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Old Dec 15, 2012, 06:58 PM
Ochroma Lagopus Tekton
Fly Wheel's Avatar
Blackstock, South Carolina
Joined Sep 2007
1,829 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by vincent123 View Post
This wing I made goes over 200km/h, according to the installed GPS, nice surprise !

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s5VXm...are_video_user
It sounds like a cross between my dads router and a honeybee!

I love your sheeting clamps - rubberbands and Legos! Adaptable and obviously effective. MacGyver would be proud!
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Last edited by Fly Wheel; Dec 15, 2012 at 07:09 PM.
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Old Dec 16, 2012, 02:26 AM
InceCreations
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Joined Jul 2009
732 Posts
Hi fly wheel, thanks for the compliment, yeah, it turned out to be a very stiff wing.
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Old Dec 18, 2012, 03:20 PM
Ochroma Lagopus Tekton
Fly Wheel's Avatar
Blackstock, South Carolina
Joined Sep 2007
1,829 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vernon Hunt View Post
Here are some pics of my flying wings. Some of them anyway.

Vern
How much did this one set you back?
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Old Dec 18, 2012, 04:12 PM
CNC Cutter
birdofplay's Avatar
United States, IN, Indianapolis
Joined Dec 2005
8,674 Posts
As an aero towed ULGlider that looks like fun !!!
The CG seems a bit aft but what do I know about this design.

Back "in the day" I had an Easy Riser by UFM.

It had Dihedral, Sweep back and some Washout too.

I dont recall any reflex in the Foils.
Plans are buried somewhere after my move.

Bob
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Old Dec 19, 2012, 12:33 PM
Ochroma Lagopus Tekton
Fly Wheel's Avatar
Blackstock, South Carolina
Joined Sep 2007
1,829 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by birdofplay View Post
As an aero towed ULGlider that looks like fun !!!
The CG seems a bit aft but what do I know about this design.

Back "in the day" I had an Easy Riser by UFM.

It had Dihedral, Sweep back and some Washout too.

I dont recall any reflex in the Foils.
Plans are buried somewhere after my move.

Bob
I would imagine the seat is adjustable fore-aft to accomodate different pilot weights, as being the heaviest single component of the AUW the pilot would be the determining factor as far as CoG is concerned.
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Old Jan 01, 2013, 01:13 PM
less is more
Knoll53's Avatar
United States, CA, Marina
Joined Sep 2006
2,851 Posts
Well it may not be MY nurflugel, but at 29:35 there is a nice clip of, I believe, a Horten II flying in a thermal. Scattered through out the video there are some additional clips of the Horten II landing and launching, all of which I've never seen before. See 9:45. At least it appears to be original footage. I'm regularly fooled by modern computer graphics.

Kent

DOKU: Hitlers letzte Flieger (49 min 21 sec)
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Old Jan 01, 2013, 04:10 PM
I don't like your altitude
Stupot46's Avatar
Joined Sep 2011
3,325 Posts
Thanks for posting that Kent,some interesting footage(and bad re-enactment.)
What do you make of the pic?Can't stop frame it on the ipad.
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Old Jan 01, 2013, 04:15 PM
less is more
Knoll53's Avatar
United States, CA, Marina
Joined Sep 2006
2,851 Posts
That IS what it appears to be. A Horten wing with canard mounted up front. I have read about it before, don't know more about this version than to know that it did exist. I'm a little baffled as to what problem it is attempting to solve. In my experience, Hortens have good pitch stability, but need help with yaw stability.

Kent
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Old Jan 01, 2013, 04:16 PM
CNC Cutter
birdofplay's Avatar
United States, IN, Indianapolis
Joined Dec 2005
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Been looking but have not discovered an English version of that Movie.

Stupot46: Saw that and presume that it's a "safety" test.

Like they were working on elevator authority but weren't sure about it.

Bob
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Old Jan 01, 2013, 07:50 PM
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andrecillo76's Avatar
Heidelberg
Joined Oct 2009
379 Posts
The "canard" was an attempt to reduce the so called "Mitteneffekt". The Horten brothers found that, the center section produced less lift than predicted by their calculations. As far as I know, this Mitteneffekt is just a discrepancy between the calculation and the outcome and not a true effect. Most probably it was an artifact of the numerical method used failing at calculating the lift dirtibution of thick and swept back wings with a canopy on top and bottom. This Mitteneffekt was also the reason for the shape of the unusual "Horten-Parabola".

Cheers and Happy New Year,
Andrés
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Old Jan 01, 2013, 09:01 PM
internet gadfly
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Colorado
Joined Aug 2006
2,171 Posts
One of the sweep effects is that the cl/alpha curve on the forward-most part becomes shallower. The Hortens misinterpreted this as a lose of lift on the center section, as Andres indicated, it's just a shortcoming of the math available at the time. The vorflugel was an experiment to try and get the lift back. Since they didn't build another plane with it it apparently wasn't considered an improvement. However it also apparently didn't hurt very much either considering that this is one of the H-IIIs that was destroyed by hail at 26,000ft.

--Norm
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Old Jan 02, 2013, 02:45 AM
Registered User
Zurich
Joined Apr 2006
3,610 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Knoll53 View Post
Well it may not be MY nurflugel, but at 29:35 there is a nice clip of, I believe, a Horten II flying in a thermal. Scattered through out the video there are some additional clips of the Horten II landing and launching, all of which I've never seen before. See 9:45. At least it appears to be original footage. I'm regularly fooled by modern computer graphics.

Kent

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sGg5qyYU9z4
I think I can just barely make out the washout/wing-twist at 12:57, 13:39, and in the elevons at 13:49 in this video. Of course this would have to be increased at lower model-Rn.

Lee
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Old Jan 02, 2013, 03:17 AM
I don't like your altitude
Stupot46's Avatar
Joined Sep 2011
3,325 Posts
Andres,Norm,thanks for clearing that up.Hard to make out any support structure,but it sure looks a bit vulnerable stuck out there.
Any theories on it's aoa relative to the main wing?
Regards Stuart
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Old Jan 02, 2013, 09:30 AM
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Heidelberg
Joined Oct 2009
379 Posts
Stuart,

they felt that the wing was nose heavy due to the "Mitteneffekt", so I would expect the Vorflügel to fly with positive AOA to increase the total AOA. The exact amount depends on many paremeters, such as size, airfoil and distance of the Vorflügel, and the pitch stability of the main wing. I do not think that the Vorflügel was affecting much the flow of the main wing, besides the pitching moment produced by the Vorflügel's lift (in contrast to, e.g. slats in usual wing configurations). Thus, the effect of the Vorflügel can probably be obtained by changing the twist distribution or by deploying the elevons. I guess that was what they did in their later desings, explaining why it was not used anymore. If I remeber right, Reimer Horten used it again in one of their Argentinian gliders, but I do not know which one anymore .

Cheers,
Andrés
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Old Jan 02, 2013, 12:02 PM
Registered User
Colchester UK
Joined May 2004
419 Posts
Kent

Thanks for posting the link.

Is it really original footage of the Horten IX V1 at 32.38 and 38:40 ? I am not aware that any film has been shown before of it in flight.

John
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