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Old Jan 04, 2012, 01:40 PM
Should've, Would've, Could've
v8truckin's Avatar
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NS,

I was running 12awg wire for exactly that reason, weight. Which you should be able to get away with your setup. Good luck with your eye.
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Old Jan 04, 2012, 01:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maxthrottle View Post
Small thing; it looks like you turned the centre channel vent around to exhaust rather than take air in.

How deep is that centre channel? Either way I was going to see if I could mount my ESC's the same way I did with my 34. Add a cheat at the top of the duct just ahead of the fan almost like the Euro and put the ESC in it. That took care of air flow over the ESC by sucking air through the internals of the fuse including the center channel, into the duct. I figure it to be hollow like the 34 since the Mains and the aileron radio wires run above the duct. Freewing likely wouldn't make it solid foam if I'm seeing your pictures correctly. If its not hollow where I hope it to be then I was going to cut just under the existing cheats and place the ESC's side by side partially in the duct partially in the channel partially exposed running the wires through the centre channel.

For you though with larger battery I would have thought you wanted to keep some weight in the tail.The over all weight of the wire unless you gauge up is the same cause you're just repositioning the ESCs.
Small note: The Centre Channel Vent was already mounted like this when I got it

I would need to make another measurement on the depth of the centre channel if you want.

But I think for me, I'll be placing the esc in the vent channel, but then have long cable wires

My Battery is smaller and lighter then you think Max

Altough it is a 6200mah Battery Pack, it weights like 40 grams more then an E-Flite 6S 5000mah Battery, plus has some very good dimensions, but is just a little on the tall side but not by much.

My 6200mah Pack weights 876grams.

NS
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Old Jan 04, 2012, 01:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by v8truckin View Post
NS,

I was running 12awg wire for exactly that reason, weight. Which you should be able to get away with your setup. Good luck with your eye.
Thought so Truckin.

When we got the Prototype, they used even smaller cables and used a deans Y-Harness Battery Connection for 2x3s packs. Unfortunately the cables became warm and the dean plus very hot!

That is why they also changed now their connection plugs to bigger Bullet Connectors.

NS.
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Old Jan 04, 2012, 01:59 PM
Should've, Would've, Could've
v8truckin's Avatar
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ya don't like deans, had a few burn on static tests. Switched all my connectors using 6s to ec5 & 4s below to ec3. Lol more expensive but piece of mind.
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Old Jan 04, 2012, 02:01 PM
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The Depth of the esc access hatch/vent channel is 4.3cm/1.7inches before it touches the cover.

I moved now the cover around for the air to come in

NS.
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Old Jan 04, 2012, 04:11 PM
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I know NS... but its not like thats a small battery since they were intending in the 650g range. But you know I've flown just as heavy with the Euro. Still you have almost the weight entire gear set more than recommended batts sitting in that battery ahead of CG and moving the two only movable items, the ESC's forward as well. Correction.... actually thinking about it its a good idea to move the ESC's forward if it means you can then move the battery back where V8 couldn't move it any further forward. However, I wouldn't move it all the way to the belly vent. Like you said the channel is tight for ESC's. The vent is partially baffled by the cross bar so not a lot of air flow there. The Vent looks to be there to draw air from the battery bay via the 6 forward slot holes and aft through the channel into the duct. I'd mount the motors in first since they can't move before I did anything else. I really hope just aft of the bar above the duct is hollow!!!!!!!

Thanks for the measurement of the channel depth.

Gauge; Because the power at each ESC is below 70amps, 12 gauge should be fine as long as the motor wires are not extended beyond 250mm range. Above that they could get a little hot. Try to make certain the three Motor wires are the same length too. I read an article that differing wire length change the resistance causing the ESC to read the timing less efficiently. Not sure how true this is but can't hurt.
The battery to ESC has to be heavier because it is carrying the watts and supply for the combined amp value. So they should be 10 or even 8. Many get away with less which is fine, but this just translates to waist watts in the form of heat usually.
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Last edited by Maxthrottle; Jan 04, 2012 at 04:52 PM. Reason: Correction
Old Jan 04, 2012, 04:51 PM
Should've, Would've, Could've
v8truckin's Avatar
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Understandable as most batteries in the 6s category come with 10awg wires, so no worries. If your running 2 3s batteries to the esc's that's a different story as those come with 12-14awg wire. Now the battery side of the esc is typically 12-13awg for 60a esc & the 80a esc that I have can range from 11awg to 12awg. I have a couple few 100a esc but don't remember (famous words) what the wire is rated @. I would think wire gauge would be sufficient & not need to switch to 10 or 8awg wire on batt esc side unless your running 3s batts, but even then 4 wires should handle the load...no? I would think the weak link is the connectors rating?

So Max you gonna change the wire gauge on the esc between the batt connector on this setup?
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Last edited by v8truckin; Jan 04, 2012 at 04:56 PM.
Old Jan 04, 2012, 05:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by v8truckin View Post
Understandable as most batteries in the 6s category come with 10awg wires. If your running 2 3s batteries to the esc's that's a different story as those come with 12-14awg wire. Now the battery side of the esc is typically 12-13awg for 60a esc & the 80a esc that I have can range from 11awg to 12awg. I have a couple few 100a esc but don't remember (famous words) what the wire is rated @. I would think wire gauge would be sufficient & not need to switch to 10 or 8awg wire on batt esc side. I would think the weak link is the connectors rating.

So Max you gonna change the wire gauge on the esc between the batt connector on this setup?
I usually do but not likely for this one.

If you read details from most ESC manufacturers, they are not expecting you to add much more wire length on the provided 12AWG and less when near the limit of the ESC. The serious competition guys start cutting their battery pack lines very short. The idea behind that had been documented in the Dean arguments where because the length of wire is short though of lower gauge, the resistance is about the same. Most people instead don't cut down their battery wires and even add additional adaptors with wire length instead of standardizing there Battery connectors. The result is they quickly are above the max span between the batt and ESC because they aren't counting between and including the battery wires themselves.
CC has 12 gauge as a standard unless you go HV. I wish they would just have connector sockets on their ESC rather than any length of wire at all for that very reason.
But Deans also made a good point where doing everything in 10awg starts getting heavy.

So at a glance because the span from battery bay to Motor looks to be about 400mm, can't tell cause you guys still haven't posted these lengths (No worries mine should be here on Friday), it should be OK at 12. The weight may not be worth the heat or that is going to 10 may not be worth the effort due to its weight. I won't decide till I have it in hand to optimize against the final motor choice.

The 2X3S 4KmAh+ 45C is a good example. Next time you set one up in pairs, check the heat of the final wire from the Battery set to the ESC. Its hotter than all the rest because its carrying the load of both batteries. If I start going above 300mm I shorten the red wires of my batts and go up a gauge for the span if in the initial test things appear a little hot. In the end I see in some cases an additional 50-200 Watts from these simple considerations depending on the setup of course.

To measure it out I just get some wire or rope or string starting from the motors to the battery. The Euro in e.g. I beleive was toasting some of the ESCs because it was at its max span on 12awg with deans, the addition of the harness and battery wires. Thus many were burning their stuff out at the ESC not understanding why.
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Old Jan 04, 2012, 05:36 PM
Should've, Would've, Could've
v8truckin's Avatar
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Ah words of wisdom thanks for the info. I wonder since the SU35 PNP version has 2 x 55a esc's people will have the same fate eventually as in the euro thread, failed esc's. I could only imagine them putting no bigger than 13awg on 55a esc's then add in the length of esc to motor ... Might not be good.
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Old Jan 04, 2012, 06:05 PM
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Test...
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Old Jan 04, 2012, 08:15 PM
Throttle Bender
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I just ordered one from BH yellow green camo. Not sure they exist. With the AMA show. A new warehouse. I will be patiently holding my breath. Hoping for no reason to have to contact customer disservice.
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Old Jan 04, 2012, 08:32 PM
Should've, Would've, Could've
v8truckin's Avatar
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Joined Dec 2010
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What made u choose them & wait, rather than vendor who already stock and ship em? Just wondering?
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Old Jan 04, 2012, 08:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by merlinfan View Post
I just ordered one from BH yellow green camo. Not sure they exist. With the AMA show. A new warehouse. I will be patiently holding my breath. Hoping for no reason to have to contact customer disservice.
I got an email saying they got the shipment in and will be out in the next 3 days. Ordered grey camo originally and took advantage of free shipping offer they had. Pnp for $320 shipped is not that bad.
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Old Jan 04, 2012, 08:54 PM
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I did exactly the same thing (But stayed with gray camo.) Simply can't beat that price in the USA. Time will tell whether or not we made a good call - I'm willing to wait, but I'm betting on a Valentine's day ETA. In the interim we can monitor this thread to determine what mods will be required for a safe flight - Hopefully nothing major will be needed. Early reports are encouraging, but sparse.
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Old Jan 04, 2012, 10:51 PM
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I think gray looks better but I think the desert camo will be easier to spot on those days with gray skies, which we get all year long here.
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