find.....

Thanks!
JustJ,

The aluminum I am using is for the mounts is 6061-T6, which is an aircraft grade ( I'm building a real airplane also ) and it was chosen because of the bending properties of the aluminum. It is also impervious to additionnel damage that is caused by cracks or scratching of the surface as is seen on various other grades. One you MUST stay away from is the 2024 T3 because as soon as you scratch it, this is where it will develope fatigue, and break apart. The 6061 T6 can be found for not too many dollars at many of the small metal retailers.

Also Rob just mentioned a source such as flashing and ducting, however if you check closely, ( with all do respect Rob ) you will see that the material that is mentioned is much thinner then .040 I am using.

Uncle Bob
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Old Oct 13, 2012, 12:17 AM
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I don't know for sure what aluminum I got, I went to Lowe's and bought some aluminum strap, its about 2" wide, not sure how thick, maybe 1/16" or a bit more, stiff enough for my use. Bought a strip about 3 or 4 feet long, it will last me a long time. I just put it in the vise, bend it over, then cut it, then measure and drill the holes for the motor.
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Old Oct 13, 2012, 08:33 AM
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Aluminum

Thanks Everyone!
I've used the T6 before on a Parasol, couldn't remember the spec.... Thanks Uncle Bob!..... now to find a metals distributor.... probably have to use an online vendor!
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Old Oct 13, 2012, 08:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wingman26 View Post
I don't know for sure what aluminum I got, I went to Lowe's and bought some aluminum strap, its about 2" wide, not sure how thick, maybe 1/16" or a bit more, stiff enough for my use. Bought a strip about 3 or 4 feet long, it will last me a long time. I just put it in the vise, bend it over, then cut it, then measure and drill the holes for the motor.
Wingman, if you purchased it from Lowe's and the same goes for Home Depot, it's most certainly not aircraft grade, however it still can be used but you must not hammer it out as you describe in a vise. The secret is to bend it using a slightly larger radius then you obtain in a bend over using the jaws of the vise. If you must use a vise, clamp it with an additional metal rod around a1/4" thick and bend the aluminum across the metal rod there by increasing the radius. You will benefit from this procedure by strengthing your mount by a factor of three or four.

On another note, a slight decrease in your angle will give you a little bit of a down thrust, and by slightly enlarging the rear hole in your bottom plate you also introduce a small amount of side thrust towards the right side. Not all planes need it but it sure is easy to do using this type of mount.

Fly safe
Uncle Bob
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Old Oct 13, 2012, 01:58 PM
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I hadn't thought about putting a radius on it, that's a good idea, I do leave some angle in it for downthrust, and when I mount it I put just a bit of right thrust into it as well.
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