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Old Feb 28, 2012, 01:01 PM
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United States, GA, Marietta
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Hiya Joel... I normally land before. The Hyperions I have been setting timer for 3mins 30 secs... then they are fully recharged. I have never heard the LVC sound before, so do not know if that is what I heard with the wah wah wah sound... it was almost like the wind may have caused it. I mean literally you put in a fresh battery... throttle it full in your hand and it makes that sound but only sometimes.. and sometimes it will just go to normal after making the sound (could it be the prop in the wind?). Doubtful it is lvc though as I have then flown the plane for 3-4 mins... with no problems. The other sound (this one happened yesterday in zero wind and was caused when I just put the stick to full throttle VERY quickly, then kinda caught up to itself and sounded normal) is one like if something was not fully attached to an electric motor... you spool up the motor and it starts to catch then over a second catches up to the motor sound and THEN sounds normal. Hard to describe... why I was thinking loose prop. Bad thing is weather looks poor for the next week... I want to see if it still does this after putting a screwdriver on the prop screw. Joel... I know you have swapped motors... if the screw is loose will the prop come off? and how tight do you tighten it? Feeling it with fingers it did not feel loose at all.. and motor turned whenever I spun the prop. I really hope I am not developing an ESC problem. Have you guys noticed any weird electrical anamolies with the hyperions, or more specifically the 240's? Cannot rule out the charger... have no idea what I am putting back in the batteries... but weird both noise and conditions will come and go... on the same batteries. LVC would not "fix" itself I would think... why it worries me.
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Old Feb 28, 2012, 01:13 PM
Gone Huckin'
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Charlotte, NC
Joined Jan 2011
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If you're flying for 3-4 minutes then you're not likely getting anywhere near LVC. I set my timer for 6 minutes. With the 240's I fly a little past my timer but with my 180's I land pretty much when the timer goes off.

I usually put less than 80% back into my batteries and their voltgage/cell usually averages around 3.7 or 3.8.

I hardly ever use full throttle but still... I'd say that a solid 5 minutes is easily achievable.
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Old Feb 28, 2012, 02:06 PM
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East Bethel, MN USA
Joined Jul 2009
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DS,

My experience follows Turnerm's. I agree - it is very unlikely that you're hitting LVC. Regarding any problems with the Hyp 240s - sometime last year, i did end up with three defective Hyp 240 cells while building UMX packs. One of the packs simply faded away before it even hit 50 cycles - similar to the Eflite packs & most of the cheapies. On the other pack, one cell ballooned after less than 50 cycles.

Hyperion claims a 1:1000 failure rate due to cell defects. So, it is certainly possible to get a defective Hyp cell, although it is a relatively rare occurrence.

BTW - running the Beast 3D on the stock prop & motor, I was getting 6 minutes to the 80% discharge point with a Hyp 180 pack - while flying similarly to what you see in the video below:

EFlite UMX Beast 3D Maiden (9 min 16 sec)


Running the 5043 prop & stock motor, I was getting ~6:20 to the 80% discharge point with my Hyp 240 packs. With my Hyp 180 packs, I only got 4:45 to the 80% discharge point.

Joel
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Old Feb 28, 2012, 04:43 PM
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United States, GA, Marietta
Joined Dec 2011
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I definitely have a problem... either motor/ESC or the hyper batteries.

Had a break in the weather over lunch break.. my local baseball field. Put in my first 240.. slowly brought up throttle... sounded fine. Brought it to full throttle normal sound... 4 minute flight, no issues. Put in second 240.. throttle up.. the sound. Listening closely if normal full throttle is say 20,000 rpms and smooth.. this is a warbling sound throughout the throttle range. At full throttle I'd say it is running maybe 13,000ish rpms.. with a wah wah sound. Dropped throttle... turned the prop by hand (which also turned motor).. throttle... made the sound again and then went right to normal full throttle. Up and down on the throttle.. sounded fine. Thinking maybe it is that single hyperion... put in my third fresh one... throttle went straight into the wah wah low rpm.

Not good.

Does anyone know if the Celestra charger will charge these... hoping it is just a charging/charer issue. What charger would be ok for the hyperions... cheapest one as my budget is slightly depleted lol? Of course would also have to have the connector for the UMX batteries.
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Old Feb 28, 2012, 07:14 PM
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Australia, VIC, Melbourne
Joined Jan 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dragonshade View Post
I definitely have a problem... either motor/ESC or the hyper batteries.

Had a break in the weather over lunch break.. my local baseball field. Put in my first 240.. slowly brought up throttle... sounded fine. Brought it to full throttle normal sound... 4 minute flight, no issues. Put in second 240.. throttle up.. the sound. Listening closely if normal full throttle is say 20,000 rpms and smooth.. this is a warbling sound throughout the throttle range. At full throttle I'd say it is running maybe 13,000ish rpms.. with a wah wah sound. Dropped throttle... turned the prop by hand (which also turned motor).. throttle... made the sound again and then went right to normal full throttle. Up and down on the throttle.. sounded fine. Thinking maybe it is that single hyperion... put in my third fresh one... throttle went straight into the wah wah low rpm.

Not good.

Does anyone know if the Celestra charger will charge these... hoping it is just a charging/charer issue. What charger would be ok for the hyperions... cheapest one as my budget is slightly depleted lol? Of course would also have to have the connector for the UMX batteries.
I'm not 100% sure but it sounds a little like the LVC issue with fully charged batteries ... try little throttle for the first minute ... there are posts on this thread about the brick behaving like this.
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Old Feb 28, 2012, 07:22 PM
Gone Huckin'
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Charlotte, NC
Joined Jan 2011
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Originally Posted by mutha View Post
I'm not 100% sure but it sounds a little like the LVC issue with fully charged batteries ... try little throttle for the first minute ... there are posts on this thread about the brick behaving like this.
Never heard of that on the 3D Beast. On the Gee Bee yes, but not here.
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Old Feb 28, 2012, 07:44 PM
Too much to do not enough time
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Wisconsin
Joined Sep 2010
273 Posts
Actually, what Mutha said has happened to me several times. While I'm using a crappy eflite 120mah battery, it does this. I once plugged it in, taxied out, and pegged the throttle to do a hover right off the bat. It climbed up, and then within 2 seconds lost power, started pulsing. It nosed over and bent my wing up. I recharged the battery, and started out gently. Did a circle or 2 in the air at 1/3 throttle, then came back down for a hover. held it rock solid for 10+ seconds and then I did a full-power vertical climb. No issues whatsoever.

While this might not be it, it's worth a try. Again, my battery is a piece of crap, but the behavior is very similar to what you're saying....
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Old Feb 28, 2012, 07:47 PM
Gone Huckin'
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Charlotte, NC
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Yea but you're using a crappy battery and he's using good Hyperions. Not really apples to apples there.
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Old Feb 28, 2012, 08:43 PM
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United States, GA, Marietta
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Well everyone... looks like we have a motor failure. Took the Beast to my LHS (where I bought her).. hooked it up for the RC plane guy to hear. We put the throttle to 1/3 and there it was sounding crappy and warbling.. then went to normal.. then back. Throttled up and it kept doing it. We hooked up 3 different fully charged batteries and same thing. Almost like I was hitting a button... normal... crappy half power and warble sound... back to normal. He tried adjusting my throttle setting down and then did some test he claimed would show a glitch if it was the ESC... no change. Then went on to say his buddy had some plane he took out the box and did this... it was a motor stater problem and I should call Horizon.

IMO as much as I love this plane a motor issue in less than 1 month and 40 (maybe) flights.. not cool. Guess I'll be calling Horizon tomorrow, I have read they take care of people. I do not want to be without the plane, really do not want to cut decals and crack the fuse on a defective 3 week old plane, and will be mentioning a few things I had knowingly overlooked until this current issue... the tail does not seem to be centered fully from the factory. Noticed it does take about 4-5 clicks to the right rudder to trim after surfaces are manually centered (noticed this about 5 flights in). The right lower aileron is a bit too low.. top aileron is dead on, left side is perfect, but lower right is a few mm down. I would be very happy if they will exchange the plane given everything, and will fill you guys in on the convo.

Wish me luck... we shall see.
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Old Feb 28, 2012, 08:53 PM
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United States, MI, Grand Traverse
Joined Oct 2008
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Beast Down!

I got a chance today to fly at an indoor field that puts even Joel's to shame! It was in a indoor soccer field, but not the small indoor sized fields, a regulation soccer field! 360ftx260ft with 75ft ceilings. There was about 50-60 people flying there. And I was flying just fine then in the middle of a nice scale loop, on the downline of all places, I lost all control inputs. I watched helpless as my beast pounded itself straight down into the AstroTurf. Completely fractured one wing and the vertical support. Servo was hanging by the horn and wire, 2 of the other wings cracked 1/2 - 2/3 of the way through. It was painful. I didn't have my camera with me or I'd post pics. It was repairable and I fixed it already. Lots of CA, CF, and a sharpie to hide the scars.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dragonshade View Post
the tail does not seem to be centered fully from the factory. Noticed it does take about 4-5 clicks to the right rudder to trim after surfaces are manually centered (noticed this about 5 flights in). The right lower aileron is a bit too low.. top aileron is dead on, left side is perfect, but lower right is a few mm down.
When trimming these umx planes, especially the AS3X ones, you should use, small pliers to manually adjust the "u" bend in the rods. The right rudder probably has nothing to do with trim and has to do with p-factor. Check the rudder trim while gliding the plane, not under power to confirm it is in fact rudder and not asymmetric thrust caused by the AoA and prop pitch. My beast also has the aileron on one side slightly out. I just set the plane up so that it was equally out on both top and bottom wings. It is less than 1mm so I'm not to worried on mine. Good luck with HH customer support, they usually do right when things are defective.

-Brian
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Old Feb 28, 2012, 10:02 PM
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United States, GA, Marietta
Joined Dec 2011
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Originally Posted by kalmon View Post
Beast Down!

I got a chance today to fly at an indoor field that puts even Joel's to shame! It was in a indoor soccer field, but not the small indoor sized fields, a regulation soccer field! 360ftx260ft with 75ft ceilings. There was about 50-60 people flying there. And I was flying just fine then in the middle of a nice scale loop, on the downline of all places, I lost all control inputs. I watched helpless as my beast pounded itself straight down into the AstroTurf. Completely fractured one wing and the vertical support. Servo was hanging by the horn and wire, 2 of the other wings cracked 1/2 - 2/3 of the way through. It was painful. I didn't have my camera with me or I'd post pics. It was repairable and I fixed it already. Lots of CA, CF, and a sharpie to hide the scars.


When trimming these umx planes, especially the AS3X ones, you should use, small pliers to manually adjust the "u" bend in the rods. The right rudder probably has nothing to do with trim and has to do with p-factor. Check the rudder trim while gliding the plane, not under power to confirm it is in fact rudder and not asymmetric thrust caused by the AoA and prop pitch. My beast also has the aileron on one side slightly out. I just set the plane up so that it was equally out on both top and bottom wings. It is less than 1mm so I'm not to worried on mine. Good luck with HH customer support, they usually do right when things are defective.

-Brian
Understood, and yes out of the box it needed adjustment, I am speaking of after all surfaces are manually straightened. Good tip on the glide rudder check. I had chalked it up to torque only, but lol... after an engine fail worth mentioning to Horizon. The aileron is only the lower right. The CF support links with the aileron CF rod so really no adjustment, just off from the build.

P.s... that sucks. What was the loss of input from?
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Old Feb 29, 2012, 07:23 AM
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Joined Jul 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kalmon View Post
Beast Down!

I got a chance today to fly at an indoor field that puts even Joel's to shame! It was in a indoor soccer field, but not the small indoor sized fields, a regulation soccer field! 360ftx260ft with 75ft ceilings. There was about 50-60 people flying there. And I was flying just fine then in the middle of a nice scale loop, on the downline of all places, I lost all control inputs. I watched helpless as my beast pounded itself straight down into the AstroTurf. Completely fractured one wing and the vertical support. Servo was hanging by the horn and wire, 2 of the other wings cracked 1/2 - 2/3 of the way through. It was painful. I didn't have my camera with me or I'd post pics. It was repairable and I fixed it already. Lots of CA, CF, and a sharpie to hide the scars.
lol i crashed mine on its second flight only, flying around a parking lot theres a huge pine tree, first pass just miss it im like "yep wont go near there again" then in the back ground i hear 3 or 4 people start yelling stuff "oh look is that a bird, no someones flying it" followed by laughing and loud talking to yelling "look its a bird, its a plane no its superman ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha" really annoyed the F$#@ out of me and put me off i momenterally lost direction of the plane and wack 20ft plus up in the tree, i turned around to look at the people who put me off and was a bunch of old turds on there afternoon walk, so after climbing the tree and the now onlookers yelling at me to be careful and dont climb that tree what are you an idiot i rescured my plane, damage was a lost front battery cover "no idea where that went", front broken, broken wing tip, broken left wing support, 3 of the carbon fibre bits that attach to the wing came off, rear tail broken, so i took it home, nursed my wounds with a cold beer and a hot curry and then fixed it.... Its now all glued and back together, but i have been having problems with trimming ie needing still a fair bit and looked in the manual what you where talking about so i now have to adjust all my U bends because out of the box they where not right..... thanks for the sharpie idea i have a black and a red one and now the plane looks just fine haha




btw anyone know if you can fly the beast without a battery hatch???? mine dosnt come in for a few days should i just wait or can i still fly it?
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Old Feb 29, 2012, 08:15 AM
Too much to do not enough time
BobaFett1138's Avatar
Wisconsin
Joined Sep 2010
273 Posts
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Originally Posted by keithy351 View Post
btw anyone know if you can fly the beast without a battery hatch???? mine dosnt come in for a few days should i just wait or can i still fly it?
I actually lost my battery hatch on flight one time. grazed a tree branch, ripped the hatch off and knocked it out of the air. Luckily, I recovered, but flying without the hatch was not cool. adds a LOT of drag to the airframe. You can try it, but I would just wait. It's like trying to pull a brick through the air.

Oh, and dragonshade, if you can't get a motor out of them, I have a practically brand-new Beast3D motor that I want to get rid of. I'll let it go cheap. Anyway, good luck with Horizon!
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Old Feb 29, 2012, 08:35 AM
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United States, MI, Grand Traverse
Joined Oct 2008
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Originally Posted by BobaFett1138 View Post
I actually lost my battery hatch on flight one time. grazed a tree branch, ripped the hatch off and knocked it out of the air. Luckily, I recovered, but flying without the hatch was not cool. adds a LOT of drag to the airframe. You can try it, but I would just wait. It's like trying to pull a brick through the air.

Oh, and dragonshade, if you can't get a motor out of them, I have a practically brand-new Beast3D motor that I want to get rid of. I'll let it go cheap. Anyway, good luck with Horizon!
+1 on the don't fly it without the battery hatch.

Dragonshade if you don't get a new motor from horizon another option would be to get the 3000kv stryker motor. The beast flies SOOO much better with that motor. It's a worthwile upgrade even if your old motor was perfect. If you don't want to upgrade I'd take up BobaFett on the cheap 2500kv motor. basically the motor prop combos in order of performance are:
1. 3000kv with a gws5030 prop
2. (very close second) 2300kv motor and a 5043 prop. (some prefer this as its much quieter)
3.(distant third) stock motor 2500kv with a gws5030.

you already have good hyperion packs. so nothing else is needed for batts.

-Brian
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Old Feb 29, 2012, 10:07 AM
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thanks, plane is repaired and will be back in the box till the new hatch arrives, gives me time to recieve the new batteries also, im flying it with only 1 120mah v1 beast battery and this recommends 180mah so ive got 6 coming and a proper charger, should make for a much better flight time
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