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Old Apr 07, 2012, 12:05 PM
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Banff Alberta Canada
Joined Nov 2004
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Vibration Level Problems

Quote:
Originally Posted by NorCalMatCat View Post
Forgot to attach pics
I just took a look at your picture of your FY-31 install and I think that you should
use a suspension or cushioning system under your AP . I think that you have vibration problems. Follow the vibration level procedure in the manual which involves throttling up your motor and looking at the red LED on the AP. Also check the balance of your prop.
The picture also shows that you really trashed your rudder POT.
I really think that you should get that repaired as soon as possible.
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Old Apr 07, 2012, 12:10 PM
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NorCalMatCat's Avatar
United States, CA, Arcata
Joined Oct 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by larry baraniuk View Post
I just took a look at your picture of your FY-31 install and I think that you should
use a suspension or cushioning system under your AP . I think that you have vibration problems. Follow the vibration level procedure in the manual which involves throttling up your motor and looking at the red LED on the AP. Also check the balance of your prop.
The picture also shows that you really trashed your rudder POT.
I really think that you should get that repaired as soon as possible.
I live in the mountains in the middle of nowhere, the nearest real city is 300 miles away, finding someone with the skill and parts to fix that pot is not an easy task :P.

You may be right about vibrations... I am charging all my batteries back up and I will be going back out to the field soon... I will test vibrations by seeing how stabilize works while gliding...
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Old Apr 07, 2012, 12:17 PM
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Testing FY31AP 'Circling' Mode (0 min 19 sec)


This is a video I shot while it was auto-circling fine at one point... according to the GCS the circle radius is 80 meters, seems like a BIG circle when watching it.
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Old Apr 07, 2012, 01:16 PM
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Banff Alberta Canada
Joined Nov 2004
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P.I.D explanation

I just wanted to talk a bit about PID controllers.
On the FY-31 the adjusting Pots only change the gain of the gyros which basically changes the Proportional part of the PID controller.
The best way to play around with a PID controller is on a simulator.
I was using the X- plane simulator hooked up to an Ardupilot Mega board and had alot of fun trying out different settings under different flying conditions and airframe changes.
To play around with the Integrator and Derivative parts of the PID controller on your actual plane is very time consuming and risky and the changes should be done in small increments.
Wikipedia also has a good manual tuning explanation
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PID_con...erivative_term.
The method basically involves having the gain of the gyros high enough to have the plane oscillating, then backing off the gain a bit and the increasing the Intergrator and Derivative settings in small increments.
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Old Apr 07, 2012, 01:24 PM
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Well back to my original question, can the PID settings be used to manually adjust the gain without turning the pots?
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Old Apr 07, 2012, 03:06 PM
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Ok I just confirmed at the field it's vibration... at 45% throttle on the ground the vibe light starting going... My prop is pretty well balanced, but I think the outrunner is not...

I did test and everything seemed to work somewhat OK at very low throttles, but not good for the wind conditions today, as to be reliable I would need atleast 45% throttle to feel comfortable even a tiny bit.

I guess all I can do is try to balance my motor... I saw a video on how to do it using a laser once... think I will try that method
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Old Apr 07, 2012, 05:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by larry baraniuk View Post
Good to hear.
Yes it still is a bit of mucking around , but not as bad as the Ardupilot Mega.
So is it the data in , data out wires that were crossed and does your wiring jive with the drawing
that I've attached.
Hi Larry,
I had reversed the OSD - fy31 connection wire, both ends are different, . I am not putting my xbees on this as I want to keep RF noise to a minimum for greater video range and not that keen to use the waypoints as I did a lot of that with APM.
I have no intentions of touching the PIDs, but as it didn't track directly home and more of a dog leg shape path home I was trying to work out how to tune this to be more direct.

I have a $4 suspended mounting plate from Foxtech and used the foam to connect it to that which seems to work well.
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Old Apr 07, 2012, 05:29 PM
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Banff Alberta Canada
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Good to hear that you are using a proper suspension system.
I am wondering what you're using to transmit you video and does it
use TTL format.
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Old Apr 07, 2012, 08:05 PM
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Banff Alberta Canada
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NorCalMatCat View Post
Well back to my original question, can the PID settings be used to manually adjust the gain without turning the pots?
3 things can be done.
1 - use longer servo horns
2- use shorter horns on the control surface
3 - make your control surface larger
Of course your going to have to change the control stick gains on your transmitter .
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Old Apr 07, 2012, 08:21 PM
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Well it's down to vibration I think, when it's gliding or flying on very low throttle it can control it just fine, even in some wind, but once the vibes kick in from higher throttle it goes whacky.
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Old Apr 08, 2012, 06:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by larry baraniuk View Post
Good to hear that you are using a proper suspension system.
I am wondering what you're using to transmit you video and does it
use TTL format.
I have been using 5.8Ghz with CL and SP antennas which lets me get 5km max. I use an easycap into my mac just in case I need those coordinates.
I am waiting on 1.2ghz (which I all use 1280) 800mw and have a yagi coming as well. Not sure what I will use on the Tx yet.
I have Rmilec UHF.
I did 5 km today and lost video as I turned for home, flipped to RTL, put the tx down and waited got the Vid back and it circles as advertised above my head. Thiss has given me confidence now to push further as well as put the Gopro on the plane. Worth every penny.
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Last edited by damoz; Apr 08, 2012 at 06:56 AM.
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Old Apr 08, 2012, 12:16 PM
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Banff Alberta Canada
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Clover Leaf and Skew Planar antennas

For those of you wondering about the last posts acronyms CL and SP.
CL means Clover leaf antenna and SP means Skew Planar wheel antenna.
I'm not that much into 5.8 Ghz stuff so , when you say that your using a
5.8 Ghz , what are you using ? A 5.8 Ghz what ?
Is mac another acronym and I don't understand why you are using an easycap.
Not only am I a terminology nazi but I am also an acronym nazi.
My university communications teacher always stressed that an acronym should always be defined before using it in any articles .
For example I had somebody hop on board my Rogue drone thread starting to
talk about AP and I thought he meant ArduPilot but he meant Aerial Photography.
On this thread the acronym Rx causes confusion because in some cases it means "radio receiver" and in other cases it means "receive data" or "data in".
Anyways , going back to CL and SP antennas , it sounds like your antennas are
directional if you lost signal on the return to home of your plane.
Maybe because the wings or fuselage are blocking the signal.
Did you buy these antennas or are they scratch built.
Again ,I'm not much into 5.8 Ghz stuff but my first impression is that if anybody is scratch building these antennas they should be careful of the type of copper wire being used. Even if you are using the same gauge of wire as others
the "velocity factor" might be a little bit different , and at 5.8 Ghz
that makes a big difference.
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Old Apr 08, 2012, 02:24 PM
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After taking my motor out to see if I could balance it, I found my motor is actually perfectly balanced, however my prop was way off, so I kept messing with adding tape to my prop until on the bench it would spin up to nearly WOT with hardly ANY vibration, when I first started just turning the motor on made it hard to hold the motor mount because of it. It's raining so I won't be able to test until tomorrow.
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Old Apr 08, 2012, 03:24 PM
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Calgary Canada
Joined Jun 2006
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you have to fix that install.. it's just stuck there... in a bunch of wires...

put it on the pads provided,
get all that wiring out of the way
balance the prop
and make sure the whole plane is not shaking under load too

as for throwing away 200$ hahah... you just started man belive me this is the easiest system to get up and flying... you can do it but everyone had things they need to work on... yours is vibrations.

Steve

Quote:
Originally Posted by NorCalMatCat View Post
Well it's down to vibration I think, when it's gliding or flying on very low throttle it can control it just fine, even in some wind, but once the vibes kick in from higher throttle it goes whacky.
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Old Apr 08, 2012, 03:40 PM
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NorCalMatCat's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saabguyspg View Post
you have to fix that install.. it's just stuck there... in a bunch of wires...

put it on the pads provided,
get all that wiring out of the way
balance the prop
and make sure the whole plane is not shaking under load too

as for throwing away 200$ hahah... you just started man belive me this is the easiest system to get up and flying... you can do it but everyone had things they need to work on... yours is vibrations.

Steve
Yeah yesterday I made sure no wires where touching it, it is indeed on the vibration pads. I removed a LOT of vibration messing with the motor and prop today, I got it to have less vibration at WOT then it had just barely getting it to spin before I started... should make a drastic difference.
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