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Old Mar 05, 2012, 12:27 PM
Making Stock Fly Like Modified
HeliFlyer711's Avatar
United States, PA, Philadelphia
Joined Oct 2009
2,221 Posts
You say Naive, I say your right....

The Chinese definately make some affordable and interesting high tech products these days, it's one of the reasons I like Walkera, its all half assed though and they depend on a lot people being naive about it. Explain to me how Walkera is different than Blade and thier servos on the mcp-x or the brushed motor replacement merry go round cash cow? There all the same.

It goes down the line with the dealers too...like the WoWHobbies "Marketing for Dummies" campaign thats been going on for the last 3 years. The make it sound like the helis they sell are set apart from the rest, with upgrades that arent easily done or take too much time and expertise to do. If you search thier site its one thing after another of hyped up product review after hyped up product review. Well they made millions : good for them I say and good for us because now they have expanded thier product line and always have stock. But what does that tell you about the general user base if they are so easily lead to buy. And lead to buy over and over again, given the circumstances?
And thats with at least 100 threads of disatisfied customers in the past, but hey when your moving 10,000 pieces a year whats 1% of sales that didnt work out? No skin off thier back for sure, and not everyone reads RC forums.
For them the perfect customer is the one thats naive at the purchase, but becomes a professional RC pilot upon heli delivery. Fall for the marketing in the beginning and then fix your own problem when/if it arises later. They point you to RCG as thier customer service..... C.mon man

Simple things like a gear swap and a hole drill? man if your too lazy to drill a hole and swap a gear to save 20 bucks, learning to fly helis is the least of your problems in this life

Just look at the beginners section of the forum, or even here in the mini or micro side. Some of the stuff that gets posted are the things that make you go Hrmmmmm. Really? Im sure i posted a few winners when i started out too and still do occasionally.

Helis, if you really want to break it down... especially CP FB/FL helis are not easy, advanced aerodynamics principals that go into physics, calculus math, and a good understanding of electronics. Out of all the hobbies CP Helis are the most difficult to master. Thank gawd for the internet! It takes time, even with these RTF...everyone can do 3D overnight micro helos. Im going to say it takes at least 2 years, and owning a bunch of different helis and radios to get your feet on solid ground. To where you can explain rightly in detail and with confidence what your fingers are doing and what the heli is doing in the air in front of you, down to almost the last detail and to be able to make it do exactly what you want it to be doing.........because none of us know everything. Like understanding the vortex ring state, thermals and wind and how temp or altitude effects flight. How a lipo will be weak when its cold outside...etc.

But yeah its getting kind of hectic to watch more and more newbs come in and just read whats being written..... To many want to be spoonfed and not do the work, the research, and the R&D on thier own. Many things that are posted from a lot of newbs are not accurate also, especially in the mini forum. But it just takes too much time and effort to try to help hardheaded people sometimes. Used to be on the 4G6 forum if you didnt have something highly technical to add or discuss, you just sat back and learned from the mad scientist that were so intelligent with this stuff they make you scratch your head. Electronic Engineers, math geniuses, scientist etc.. Now every Tom Dick and harry has one under the Xmas tree and its great for everybody because more money to the manufaturers means more options for us, the pilots. But the quality of the information has tanked.

BTW this isnt directed to anyone in general just an outlook over the whole micro hobby in the last year or so with FBL micros from Walkera and Blade being released. Nothing personal, just an opinion. The more the merrier I say
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Old Mar 05, 2012, 12:31 PM
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I see I'm getting competition making ultra long posts!
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Old Mar 05, 2012, 12:39 PM
Making Stock Fly Like Modified
HeliFlyer711's Avatar
United States, PA, Philadelphia
Joined Oct 2009
2,221 Posts
Yeah its a lunchbreak and a redbull type of post....sometimes that happens. But your still the king of the 3/4 page post, music vids, off topics.......dont worry Alex. I wont steal your thunder on RCG.......... LoL.
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Old Mar 05, 2012, 01:05 PM
2 seconds from crashing
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United States, WA, Seattle
Joined Sep 2007
7,349 Posts
Well I cant say I took my time painting...or even that it would have made a difference if i did

But at least I can see my helicopter a lot easier now
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Old Mar 05, 2012, 01:15 PM
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Joined Jan 2012
20 Posts
my mini cp (pro edition, genius main gear, true 25c battery) just arrived from wow. i got the RTF package with the devo-8s. first impression: such an improvement over the genius cp. i am by no means an advanced pilot, i can only hover and fly tail in (i have to follow the helicopter around to keep it tail in haha). The Mini-CP is so much more enjoyable to fly than my genius BL (C05). I was able to do a 3 second hands off hover straight out of the box, i can't let go of the TX for even a moment while flying the genius or it veers off. The Mini-CP is also much more stable immediately off the ground, i barely had to adjust cyclic control to keep it stable. I will post a vid of the first flight as soon as i can edit it down a bit (1080p gopro vid is a big file). TL;DR: I love the MINI-CP, it's a great helicopter. i'm also becoming a fan of the Devo-8S, the controls feel a little smoother than the 2801Pro.
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Old Mar 05, 2012, 01:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mescalinedream View Post
Anyone know what the difference between these esc's are? the one on bottom is actually 2 esc's soldered together model #WK-WST-10A-L7 and the top is WK-WST-10A-LT. The L7 model comes with the genius double brushless kit. the LT esc is the recommended esc to do the c05 motor upgrade. The reason why I am asking is cause the L7 is smaller and lighter. is there a benefit to using the LT? they are both plug and play pretty much. I will have to unsolder the two esc's apart on the L7. I dont mind soldering anyways. I lanned on soldering it all up directly to the main rx board anyways.

the only difference I see is there are resistors in the bottom left corner of the Lt and a blacj chip in the same spot with no resistors on the L7 board.
It looks like the LT has room for a voltage regulator. It is kind of hard to tell without seeing both sides of each board. There can also be code and IC/component differences that aren't easy to determine.

Good Luck, Don
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Old Mar 05, 2012, 01:25 PM
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livonia bob's Avatar
United States, MI, Livonia
Joined Apr 2009
16,526 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by HeliFlyer711 View Post
The Chinese definately make some affordable and interesting high tech products these days, it's one of the reasons I like Walkera, its all half assed though and they depend on a lot people being naive about it. Explain to me how Walkera is different than Blade and thier servos on the mcp-x or the brushed motor replacement merry go round cash cow? There all the same.

It goes down the line with the dealers too...like the WoWHobbies "Marketing for Dummies" campaign thats been going on for the last 3 years. The make it sound like the helis they sell are set apart from the rest, with upgrades that arent easily done or take too much time and expertise to do. If you search thier site its one thing after another of hyped up product review after hyped up product review. Well they made millions : good for them I say and good for us because now they have expanded thier product line and always have stock. But what does that tell you about the general user base if they are so easily lead to buy. And lead to buy over and over again, given the circumstances?
And thats with at least 100 threads of disatisfied customers in the past, but hey when your moving 10,000 pieces a year whats 1% of sales that didnt work out? No skin off thier back for sure, and not everyone reads RC forums.
For them the perfect customer is the one thats naive at the purchase, but becomes a professional RC pilot upon heli delivery. Fall for the marketing in the beginning and then fix your own problem when/if it arises later. They point you to RCG as thier customer service..... C.mon man

Simple things like a gear swap and a hole drill? man if your too lazy to drill a hole and swap a gear to save 20 bucks, learning to fly helis is the least of your problems in this life

Just look at the beginners section of the forum, or even here in the mini or micro side. Some of the stuff that gets posted are the things that make you go Hrmmmmm. Really? Im sure i posted a few winners when i started out too and still do occasionally.

Helis, if you really want to break it down... especially CP FB/FL helis are not easy, advanced aerodynamics principals that go into physics, calculus math, and a good understanding of electronics. Out of all the hobbies CP Helis are the most difficult to master. Thank gawd for the internet! It takes time, even with these RTF...everyone can do 3D overnight micro helos. Im going to say it takes at least 2 years, and owning a bunch of different helis and radios to get your feet on solid ground. To where you can explain rightly in detail and with confidence what your fingers are doing and what the heli is doing in the air in front of you, down to almost the last detail and to be able to make it do exactly what you want it to be doing.........because none of us know everything. Like understanding the vortex ring state, thermals and wind and how temp or altitude effects flight. How a lipo will be weak when its cold outside...etc.

But yeah its getting kind of hectic to watch more and more newbs come in and just read whats being written..... To many want to be spoonfed and not do the work, the research, and the R&D on thier own. Many things that are posted from a lot of newbs are not accurate also, especially in the mini forum. But it just takes too much time and effort to try to help hardheaded people sometimes. Used to be on the 4G6 forum if you didnt have something highly technical to add or discuss, you just sat back and learned from the mad scientist that were so intelligent with this stuff they make you scratch your head. Electronic Engineers, math geniuses, scientist etc.. Now every Tom Dick and harry has one under the Xmas tree and its great for everybody because more money to the manufaturers means more options for us, the pilots. But the quality of the information has tanked.

BTW this isnt directed to anyone in general just an outlook over the whole micro hobby in the last year or so with FBL micros from Walkera and Blade being released. Nothing personal, just an opinion. The more the merrier I say
You have written just what I would of written if I was any good at writtening..
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Old Mar 05, 2012, 01:56 PM
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Fairfield County, Connecticut
Joined Dec 2009
819 Posts
Is it really worth it to go brushless over using an upgraded battery? If I were to go brushless I would have to buy Wow's as I cannot do that myself...

Ben
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Old Mar 05, 2012, 02:02 PM
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Joined Feb 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zadaw View Post
I am having a horrible time with the servos on the V120D02S as well. This is one reason I am interested in the MIni CP but the issue of the servos is alarming with the Mini CP. I wonder if

1. servos are stripped more frequently than in the Genius CP?
2. is the stripping associated with inverted crashes?
The mini cp is my first heli so I'm not an expert, and I'm not doing any 3D or hard sport flying, and a slight main blade strike on a table leg with the heli at small angle (20 degrees from horizontal) was enough to strip one of my servos... So not just inverted crashes...

But i just rotated the gear a little and did the servo saver mod and it works like new now.
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Old Mar 05, 2012, 03:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dbennettya View Post
It looks like the LT has room for a voltage regulator. It is kind of hard to tell without seeing both sides of each board. There can also be code and IC/component differences that aren't easy to determine.

Good Luck, Don
I dont want to take the heatshrink off the lt cause I would like to sell it if I can figure out which esc is better. the L7 has a 7 in its name and 10a. so maybe it has a 10 amp esc and a 7amp for the tail? how many amps does the c05 pull?
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Old Mar 05, 2012, 03:13 PM
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Joined Jul 2008
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how loose should these pinions be on the c05 motor? I just got my 1mm inner diameter 7tooth pinion from homefly and it literally slides on, like let go from the very tip of the shaft and it slides down with a thump?

all I have read was to use loc-tite. I. have blue on hand and put a dab on there and it seems to be holding. haven't had it installed yet since I am trying to figure out which esc to use.
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Old Mar 05, 2012, 03:33 PM
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United States, TN, Memphis
Joined Dec 2011
862 Posts
My 1.5 was loose to but a drop of ca will take care of it.
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Old Mar 05, 2012, 03:36 PM
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I read that the recommended method is to clean Motor's shaft and Pinion, and apply Loctite (I forgot which color, but I'd choose the color that "temporarily" adheres metal).

I've only replaced a Pinion once, didn't want to purchase a new tube of Loctite, because it has a shelf life, and I only expected being able to use it once during it's recommended "lifetime", so I tried adhering a loose Pinion using CA on a 4#3 with a C05 Motor, and AFAIK it held well. If you decide to try the CA method, I highly recommend carefully positioning the Pinion to the correct location on the Motor's shaft so when installed on the heli the Pinion fully engages/mates/centers with the Main Gear first, before applying CA with a "needle" tip to both sides of the Pinion. If you apply CA to the Pinion's ID first, and then try to install the Pinion on the Motor's shaft to its proper location, the CA sets so fast, that the Pinion will probably seize on the shaft before reaching the desired location.

With Loctite, you'll have a much longer "working" time to get the Pinion into the correct position on the shaft, before it sets.

With either product, the manufacturers recommend > 8 hr curing time for maximum bond strength.
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Old Mar 05, 2012, 03:41 PM
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I dont want to wait that long. shelf life huh? I have been using the same tube of blue loc-tite for over 2 years. the pinion was hard to budge after 5 sec. it still hasnt dried. maybe I can use a hairdryer....any news about the esc's? I need to pick one to start soldering.
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Old Mar 05, 2012, 03:47 PM
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(double post)
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Last edited by i812; Mar 05, 2012 at 04:01 PM.
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