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Old Feb 26, 2012, 06:11 PM
learning to crash Heli's
Thunder Fighter's Avatar
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I tried the new V4 firmware in my Logo 600 with a tame setup (10s and HK4025) on the weekend and I can say that the internal governor is still not as good as the Vbar governor I was running with my Hawk ESC but otherwise identical setup. The Vbar governor makes my heli feel a lot more powerful when flying, as Mr.Mel says, its not all about just holding a constant head speed. With a more powerful setup like my buddy was running, the V4 internal governor worked pretty well.

I would love to be able to use the Vbar governor now, with the simple commutation setup (option #1) and Hyperion sensor then could upgrade with a sensor that will work with the new setup later (option #3). If not I am really tempted to sell off the CC HV120 and get a replacement like the Scorpion or another Hawk if it will take months to get this working. I am happy with the CC setup in my smaller LV heli's though.

Patrick, I did have a small problem with the new V4 software that I would like to report where it started to cut out but then recovered. I have a log of the event, where can I send the info to report the issue. I have dropped back to 3.27 in the mean time.

//Dennis.
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Old Feb 29, 2012, 05:45 AM
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Hello

How do we go with CC?
When ist the firmware done the normal operating with RPM sensors right?
Or is it from CC an RPM sensor the is functioning properly?
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Old Feb 29, 2012, 10:52 AM
A man with too many toys
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick del Castillo View Post
Unfortunately, the basic commutation sequence just doesn't work all that well with high inductance outrunners (which is 95% of the heli motors out there...) There are better options.

I'll talk with Richard about doing a simple mode (which uses the basic commutation sequence) for use with external govs. We'll work with Mr Mel and others to get it working.

Should only be a few weeks before we have a beta ready.

I'll start working on an RPM sensor that will work correctly as well...

Thanx!

Patrick
Patrick, any estimate on when the RPM sensor will be ready. Flying season is getting very close. Thatís the only solution that I am interested in.



.
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Old Feb 29, 2012, 11:33 AM
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@Patrick del Castillo

I think all of the RPM sensor only interested in this thread!
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Old Mar 01, 2012, 10:34 AM
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Originally Posted by stipsi View Post
@Patrick del Castillo

I think all of the RPM sensor only interested in this thread!
What does this mean?
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Old Mar 01, 2012, 11:13 AM
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Let me guess : "I think only the people who is interested in the rpm sensor is replying in this thread"
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Old Mar 01, 2012, 12:05 PM
A man with too many toys
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The ESC code is fixed and will support high frame rate inputs. The multi-rotor flyers love it. The only problem is that the advanced motor communication is not compatible with all the old analog phase sensors, which are now obsolete. So the only useful discussion is about the development of more advanced (probably digital) phase sensors.


Has anyone heard about any other companies that may be developing a more advanced phase sensor?



.
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Old Mar 04, 2012, 06:14 PM
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According to Patrick, the Airplane Mode has always worked with external governors. Check out the crap he told me over on HF (post #14 on this thread):

http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=390530


"You guys do realize that external governor ALWAYS WORKED fine with the ICE controllers, right?

You keep bugging us to release an external governor mode, but why?

Just set up the controller in Airplane mode, and external governors work OK.


But no, everyone insists that we add a specific "helicopter external governor mode" - WHY??


Now that we've released version 4.0, and made significant improvements (but - - we didn't add a specific "external governor heli mode" -- whatever that is) -- now that's suddenly the last straw, and everyone is jumping over to other brands...

Guess we could always just put a button on the Windows App that says "Helicopter External Governor Mode" -- and then puts the controller in fixed Airplane mode for you guys."

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Old Mar 04, 2012, 06:37 PM
A man with too many toys
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I have been using several eMultoGov external governors for about 3 years with the old Phoenix and new ICE controllers. That governor has two channel input so you can set the RPM and monitor the throttle change to get a head start on corrections. It also tuning parameters that makes it a very nice governor. That governor is now out of production. So Patrick is correct when he said that the old firmware would work with some external governors.


I think that the problem with some of the new external governors is that they donít have enough parameters to be able to tune them to work with CC ESCís. Now that CC has increased the input sample rate all we need is some new phase sensors. Until that time we can always use magnetic sensors like the nitro guys do or just go Chinese.

.
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Old Mar 05, 2012, 01:07 PM
I can drift a heli
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Quote:
Originally Posted by caralmar View Post
According to Patrick, the Airplane Mode has always worked with external governors. Check out the crap he told me over on HF (post #14 on this thread):

http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=390530


"You guys do realize that external governor ALWAYS WORKED fine with the ICE controllers, right?

You keep bugging us to release an external governor mode, but why?

Just set up the controller in Airplane mode, and external governors work OK.


But no, everyone insists that we add a specific "helicopter external governor mode" - WHY??


Now that we've released version 4.0, and made significant improvements (but - - we didn't add a specific "external governor heli mode" -- whatever that is) -- now that's suddenly the last straw, and everyone is jumping over to other brands...

Guess we could always just put a button on the Windows App that says "Helicopter External Governor Mode" -- and then puts the controller in fixed Airplane mode for you guys."

Iím feeling a little let down here. I waited over a year for my Castle with vbar gov to work as well as a Hobby Wing with vbar gov. Yes I continued to use my ICE 100 on my Logo 500 with the vbar gov and the esc in airplane mode. Itís not bad.

For a full year I took the abuse of hecklers as I spooled up my castle vbar logo and had it do a 190 degree spin when I took it out of throttle hold. Guys it is because of the airplane mode. Yes I know how to setup an esc. Itís how I have to run it right now. But Castle will be updating my esc. I know they will. I have faith.

I was under the impression that Castle had my back and was working on a firmware update for this subject. I wish they stated a year ago that this wouldnít be possible. I would have gone on to a Hobby Wing or a YGE.

Castle has always been good to me. Great service and what not. But now I just have this bitter taste in my mouth. In the back of my mind I kind of knew they wouldnít allow an external gov to compete with their internal gov. I should have listened to that inner voice.
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Old Mar 05, 2012, 02:00 PM
A man with too many toys
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I think you guys missed what Patrick said. They have the firmware problem but in doing so the current analog Phase Sensors don’t work and that CC was working on making a compatible phase sensor. That’s the way I read it. I would expect that there will be a new phase sensor and perhaps another firmware upgrade out sometime this spring.


.
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Old Mar 05, 2012, 02:07 PM
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I read what he said but enough time has gone by, I will shelve my Ice and have already hit the buy button at Hobby Prtz.
The post over at HF is what swung me, they dont get it!
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Old Mar 05, 2012, 02:29 PM
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Castle should not underestimate what mass hysteria can do to their business. I guess Castle's biggest mistake in this whole external governor matter was more in the Public Relations department than in R&D. As an embedded software engineer myself, I can appreciate the amount of work that went into the V4 firmware.
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Last edited by 3Dmuse; Mar 05, 2012 at 02:47 PM.
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Old Mar 05, 2012, 02:46 PM
A man with too many toys
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Don’t forget that this is a beta version of firmware.
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Old Mar 05, 2012, 02:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RC Man View Post
Donít forget that this is a beta version of firmware.
RC Man, have you taken a look at the Castle firmware page? ALL of their firmwares are "beta" firmware since like 2009!!!
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