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Old Jan 28, 2012, 11:15 PM
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United States, UT, Garden City
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Build Log
Spad 13.C1 designed for DT foamboard with plans

I kind of got a bug right now for WW1 fighters going(flavor of the month sort of thing I guess), so I researched out and drew up a set of plans for the Spad 13.C1.

Since I have a ton of DT rediboard right now, I naturally ddecided to draw it up for that stuff. I suppose that 6 mm depron or 5 mm cellfoam 88 would work just as well if you make adjustments for the different thickness.

I'm planning on building this thing within the next week or so and I will take pics along the way to better help those that may want to build it understand just what was going through my mind when I drew it up! Actually, it should be a pretty simple build and should have decent flight characteristics. I deviated from scale to make it easier to balance by adding about 5/8" to the nose past the scale line, and I also made the rudder and horizontal stab and elevator larger too.

I'm hoping for an all up weight to come in under 18 ounces. Anyway, here are the specs.

wingspan : 32 1/2"
length: 25 1/2"
weight: 16-19 oz.
motor: Towerpro 2410-12t
battery: Gen ace 800 mAh 11.1 v 20 c
servos: 9 gram (4 total)
ESC: Dynam 18 amp


I would be anxious for anyone who cares to, to look at the plans, critique them, and hopefully build one if it suites their fancy.

Thanks
Mike

p.s. I will get tiled plans on here within a day or so.
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Last edited by gmwahl; Mar 02, 2012 at 09:16 PM.
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Old Jan 28, 2012, 11:30 PM
Build straight - Fly twisty
Whiskers's Avatar
Australia, QLD, Little Mountain
Joined Feb 2010
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Lengthening the nose is a good idea, but you will still need to get everything as far forward as possible, like ESC ahead of the firewall, and to keep the tail really light.
It should be a sweet flyer.
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Old Jan 29, 2012, 01:30 AM
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Thanks whiskers, I had a heck of a time sorting out how to balance my D7 without adding ballast, and I think that the generous frontal area on the spad will allow me to keep most everything right at the front so hopefully the ballast will be minimal to nonexistent.

I'm actually really looking foreword to building this thing and as I convert this " discussion" to a build thread, it will motivate me to keep it going at a reasonable pace and see it through. I'm hoping also that as I build and come across any problems or issues, that I can pull from the vast combined experience of the good members of this forum to help me out.
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Old Jan 29, 2012, 09:54 AM
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I have a couple of questions to ask.

The real plane had no dihedral, so do you guys think that I should go that way too? Also, the wings airfoil is kind of thick so that I would get a lot of lift,now I'm wondering if I should make it a little thinner to get closer to scale. I have no illusions of making it as thin as the real thing, but if I take out 1 layer of foam spar that will reduce it by 3/16" and maybe make it look a little more scale. I don't want it to have a sharp leading edge like the real plane though, because I think it would aggravate any stalling tendencies that it may show later.

Thanks in advance for any ideas that you may have on these matters.
Mike
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Old Jan 29, 2012, 11:47 AM
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United States, PA, Pittsburgh
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I have a question on your wings, specifically are they one or two layers of DT rediboard?

I'm also a little unclear of the notes regarding the spar and formers.

Thanks,
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Old Jan 29, 2012, 12:04 PM
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The wings are built using what people are calling the armin wing method. They are one piece folded over a spar and foam strips at about 25-30% back from the leading edge. I should have put more detail into the wing construction but as I'm drawing things up, I sometimes forget that what's in my head isn't really obvious to someone else. I'll have to work on that! I can always amend the plans and do an edit on them later.

As I build this thing, I will take good pics and explain what I'm doing so that hopefully it will answer a lot of questions and make sense.
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Old Jan 29, 2012, 04:07 PM
Build straight - Fly twisty
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Australia, QLD, Little Mountain
Joined Feb 2010
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Go for the flat, no dihedral, wings. They handle turbulence and cross-wind landings far better. The Wright bros knew this way back in 1902, but some guys are slow learners.
I've come around to believing thin wings and sharp leading edges are better than OK, but are very good indeed. One of my planes with such a wing goes way better than I expected.
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Old Jan 29, 2012, 04:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gmwahl View Post
The wings are built using what people are calling the armin wing method. They are one piece folded over a spar and foam strips at about 25-30% back from the leading edge. I should have put more detail into the wing construction but as I'm drawing things up, I sometimes forget that what's in my head isn't really obvious to someone else. I'll have to work on that! I can always amend the plans and do an edit on them later.

As I build this thing, I will take good pics and explain what I'm doing so that hopefully it will answer a lot of questions and make sense.
Thanks for the explanation. I think I understand, kinda like a KF wing. The plans only show one-half of the fold it seems? Should I "mirror" each wing for the fold?

Thanks,
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Old Jan 29, 2012, 04:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dmccalmon View Post
Thanks for the explanation. I think I understand, kinda like a KF wing. The plans only show one-half of the fold it seems? Should I "mirror" each wing for the fold?

Thanks,
Ya, my plan is to use the wing outline as you see it on the plan for the bottom sheet, then making the top sheet a little bigger in all dimensions, fold this over the spar and other build-ups on the bottom wing. Once the glue dries, trim the top to match the outline of the bottom wing panel, scallops and all. I hope this helps a little.

Whiskers, thanks for the input. I think you're right about the dihedral being unnecessary. I also think that I will only do one layer of rediboard former(or spar) so as to reduce the wing thickness. Also by having no dihedral, I can use a single carbon spar without the need for a joiner of any kind. This should save some weight too.

I started cutting templates and now have the parts laid out on my rediboard ready to do a cut out tonight. I've got some pics already of how it's coming and I'll post them shortly. This plane actually seems to have a fairly low parts count for a bipe, at least to me anyway. Thanks guys for the questions and suggestions, it's helping me a lot to work a few bugs out early in the project!
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Old Jan 30, 2012, 11:34 PM
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Lets get building!

Ok, so after being asked to describe my intention for the wings and how they fold up, I decide to start with the wings first this time so that it can be seen how this is supposed to work.

Actually, I guess I started with templates and parts cut, so I,m going to let the pics tell the story!

Clear as mud? I am probably missing something so if you have questions or need me to make sense of this, please ask me to clarify it for you

Mike
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Old Jan 31, 2012, 07:20 PM
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Perfect! That really explains the process. Can't wait to start this one now, as soon as I finish the A6M Zero I'm working on.

Thanks,
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Old Jan 31, 2012, 07:54 PM
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dmccalmon, no problem! glad to help. These wings only took about one hour to make. Really simple for a bipe!
I have found a real dumb mistake on the plans! The firewall (f-1) is too tall! The top and bottom contour are correct, but the distance between the top and bottom is too big. I'll try to correct this on the plans, but for now just be aware of it and measure the distance from top to bottom of the front of the fuselage side and draw it out accordingly. Sorry guys
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Old Feb 02, 2012, 11:38 PM
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Now the fuselage.

The fuselage is pretty straight foreward. Laminate a doubler from F-4 foreward and laminate two 1/2" strips top and bottom from the foreward doubler to the tail, top and bottom.

The forward top sheeting is just trimmed to fit a little oversized by about 3/16 then rolled over a table or countertop edge to get a curl in it. Then roll it 90 degrees to the first direction so as to get a slight compound curve in it.The edges of the fuselage are trimmed or sanded to match the contour of the fuselage formers so that when the sheeting is put on, it will lay flat with the edges with no gaps.Gorilla glue and tape the front top sheeting into place. When this cures, you can use a razor to trim it flush to the fuselage sides or sand it flush. The next step for me will be to finish sheeting the aft upper fuselage and then start putting in the motor and radio,pushrods,etc... before covering up the bottom.

I guess now would also be the time to mention that I laminated two pieces of 1/8" balsa to the front and back of formers F-3 and F-4 to have a stiff, solid attach point for the plywood landing gear that I plan on using. The plans call for piano wire or ply and I think I can make the ply gear a little easier and hopefully lighter. They will go through slots on the fuselage sides at formers 3&4 and glue to the balsa wood support plates. Then the landing gear will have a carbon fiber or 1/16" music wire axle run through them and glued into place.
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Old Feb 02, 2012, 11:49 PM
Pronounced "High Duck"
haiduk's Avatar
Marysville, WA
Joined Oct 2008
1,360 Posts
Subbed... Looking great. SPAD is one of my favorite WWI planes. I'll be watching.
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