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Old Jul 31, 2012, 06:09 PM
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T J Gilbert's Avatar
United States, MS, Ridgeland
Joined Feb 2009
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Thanks for the follow-up

Quote:
Originally Posted by KevinBuckley70 View Post
This was a case of 'operator error'. When calibrating the Gaui ESC's I was waiting for the musical tone sequence before dropping the throttle to zero. This is incorrect (& thank you to someone else on the Gaui thread for mentioning this). If you hear the musical tone sequence, you have waited too long. You have to wait for the monotone beeps which happen almost immediately on power-up then immediately drop the throttle to zero.

Having done that, the ESC's/Motors appear to be behaving as expected. Hopefully tomorrow I may get to have a first test flight.
We really appreciate your returning to the open subject/problem and sharing your solution.
Yet another case of easily miss-understood high tech electronics.
I'll bet you're not the first with this one.
Glad you searched over at Gaui, as that was good thinking.
Good to know that the Scorpion products will communicate with Naza!
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Old Jul 31, 2012, 06:12 PM
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France, IdF, Châtenay-Malabry
Joined Aug 2010
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Hello,

How to loose a multicopter at 5 km from take off.

My Epic Scarab Reconn who flew over Iguaçu falls has finally ended by my fault after I setup a new Graupner MX20. I used to fly it on my Spektrum DX8, safely within 700 meters as I was warned by telemetry alarm and could always turn back. I also fly my other Scarabs on Thomas Sherrer LRS.

I thought Thomas Scherrer is a little bit of overkill considering a multicopter autonomy so in an attemp to have only one system, I decided to test the Graupner MX20 who is supposed to have 4 km range!

This was my first time out with my new MX20 and as I decided to fly within 500m to check my first setup, I did not even setup my naza failsafe on RTH. By the way, I new the telemetry would bip before the RC could be out of range.

After about 300 meters I got a telemetry alarm but two seconds later it went on failsafe: hold last command. I could only start recording on my Carbonbird blackbox and watch the images till the end, 5 km away from take off.

Based on the images, I could go on the crash location, I could ear my Emcotec Locating beeper doing S.O.S. beep but based on the residential area, I could not access all gardens to search for the aircraft and decalred it lost after 2 hours of search.

Lessons:

- 900 mhZ / 500 mW from hobby wireless is a very good video gear, it kept the images till the end, 5 km away at an altitude below 100 meters, this with no diversity on the reception, simple stock omni antenna on my hat groundtation. I can sell my patch antenna

- Always setup properly your RTH if you have the option to do so

- Always do range test on ground when you first try a new RC transmitter

- Don't trust manufacturers... Finally my DX7 and DX8 appear to have more range than the latest Graupner HOTT technology!

- I will keep my Thomas Scherre LRS

- I may search for a more efficient locating system.

Graupner MX20 shorter range than expected, crash at 5 km, video downlink still worked (4 min 37 sec)


Gregory
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Old Jul 31, 2012, 07:34 PM
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Joined Feb 2005
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That sucks. Have you tried the Loc8tor for finding a lost platform? I heard it works good. I had an MX-20 also using a 500mw 1280 vtx on a quad. I could only get to 300m and I was at 15% RSSI via the voice readout. It's back in the box and my UHF is back on my quad. It may be overkill but at least I don't worry about losing a signal.
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Old Jul 31, 2012, 08:18 PM
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Future NAZA buyers they also wont read the manual!-http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xsamw...eature=related
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Old Jul 31, 2012, 08:56 PM
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Thank you, Goldsworthy,TJ Gilbert, and MorrisM for your suggestionsI will definitly check each link out. Cheers!
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Old Jul 31, 2012, 10:16 PM
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United States, MS, Ridgeland
Joined Feb 2009
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Manual Readers

Quote:
Originally Posted by goldsworthy View Post
Future NAZA buyers they also wont read the manual!-http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xsamw...eature=related
As TahoeEd, Muaro, and You (I think) suggested, I'm trying to sight Naza Manual pages as reference to answers I'm giving (when I can) to point out the need for reading the instructions...
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Old Jul 31, 2012, 10:24 PM
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United States, MS, Ridgeland
Joined Feb 2009
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Recent article

Quote:
Originally Posted by Musictree View Post
Thank you, Goldsworthy,TJ Gilbert, and MorrisM for your suggestionsI will definitly check each link out. Cheers!
In one of the RC magazines or on one of the forums, there has been a recent article about a gentleman like yourself who taught himself how to manipulate both sticks of a conventional transmitter with one hand.
A close-up made it appear that he had his thumb on the LH stick, and his pinky finger on the RH stick.
If you're good with your usable hand, this might be a possibility.
Try it on a simulator...
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Old Aug 01, 2012, 02:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goldsworthy View Post
Future NAZA buyers they also wont read the manual!-http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xsamw...eature=related
Sensor, sensor, sensor! (cant wright what you really like to say!)

Couldn't watch it all the way.....CRINGE FACTER!

Next clip will be some knob flying copter over residential area 5km away, crashing and chopping some poor kid head off!
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Old Aug 01, 2012, 02:30 AM
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Australia, QLD, Brisbane
Joined Jun 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mewert View Post
Have you tried different flight modes to see if it affects all? Cold solder joints on the power plate? Tether it down when testing to save breaking it. Seems like one motor or esc could be intermitant and the FC is trying to keep up with it making it look like the whole thing is messing up and jerking around. If you try replacing one component at a time, you might be able to pin the culprit down.
Yeah I agree, eliminate things one by one. It's a tedious way of troubleshooting but about all you can do.

Your radio isn't doing something strange is it? I suppose that would show up in the Naza assistant TX monitor if it was.

I'd also disable all the GPS/mag related stuff temporarily to see if that makes a difference.
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Old Aug 01, 2012, 03:54 AM
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Italia, Piemonte, Biella
Joined Feb 2011
394 Posts
second day of flying with naza on my medium lift quad, and after 4 mins of flight i landed to check motor and esc temps. everything was ok, so i take off again and after several seconds, as i give a left yaw command, the copter loses altitude and pitches forward quite badly. i had to give full back stick to keep it level. I managed to land, disconnected battery, checked all connections, put power back on and flew for other 4 mins flawlessly. Here's the onboard video... any ideas as why this happened?

naza test loss control (0 min 57 sec)
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Old Aug 01, 2012, 05:41 AM
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Brasil, CE, Fortaleza
Joined Jun 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by glambert View Post
Hello,

How to loose a multicopter at 5 km from take off.

My Epic Scarab Reconn who flew over Iguaçu falls has finally ended by my fault after I setup a new Graupner MX20. I used to fly it on my Spektrum DX8, safely within 700 meters as I was warned by telemetry alarm and could always turn back. I also fly my other Scarabs on Thomas Sherrer LRS.

I thought Thomas Scherrer is a little bit of overkill considering a multicopter autonomy so in an attemp to have only one system, I decided to test the Graupner MX20 who is supposed to have 4 km range!

This was my first time out with my new MX20 and as I decided to fly within 500m to check my first setup, I did not even setup my naza failsafe on RTH. By the way, I new the telemetry would bip before the RC could be out of range.

After about 300 meters I got a telemetry alarm but two seconds later it went on failsafe: hold last command. I could only start recording on my Carbonbird blackbox and watch the images till the end, 5 km away from take off.

Based on the images, I could go on the crash location, I could ear my Emcotec Locating beeper doing S.O.S. beep but based on the residential area, I could not access all gardens to search for the aircraft and decalred it lost after 2 hours of search.

Lessons:

- 900 mhZ / 500 mW from hobby wireless is a very good video gear, it kept the images till the end, 5 km away at an altitude below 100 meters, this with no diversity on the reception, simple stock omni antenna on my hat groundtation. I can sell my patch antenna

- Always setup properly your RTH if you have the option to do so

- Always do range test on ground when you first try a new RC transmitter

- Don't trust manufacturers... Finally my DX7 and DX8 appear to have more range than the latest Graupner HOTT technology!

- I will keep my Thomas Scherre LRS

- I may search for a more efficient locating system.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h7WTSf_LQ3g

Gregory
Sorry for your loss but you should not test it without failsafe setup, this was the major reason that I got GPS for. Hope did not hit or injure anyone and hope this is a GOOD VIDEO LEASON for what NOT TO DO. Like I and a lot here say, FLY SAFE, that means, test and retest your equip prior a flight. Myself I use a 900Mzh transmitter that is capable to go over 20Km on my quad and still have setup failsave prior 1st flight, you will never know what is going to happen, even with that system lost control of my SkyWalker within a range of 200mt.

FLY SMART, HAVE FUN AND FLY SAFE.

Mauro
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Old Aug 01, 2012, 05:44 AM
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Brasil, CE, Fortaleza
Joined Jun 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thepelell View Post
second day of flying with naza on my medium lift quad, and after 4 mins of flight i landed to check motor and esc temps. everything was ok, so i take off again and after several seconds, as i give a left yaw command, the copter loses altitude and pitches forward quite badly. i had to give full back stick to keep it level. I managed to land, disconnected battery, checked all connections, put power back on and flew for other 4 mins flawlessly. Here's the onboard video... any ideas as why this happened?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7SGus...ature=youtu.be
This look like a problem that I have with my batteries. I was using 3S 5000mha and it was flying fine, then after just add a OSD and GPS is start to do strange things. A quick and easy fix if you are not using alredy is to use 4S batteries, that solve all my problems. This is my 2 cents and hope it helps.

Mauro
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Old Aug 01, 2012, 06:04 AM
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Italia, Piemonte, Biella
Joined Feb 2011
394 Posts
i am already using 4s batts. My setup is ipower 2814 750kv motors, simonK 25A escs, 12x4 xoar wood props, 4s 5000 lipo. AUW 2900g.
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Old Aug 01, 2012, 06:48 AM
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Here's a new video of mine

Cruddcopter sleeps with the fishes. R.I.P (4 min 15 sec)
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Old Aug 01, 2012, 07:19 AM
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T J Gilbert's Avatar
United States, MS, Ridgeland
Joined Feb 2009
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Heavy

Quote:
Originally Posted by thepelell View Post
i am already using 4s batts. My setup is ipower 2814 750kv motors, simonK 25A escs, 12x4 xoar wood props, 4s 5000 lipo. AUW 2900g.
2900g = 6lb 6.3oz
That's heavier than average.
Have you done some power calculations to determine if you are underpowered?
Is your ESC, motor, prop, battery choice in keeping with these calculations?
I know that you said temps were okay, but you might check your watts with a Wattsup Meter or something similar.
Along Mauro's line of reasoning, you might be able to go to 5S if your system can handle it.
Naza/VU can.
VU = 2S to 6S
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