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Old Sep 05, 2012, 05:53 PM
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United States, FL, Hollywood
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The MIG 29 clip was very impressive to me so I pulled the plug on one yesterday. It will be interesting to compare flight characteristics with the SU-35.
Mig29OVT 70mm twin 3D (3 min 45 sec)

http://www.toysonics.com/mig-29-360-...oor-flaps.html
Half the shipping cost with UPS.
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Old Sep 05, 2012, 05:55 PM
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hklagges's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by acesimmer View Post
I took a look at the T50 and must say I do not care for its lines.
Agreed 100%. IMHO it is rather ugly, nothing compared to a Su-34 or -35.

Cheers,
Henrik
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Old Sep 05, 2012, 06:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by urrl View Post
The MIG 29 clip was very impressive to me so I pulled the plug on one yesterday. It will be interesting to compare flight characteristics with the SU-35.
Oh, that's simple. The Lanxiang MiG-29 is a much worse design compared to the Su-35. I've had 2 LX MiGs so far and have one of them still flying, much souped up with better fans, motors and SBEC. The Su-35 has many design advantages, for example the wing spar, removable wings, reinforced wings, great hinges for the elevators, non-glued-in removable fans, non-glued-in servos, 17g servos on the elevators, landing gears that are not a total joke, more powerful fans and engines, much better designed vector nozzles with less power loss, accessibility of the electrical components, location of the battery compartment etc.

In flight, this results in the Su-35 having
  • more power
  • a lot more angular velocity along the roll axis (take a look at how small the ailerons are on the LX MiG)
  • much higher 3D capability (e.g. the elevators can take more stress)
  • higher speed (this is my subjective impression, not a measurement)
  • cleaner turns (again, my subjective impression)

The flight advantages of the MiG are:
  • Can fly slowly
  • Can fly veryvery slowly with flaps and leading edge slats extended, good for landing on grass

I do like the MiG, it looks good in the air, also, the Red Star version is visible over the long range. But the Su-35 is really a design generation ahead.

Cheers,
Henrik
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Old Sep 05, 2012, 06:57 PM
Should've, Would've, Could've
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United States, CA
Joined Dec 2010
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HK,

Thanks I've also been looking at the mig for awhile as its a great looking plane & putting new retracts and my own electronics, but after having the SU35 I think I'd be disappointed.
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Old Sep 05, 2012, 07:09 PM
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Wait, I know the PAK FA is not as stylish as a classic Flanker airframe design (Specially compared to the canard bi-seater versions) but still is to me one of the most beautiful aircraft ever designed!











Have you really seen it right?

Cheers!
Jandro.
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Old Sep 05, 2012, 07:13 PM
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Well, I would expect the main reason for picking the Mig would be for the looks - the fact it is that particular plane. And whatever a manner a Mig 'flies', is how it flies... and is part of that parcel.
I think they look awesome.... quite different to an Su, but both have great aspects to their shapes.
I only didn't get one (after checking things out about it for 6 months!) due to cost, and the LX 'lousy' components/operation. So the Su coming out was a clear winner then.

I myself would get the HK Composite if I wanted a Mig-29. If I even wanted TV, that could be done. (It has been on my hit list, under due diligence assessment, for a long time now.....)
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Old Sep 05, 2012, 07:15 PM
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The T-50 is just a Raptor Rip-off..... LOL

An abortion of throwing an Su-35 rear end onto the front 3/4 of a Raptor.
They probably cut and pasted pics to make that design! hehe
It might not even truly exist... could be all just photo-shopped pics..... Russian propaganda to annoy the US.... ha

I don't like it... there is something 'wrong' in its lines.
No "Ferrari" there. (not much in an F-22 either really)
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Old Sep 05, 2012, 07:21 PM
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Ahhh... I know what it is....
The mixture of ROUND and SQUARE.....
You can't have those together, at least not easy to do in a harmonious 'sensual' way. Ferrari show it can be done, to some degree..... Russia show how not to do it.

The Raptor looks good because it is ALL angular, and looks futuristic because of that. A bit alien to normally seen aircraft design, but eventually they will all be more like that and thus it will become 'normal'.

The T-50 messed it up with the angular nose, rather than sticking to the prior Su lines.
(It is mainly Round, but the lines they did it all in make it LOOK angular)

And I am sure it was all 'made for purpose', which is fine because they are after-all making a FIGHTER not a Fashion Model! LOL
Just not the prettiest fighter ever....
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Old Sep 05, 2012, 07:51 PM
Should've, Would've, Could've
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Both the Pak-Fa & J-20 are ripoffs of american design F22. I still think the F22 is the better looking of the 3 (personal opinion) , but would totally jump on a Freewing variation either the F22 or Pak-Fa. Although it would be cool if freewing did a J-20
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Old Sep 05, 2012, 09:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SU-4ever View Post
Wait, I know the PAK FA is not as stylish as a classic Flanker airframe design (Specially compared to the canard bi-seater versions) but still is to me one of the most beautiful aircraft ever designed!











Have you really seen it right?

Cheers!
Jandro.
There is a model coming out soon I think.

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Old Sep 05, 2012, 09:35 PM
Should've, Would've, Could've
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YF-23! Don't tease me!
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Old Sep 05, 2012, 09:58 PM
You are a "go" for reentry
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Well thanks all for sharing how you've been ogling your SU's. I fully expect the paint jobs to be redone in the form of Russian lady parts

Actually most sites show Sukhoi more so incorporated the F-23 proposed lines of angled and curved with a few F-22 add ons (wings).
Many also said the SU-27 was just a bigger F-15. Decades later its all SU-35 to be countered. So regardless of stolen or function meets certain form, its still to be seen how it operates. Neither the J-20 or the SU-50 are expected to out fly the F-22 head on fighter to fighter, they are expected to out pay load them with new longer range weapons getting close enough to use and counter them.

None of that matters to me though since I'm not attacking another country nor does my foam model show up on radar... if I had radar.
I just want a strong model that allows for a wide flight envelope, still manueverable, clean for speed, and easy to place everything. The F22 the main gear is seldom duplicated until you do it in a large turbine. The ordnance bay gets used as ducting and between the ducts is too tight to stow anything. The SU-50 is cavernous straight down the center.

This mean it'll be harder for pilots to break it, CG shifting is easier, Landing gear can be where its supposed to be, and there is plenty more room to stuff FPV in it again managing CG much more easily. Its for modellers reasons why I look forward to it.
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Old Sep 06, 2012, 06:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PeterVRC View Post
It might not even truly exist... could be all just photo-shopped pics..... Russian propaganda to annoy the US.... ha
Guess you were kidding.

Well, we do not share views, definitely.
The J-20, now that's a truly awful plane for me.
And the YF-23 I don't like too, only PAK-FA or F-22 win my likings for 5th gen. aircraft!

I will just say that the overall design of the PAK-FA seems more clever and makes more sense to me, for various reasons I won't comment to avoid boring the other RCG members. The only thing in which the raptor is really outstanding is its radar cross section. Don't think the russians will be able to match that (There are no public specs yet I think) Other than that, I believe the SU-50 is actually superior, don't know as a fighter but at least as a plane.

Cheers!
Jandro.
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Old Sep 06, 2012, 09:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maxthrottle View Post
Well thanks all for sharing how you've been ogling your SU's. I fully expect the paint jobs to be redone in the form of Russian lady parts

Actually most sites show Sukhoi more so incorporated the F-23 proposed lines of angled and curved with a few F-22 add ons (wings).
Many also said the SU-27 was just a bigger F-15. Decades later its all SU-35 to be countered. So regardless of stolen or function meets certain form, its still to be seen how it operates. Neither the J-20 or the SU-50 are expected to out fly the F-22 head on fighter to fighter, they are expected to out pay load them with new longer range weapons getting close enough to use and counter them.

None of that matters to me though since I'm not attacking another country nor does my foam model show up on radar... if I had radar.
I just want a strong model that allows for a wide flight envelope, still manueverable, clean for speed, and easy to place everything. The F22 the main gear is seldom duplicated until you do it in a large turbine. The ordnance bay gets used as ducting and between the ducts is too tight to stow anything. The SU-50 is cavernous straight down the center.

This mean it'll be harder for pilots to break it, CG shifting is easier, Landing gear can be where its supposed to be, and there is plenty more room to stuff FPV in it again managing CG much more easily. Its for modellers reasons why I look forward to it.
Max... Do you or anyone else have 3 view drawings of this showing stations etc.

Also, to answer your question from a page back. The foam would be inside the epoxy skin. Foam will be used sparingly in strategic place to add strength such as the wing root connections to secure spar etc. Also encasing the gear mount brackets and formed around battery trey.
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Old Sep 06, 2012, 10:04 AM
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Joined Jun 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by acesimmer View Post
Max... Do you or anyone else have 3 view drawings of this showing stations etc.....
First of all, not here. Thanks all for indulging these tangents from the SU-35 but Ace I'd have to meet you in the PakFa Su-50 thread in the scratch forum. I'm also mobile so remoting my PC from my phone is a little slow. I have a few from the web so they are out there. I also have a blue foam twin 64 version of the Su-50 giving me an idea of the potential and simplicity. I posted pictures showing how easy it was, even in the small 64, to drop a 5000 4S in the mid section.
Mitsu, I forget his company name, just made it too small and then closed up shop making a 70 size version for himself, not for distribution. So if anyone can give you CAD and section formers, he can; if he's willing to part with his work.
I have one unassembled for the very purpose of copying and enlarging the forms to scratch my own with a blow on hard coat if no one gets around to manufacturing it; which I can't see Freewing not doing since the SU-50 still incorporates the round TV nozzles. I hope they don't go J20 first but hey, they are after all an Asian company. The advantage with the J20 is they can do that in a Bifurcated single 90mm tucking the TV units in the body looking like the tail from that old Firefox.
And maybe, just maybe, they'll duplicate the CS/DPS fan for it
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