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Old Feb 27, 2004, 08:02 AM
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OK, so which one? Could the witness be more specific?

I get it htat you like Hosemonster. This is what they recommend for 3 Meter planes.

3 meter 1/8"ID x 1/8"wall x 100' with connectors $75.00
3 meter rubber in 2-50ft. sections with connectors $85.00
3 meter rubber in 1-50ft. section with connectors $40.00


Are you saying that you like and use one of these Fprintf?
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Old Feb 27, 2004, 08:19 AM
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I have been off of a hosemonster before and I liked it so much better than even my Hobby Lobby red heavy duty (3M) - something about a lot more stretch for a given amount of pull. I plan to get a hosemonster when my Hobby Lobby begins to die. It might be a while, though.

You got the sizes correct.
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Old May 11, 2004, 04:02 PM
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One of the guys in our club has the same hi-start I have, a NE Sail Large ( or is it X large) Likes it so much he about to replace is 8 year old rubber with new. Went launching off mine, which is 2 years old, and ordered the new rubber. He pulls it back to 33 pounds of pull and rockets his Sagitta 900 really high!

So, it is challenge of the rubber

NE Sail vs HoseMonster - flyers pull your hi-starts!


edit 6/1: I have the NESail X-large, not hte large
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Old May 11, 2004, 05:20 PM
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Some other histarts work very well but none better than those with mandrel formed rubber tubing like the Hose monster series.
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Old May 11, 2004, 06:02 PM
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Explain mandres formed rubber for me if you would Ollie. Mandrel formed as opposed to what?
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Old Jun 01, 2004, 03:50 AM
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i only have the multiplex bungee hi-start for 4m sailplanes locally and shipping from the states will cost a lot if i'm to go for hosemasters or dynaflites.
I am planning to try hi-start with my 2m sailplane and maybe get a 3m later on.
How much is the difference between latex rubber and bungee hi-starts?
Also in terms of launch ease and height attainable?
lot's of stuff to learn but well, it has to be done sooner or later
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Old Jun 01, 2004, 06:12 AM
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These are general statements. Your launches may vary and there are different names for the same things in different countries.

As I will use it here, bungee is a fabric covered elastic typically used to make hold downs for cars, boats and trucks. It comes in various diamaters and strengths. It's typical use does not require a lot of stretch relative ot its lengh. For example, in attaching something on the roof on my car, I might stretch the bungee 1/2 is length to get a VERY strong hold and my not be able to stretch it to double its rested length. That is due to its strength and the fabric covering.

If you use this to make a high start, you get a very powerful but very short pull. This puts a lot of stress on the plane. It may also limit the height as the total extended length will be less than with tubing. For example (I am making up numbers but I think they will be OK for an illustration ) 100 feet of 1/8" bungee and 400 feet of line - 500 feet at rest. You might be able to pull it 50 feet till you get to an 8 pound pull on the line with the fabric cover preventing you from pulling it further anyway. 8 pounds of pull is a good strong safe pull for a typical 2M plane. Total extended length 12 feet. The contraction will happen over a 50 feet in few seconds then there will be no more energy applied to the plane. Like a rocket launch, short and powerful.

Latex tubing, surgical tubing, mandrel dipped rubber are all used without a fabric covering. In use as a hi-start they are typically stretched to 3, 4 or more times their rested length. 100 feet of 1/4 inch tubing and 400 feet of line, 500 feet rested length. For the launch you pull this 300 feet to a total of 800 feet and get an 8 pound pull. The contraction will be over 300 feet and much longer period of time delivering a gentler but firm launch and delivering power much further up the launch.

If there is a good breeze, say 5-8 MPH, the tubing may never fully contract before the plane leaves the line meaning the plane can reach higher while still receiving power from the tubing.

I have only launched off a bungee launcher with my planes a few times. That day we were comparing a 1/8 inch OD bungee high start to a 3/16 tubing hi-start. We pulled them back until we got similar pulls on the planes, based on feel. Not scientific.

We were launching two very similar Great Planes Spirit Select 2M sailplanes. There was about a 3-5 mph breeze that day. Light breeze

The explosive snap of power from the bungee was impressive, did not launch the planes nearly as well and clearly put more stress on them. Someone more experienced with bungee, and a better size match up might have worked better.

Others who have more experience can give you better info.
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Old Nov 04, 2007, 05:57 PM
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I just came across this thread and thought it was worth a bump.

Anyone have any new tips on using hi-starts?
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Old Nov 11, 2007, 05:18 PM
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I am particularly interested in hearing from others, ways to increase the visibility of the line after it falls to the grass. I am forced to use non-coloured monofilament because that was what was available...
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Old Nov 11, 2007, 07:05 PM
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In the US, most hardware stores sell mason's line. This is the cord that brick layers use to make sure their rows are even.

It comes in bright colors. I use bright pink or bright orange. Shows up well against grass and dirt.
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Old Nov 11, 2007, 08:38 PM
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I too have the NSP extra large high start for 2+ years now. It works well and so far has been consistant. I am able to walk 100 full steps pulling which is just under 3 to one stretch on the 100 foot rubber. Our field is big but not quite big enough. I have to set up an an angle to the field to get a full stretch. Another thing I have learned is if you have camber control on the wing set your launch flaps near what you would use for normal thermal camber for the launch. Once you have made it through the transition at about 100 to 150 feet up start adding all the launch flaps you can. This will keep more tension on the line for a longer period of time. Once you get near the top remove the launch flaps and add reflex to help accellerate the ship for the zoom.
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Old Nov 26, 2007, 10:45 AM
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David,

I have not seen this launch method suggested before.

Slight camber - ( thermal type camber )

Then switch to much deeper camber ( Perhaps 25%?) soon after launch?

Then switch to reflex for the bounce

Complex launch process. Do you recommend this for all full house planes or just moldies?

How much tension are you using? A NSP XL at 100 steps, about 250-300 feet must be pulling over 30 pounds. How are you holding on to it?
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Old Nov 26, 2007, 05:44 PM
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If I use full launch camber (flaps) when I toss the superior/Xpro/Thermal Dancer with the High Start it usually stalls at 100 to 150' up and I spend the rest of the launch fighting it. If there is some wind I can use more camber but when there is no wind they stall. Reducing the amount of launch flaps until you get through the (what I call) transition works great. After getting through the transition I start to add all the nomal launch flaps and it increases the tension on the line and results in a higher launch. Switching to reflex allows the ship to accellerate much faster and allows a zoom if there is any head wind. The radio takes the complexity out of the process. I use the left slider and one switch for launch. I add camber with the slider and the switch to place the ship into speed mode which has the reflex. So I set the small amount of camber and toss the ship. I add more camber (flaps) soon after passing the transition, then flip the switch near the top to help accellerate for the zoom. For my Thermal Dancer I walk about 90 steps which I equate to about 15+ lbs. The full 100 steps is closer to 20 lbs (probably less). Is it a work out? You bet.
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Old Nov 30, 2007, 07:40 AM
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Seems my NESail XL is a lot stronger than yours.

Next time I use it to HS my Thermal Dancer I will try your approach. Thanks for sharing it.
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