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Old Nov 23, 2012, 05:51 PM
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United States, AR, Jacksonville
Joined Jul 2004
480 Posts
I just measered the angle from the middle of the recommended CG to the bottom of the mains. 50 degrees! No wonder it leaps into the air in an unscale fashion.

Anywho, I've finally finished getting my bird ready. Maiden tomorrow!

CG is at approximately 153mm with the gear retracted. I had to lower the recommended EPAs on the ailerons and rudder thrust vector from 150% to 125%. The aileron servo horns jam against their forward mounts if dialed further. The right exhaust cone also jams against the tail stinger if dialed any further. I had to add 1 ounce of lead to the forward nose gear compartment for balance, and that's with my 5000mAh 6S battery against the forward bulk head!
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Old Nov 23, 2012, 06:12 PM
dro56595@bigpo's Avatar
Australia, NSW, Williamtown RAAF
Joined Aug 2008
2,440 Posts
All the best for the maiden WW. She flies great, even if it takes some encouragement to get in the air. Don't be spooked about using some TV to get the nose off once it's gained some flying speed.
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Old Nov 23, 2012, 06:30 PM
Life begins at transition
Australia, VIC, Sale
Joined May 2007
3,593 Posts
+1. She flies beautifully, and looks even better

wrt 8s - depends on the size. 8s 4000 - easy! 8s 10,000, you're gonna need a long runway. 8s5000 would fit, but might need minor rework depending on the pack size.
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Old Nov 23, 2012, 06:38 PM
taildragger21's Avatar
park city
Joined Jul 2004
1,074 Posts
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Originally Posted by Odysis View Post
+1. She flies beautifully, and looks even better

wrt 8s - depends on the size. 8s 4000 - easy! 8s 10,000, you're gonna need a long runway. 8s5000 would fit, but might need minor rework depending on the pack size.
Awesome! may do that then..
Been flying my free wing eurofighter with vector thrust on all the time..
BUT I fly with wide open rates on everything..
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Old Nov 23, 2012, 08:27 PM
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United States, FL, Oviedo
Joined Dec 2008
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Anyone know where I can get replacement fans in the US ?

How bout any generic that will fit ?

WILL ANY 70MM 6 BLADE 4mm ROTOR WORK ?

Thanks
xxx
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Old Nov 23, 2012, 08:27 PM
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Australia, VIC, Melbourne
Joined Nov 2006
11,256 Posts
Well I almost got it all repaired.....

Both wing bolting/mount blocks pulled out of one side, or the other, of the wing/fuselage. They were quite clean breaks so epoxy fixed that up easily.
Then I found that the three aileron hinges were all 'not right' anymore.
It looks to me that they use a 'compressed foam' hinge, as per many small foamies use with no other hinge, and then the throw in three pinned hinges also. The three hinges were extremely sloppy in there mount holes, and epoxying them did not help as the issue is the mounting hole shape was all stretched/splayed open too much. Plus the entire aileron length has the foam hinge torn off. So I rehinged with four new hinges in new positions.

The big dent in the wings leading edge will be tricky to get right... so it will need a fair amount of work and effort to get back to correct. Plus another dent/broken-bit near the wing root of the leading edge.
I was about to start those last night when I decided to look over the rest of the plane....

One main gear oleo is BENT!! Almost a 10deg kink in its main thicker leg portion. Wow.
What must have happened is that when the plane hit the post it flicked into a spin that ended at a bit more than 90deg, and as it went through that it it 'flew' over the car park guttering - or actully hit that concrete edge - at some point of the spin. No doubt at about the 70deg distance of the spin, because the oleo is bent at about the 70deg mark from longitudal.

That will be fixable I am pretty sure, but seeing it was another thing of reasonable time frame to need to do, I gave up and went to bed! To resume repairs today....
I must remember not to do that again...... LET it run out to the fence line!

I will be working on setup strategies that the criteria is a smooth take-off BY 22metres!! And all the early testing failures (which will be many for sure) get aborted IMMEDIATELY that the allocated runway distance has been used up!
It is EASILY going fast enough to fly by that 22m so that is not the issue. Rotation/AoA is the issue, and I am sure I will be able to remedy that.

Maybe it will be ready and out for testing tomorrow.....

I had to take the Me-262 out instead (I can only take one 'big' plane, and 4 or 5 smaller planes up to 1200mm area). And I was going to take the Starmax F-16 instead, but it can ONLY run on a good runway, due to its narrow landing gear stance, and smaller wheels.... so I am holding off on taking it to the 'short 22m runway' for now.

.....
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Old Nov 23, 2012, 10:11 PM
I did it...
av8ersteve's Avatar
Morganton, NC
Joined Jun 2005
756 Posts
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Originally Posted by mikecopey View Post
xxx
Can someone please help this guy? He has asked several times and I just will not know until my SU shows up next week. I know someone here has to know.

Dude, if nothing else, I'm getting one next week and I'll grab my calibers and mic's from work.
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Old Nov 23, 2012, 10:39 PM
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United States, FL, Hollywood
Joined Aug 2010
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I take off with rockets and land without them. Either I used them on a mission or he did some editing.
SU35 Nice 1 VIDEO 11 17 12 (3 min 3 sec)
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Old Nov 23, 2012, 11:26 PM
You are a "go" for reentry
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High Orbit.....
Joined Jun 2009
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Another crash Pete? I guess if you go for spoilerons that will be crash number 3.

So many more success stories with the SU vs fails, they must be doing something right.
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Old Nov 23, 2012, 11:51 PM
dro56595@bigpo's Avatar
Australia, NSW, Williamtown RAAF
Joined Aug 2008
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Obsessing over small anomalies is a frequent cause of accidents. Some people just can't help it.
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Old Nov 24, 2012, 12:31 AM
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USA, MD, Frederick
Joined Jan 2010
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Originally Posted by dro56595@bigpo View Post
Obsessing over small anomalies is a frequent cause of accidents. Some people just can't help it.
It gives them something to obsess about when the plane is on the bench
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Old Nov 24, 2012, 06:58 AM
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Australia, VIC, Melbourne
Joined Nov 2006
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After straightening the oleo I remember why I had bought new better ones in the first place! The stock ones are weak.... nowhere near as solid and strong as the nose gear oleo, and not even truly adequate for the job. My new ones are the same size/type as the nose one. Plus those stock main oleos are pretty poor machining and don't slide cleanly - the new ones (again like the nose oleo) are like precision hydraulic rams! Smooth as silk and 100% reliable travel.
So I changed those over. The stock ones can go onto some smaller plane.

I modified the new oleos to match the stock lengths - you just drill and tap a new locator pin hole and cut the inner 'piston' leg shorter to suit your needs.
They are 100mm oleos, and the pin was relocated 11mm further inwards to make it a 89mm leg. The inner leg 'piston' is cut by 14mm, which softens the spring's compression. This is so it suits the operating range of a 3.5Kg Su-35 better than the oloe's strength as it comes - it is too strong as it comes.
The total oleo travel is the same as it was stock.

I used 60mm wheels instead. They are nicer and more robust, and the stock one has split its rim anyway. Being wider the new ones will traverse grass and rough ground better too (this has worked on several planes I have done that for).
I will also gain some static AoA - which I had checked it with the stock mains before and it was close to dead level, even with the 5mm nose gear blocks added. So the lower mains, and the front oleo being re-spaced to be 10mm further out, should be just what is needed.

The main gear wheel "bay" has to be slightly modified to suit the new total length and wheel.
So it is all almost ready for action again! Between the greater positive AoA, and 'optional' take-off mode settings, I am very confident the issue will be solved - well 99% for sure.
The "Issue" is: Not taking off smoothly in 22 metres (my limitation), and also not needing to do it in a 'jump' at all. (elevator/TV flick).
The "Successful Solution" criteria is that it flies itself off by 22 metres, every time guaranteed. Whether or not that needs a "take-off flight mode" setting, or not. But never with elevator flick, or pure manual up elevator.

....
I am yet to see ANYONE'S Su take off 'properly'. Some aren't too bad, but are till not totally right. The "jump" issue pretty well ruins any chance of it turning out dead right. And it is never going to be erasable in the stock form of the Su.

....
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Old Nov 24, 2012, 09:59 AM
You are a "go" for reentry
Maxthrottle's Avatar
High Orbit.....
Joined Jun 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PeterVRC View Post
...I am yet to see ANYONE'S Su take off 'properly'. Some aren't too bad, but are till not totally right. The "jump" issue pretty well ruins any chance of it turning out dead right. And it is never going to be erasable in the stock form of the Su.....
You haven't been watching much SU-4Evers video footage then. For that matter the R2F demo vids, Wargasms etc etc. Even off grass there has been a number of times that SU had a nice gentle climb out of the grass. It actually looked exactly like if not better than when they put the full scales through mud field poor runway takeoff conditions.

None the less you seem to be going in the wrong direction. At least others are not crashing in an effort to be perfectly scale regardless of conditions, setup or technique.

Oh and I should add regarding scale; The full scale SU-35 is 21.9m in length and has a min takeoff distance with normal load around 450m. To our 1.63m model to scale that would need a min runway of 33m. Normal roll outs however, are closer to 1000m which is closer to 75m. So you may be struggling to get something that not even the real ones do. And look at much of the SU footage. They do do a elevator flick unless on long run ways. I'll even go look for one for you.Look at 37 seconds into this most common demo vid. The aft view is just after the flick. http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...ou-_H8iw#t=34sOr 57 seconds into this vid http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...d4cd4Esw#t=57s
Look at most of the footage of takeoffs. They don't position the elevator and hold it till it reaches a natural climb speed. There is a distinct flick of the elevator and then back to neutral. For some reason.... you don't want to fly it the way the Russian pilots do. I'm sure you'll work it out.
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Old Nov 24, 2012, 02:30 PM
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United States, FL, Oviedo
Joined Dec 2008
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Originally Posted by av8ersteve View Post
Can someone please help this guy? He has asked several times and I just will not know until my SU shows up next week. I know someone here has to know.

Dude, if nothing else, I'm getting one next week and I'll grab my calibers and mic's from work.

Thanks !
I assumed these guys could answer this in the blink of an eye.....
Sure seems like a lot of knowledge based on previous 5000 posts....




Anyone know where I can get replacement fans in the US ?

How bout any generic that will fit ?

WILL ANY 70MM 6 BLADE 4mm ROTOR WORK ?



Thanks !
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Old Nov 24, 2012, 02:56 PM
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United States, NM, Clovis
Joined Oct 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikecopey View Post
Thanks !
I assumed these guys could answer this in the blink of an eye.....
Sure seems like a lot of knowledge based on previous 5000 posts....




Anyone know where I can get replacement fans in the US ?

How bout any generic that will fit ?

WILL ANY 70MM 6 BLADE 4mm ROTOR WORK ?

Thanks !
Banana Hobby has stock 70mm fan for $11.90. Its listed on the parts tab and in stock.

http://www.bananahobby.com/grey-camo...5411-prd1.html
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