HobbyKing.com New Products Flash Sale
Reply
Thread Tools
Old Jan 09, 2013, 06:43 PM
Registered User
United States, ND, Bismarck
Joined Mar 2012
296 Posts
I have both 130x and v120d02s (on 2s).

If all you look at is how they fly, the 130x wins hands down. It has more power than the stock v120, flies smoother, and is more predictable. It also has lower disk loading (surprisingly), which I believe does matter on these micros. Power is comparable on both now that I have the v120 on 7.4v, but the rx2622v in the v120 just is not up to the task of doing anything but basic 3d. Also it cannot fly in reverse very well at all.

Mechanically, the V120 requires much less maintainance. The 130x pretty much requires upgrades for it to fly well, unless you got lucky and got a tail shaft hub that was actually 90į to the shaft. I think the v120d02s mechanically is a lot better in quality and tolerances. My other gripe about the 130x is the stupid linear servos. They have play from day 1 that can never be eliminated. Yes they do not strip but they also cause wobbles. And many people had failures with the servos anyway. I've had the same servos in my v120 for 6 months and never had a failure. 1 stripped the gears, but gears cost a lot less than the $18 linear servos. The torque tube drive in the v120d02s is more durable than the 130x tail drive as well, mostly just because of the much higher tail ratio in the 130x.

So if you are new to cp helicopters, I would say v120d02s all the way. More durable, no mods required to hover and fff well. Also much cheaper and parts are not out of stock everywhere. (Note: I do not own the new V2 v120 with the 6 axis gyro so I cannot comment on it's abilities. Everything I am saying applies to the older 3 axis version)

If you don't mind tinkering and/or want to do more advanced 3d, the 130x is better in all aspects of flying. It comes at a cost though, both in initial cost and maintenance/upgrade costs. Blade parts are very expensive IMO.
flint723 is online now Find More Posts by flint723
Reply With Quote
Sign up now
to remove ads between posts
Old Jan 09, 2013, 06:48 PM
Registered User
Atomic Skull's Avatar
Joined Dec 2011
3,054 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by IntegrityHndywrk View Post

For a 250-450 heli you should be looking at the minumum costs for electronics:$150-200 set of servos (all 4)

Use Ino-Labs HG-D202's for the cyclics (around $19 each from HK, US Vendors sell them for twice that) and a Hitec 5084 for the tail servo (around $40, recommend getting that from a US vendor for the warrenty) and you'll come in at around $100 for all your servos.
Atomic Skull is offline Find More Posts by Atomic Skull
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 09, 2013, 06:55 PM
Registered User
Joined Aug 2006
59 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by helicopter_new View Post
Iíve a fleet of helis, from 100 size to 600 class. I fly 3d and I just want to add a heli of this category to my fleet. I donít want to pay much for maintenance and spare parts thatís why the bird have to be durable as well 3d capable with adequate power for 3d maneuvers.
I like the size of V120D02S but I don't like the fact that it has torque tube. In contrary I don't like the size of Master CP because it will fly in my backyard but I like the fact that it has tail motor.

So the question is which one and why?
from where you stand right now, i would suggest you get the V120D02S. i think the torque tube is not really an issue since you already fly 3D. if you put in a tail slipper clutch then you increase its crash survivability even more.

the master cp is not bad at all. it is (just bigger) almost the same as the V120 V2 with 6-axis gyro which some comment handles better than the V120 V2. however, when you look at the standpoint of longevity, you do have brushed motors to constantly replace. in fact, you have two (tail) of them! power to weight ratio compared to the V120 V2 is several notches lower. some comment it flies like a brick!

i've had experience with smaller brushed 100-size cp helis in the past months. they eventually cost more when you fly alot. you really burn up those motors fast even if you do the recommended cool down periods.

i now have three V120 V2s! so far no issues with the 6-axis gyro after some tweaking on the gyro and TX. all are in good flying condition and have tail clutches installed. i don't see any reason for anything to fail unless i have a bad crash or otherwise. i guess the BL motor will run well for an indefinite period of time unless i toast it for some reason.

the V120 V2 fits the bill flying in small, confined areas. i fly in a small grassy vacant lot in the city. this thing can flip and roll in place all day long in its stock form! all this a few feet off the ground...

take this direction to get the most value for the money. i do agree with most folks here that WK does have some quirky quality issues! but is is something i guess we can all live with especially in this size range heli as most will agree.
hawk01 is offline Find More Posts by hawk01
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 09, 2013, 07:10 PM
WIFE HAND LAUNCHED MY PLANES!
Spyro37's Avatar
Joined Jun 2009
2,130 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by miketre View Post
I keep hearing comparisons being made to the 130x. In what ways is it better than the V120?
Much more power? More precise? Breaks less?
In what ways does the 130x fly better?

Spare parts availability are now a problem for both blade and walkera where I live. I see a few 130x for sale on my local forum and am feeling the itch.
I have two V120s (3 axis/6axis), & have two 130X.
Bought them all NEW.
There is just no comparison between the two, except the price. The 120 might be cheaper at first & fly ok out of the box. I fly with guys that are advance flyers. Majority of them has the 130X, just so they could fly on their backyards, real 3D. I'm the only one that flies a walkera. Had one of the guys fly my 120 one day. Less couple minutes later, smiled at me and handed my radio back to me
Youtube, you'll find the 130s countless, on 3D. You will not find that many V120s on youtube (stock) flying same 3D performance.
- The V120 is not up to task as stock.. Someone could spend $s upgrading the 120, I have yet to find a V120 video that would equally perform or outperform a stock 130X. Why? the gyro plays a big role.
- The V120 may be cheaper at first. But could be more expensive in no time, trying to upgrade stuffs and repairs. You could improve the power, but you be flying the same gyro.
- I fly my sim and does pretty well flying mild 3Ds. I go out to the field and struggles with my stock powered 120s. I'd pick up my 130X, you'd see me with a happy face.
- The 130X may or may not have tail vib out of the box. When it first came out, it was a big ? on how to fix it. That, is history. HF & RCGrp is here to help. On top of that, US customers could take advantage of HH's great product & CS support.
- Besides from 130X's tail vibe, there is also a heli shake that one could get out of the box. This is due to too much gain on Elev, Ail, or Rud gyro, which is adjusted through the Tx. Or the skinny 3 stock swash O-rings which should be replaced with this. I would get sizes 001, 002, & 003.
- But again, go to the 130X thread, you will get all the help needed if your are not familiar with heli "repairs". Most of them, are glad that they owned one, both newbies & advance flyer.
- durability wise, I fly my 130X more often than my 120's. The 120 may be durable not as durable as my 130. Plus, the 130 does what I do. So if I crashed, it's a pilot error. The 120 (gyro) does not fly as good ( no where close) as the 130. Practicing 3D on it could lead to crash due to it's performance & pilot's inability to correct it (in short, skill).

NOW 300X. I own one too. Two things...
-The main wooden blades needs to be replaced with carbon fiber when you have extra dough. It adds to it's performance.
- Extreme 3D pilots will have to replace the stock servos with metal gears. Mine is still stock but, I'm no stick banger. I got it day it was released as well. It's a dream to fly. BeastX gyro. No chasing around. Power, weight, & gyro. It's got them all.
- I chose the 300X over the 450X due to size, cheaper lipo, and I also like the belt driven tail, in case I crash or land tail-in.
- The BeastX is one of the most user friendly to adjust/tune parameters without the use of a PC. Support is an extra bonus.
- BeastX has Pirouette compensation.
- PROS: can't go wrong with this. PARTS may be cheaper than the V120 . But heli this size is not a crasher. So parts cost is not an issue.
- CONS... is Price. But you get what you pay for and may be better off at then. Just like Integrity had said, do it right the first time, or roll the dice.

* gyro and power plays a big role flying helicopters. The V120 will fly OK, just don't be aggressive, or you'll find yourself ordering parts +shipping on the net, oftenly, IMO.
* Unfortunately, this hobby requires time and patience, regardless, 120 or 130. But honestly, it's been a while since I've done repairs on my 130s.
Flying my 120 and 130 is like comapring my 450 Tarot ZYX & my 300X BeastX.
Spyro37 is offline Find More Posts by Spyro37
RCG Plus Member
Last edited by Spyro37; Jan 09, 2013 at 07:52 PM.
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 09, 2013, 07:11 PM
Registered User
Joined Oct 2010
1,195 Posts
eye candy anyone?

Name: 20130109_195707.jpg
Views: 94
Size: 206.2 KB
Description:
pmerritt is offline Find More Posts by pmerritt
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 09, 2013, 07:23 PM
Controls Engineer
lasakro's Avatar
United States, NY, Amsterdam
Joined Dec 2012
1,327 Posts
Sweet! Don't forget those blade nuts.
lasakro is offline Find More Posts by lasakro
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 09, 2013, 08:05 PM
IHW Heli Division
IntegrityHndywrk's Avatar
United States, FL, Palm Coast
Joined Mar 2012
6,571 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by helicopter_new View Post
I’ve a fleet of helis, from 100 size to 600 class. I fly 3d and I just want to add a heli of this category to my fleet. I don’t want to pay much for maintenance and spare parts that’s why the bird have to be durable as well 3d capable with adequate power for 3d maneuvers.
I like the size of V120D02S but I don't like the fact that it has torque tube. In contrary I don't like the size of Master CP because it will fly in my backyard but I like the fact that it has tail motor.

So the question is which one and why?
Okay, i don't own a master CP. But i will give you some MAJOR differences between them...


1. Size. The Master CP is a 250 class heli. The v120 is in the 100+ class. OR simply the 120 class.

2. Motor & drive system. The V120 uses Brushless motors and a torque tube tail drive system. Arguably the most energy efficient form of tail drive system. We could get into a whole debate about that alone. But i prefer SHAFT drive over belt drive. Belts have to much friction and power loss in the transmission. The Master CP however uses a DIRECT motor driven tail. The Master CP also uses Brush motors. Which are prone to failure and just plain going bad on you and at some point they will need to be replaced, like all brush motors.

3. Stability, The size of the master CP will provide additional gyroscopic "stability" because it has a larger rotor span. It will also provide more "float" in 3D. However the Master CP is pretty heavy so you can't expect TOO much from it either. But both helicopters should be able to do the basics in 3D. Reverse flight and pirouettes are Walkera's gyro's Achilles heel though. Don't expect either heli to do either of those moves too well. They will do it, but not FAST reverse and not multiple spinning piros. Just one or two. Thats about it.

4. Servos & durability... While i have not flown the Master CP, i am extensively familiar with the servos that it uses. Because i still use them on my 4f200. The real scoop on the Master CP's servos is they actually are some of the best servos Walkera makes. However their plastic gears are VERY brittle and they will strip on you every single crash and sometimes just from moving the servo while the power is OFF. The V120D02S servos are actually the very best servo Walkera makes. However, their stock gears are pretty brittle too. The replacement gear sets available in a few shops are more durable, IMO. I litterally flew my V120D02S with the stock servos it came with for 7 months or so before any of them burned the motors out or became "slow" or slower moving then the other 2 cyclic. The tail servos on the V120D02S is not horrible, but it's not great, none of Walkera servos are really "good" but the V120 passes my quality standards, especially after replacing the gears. Same with the Master CP servos, but no gears are available for replacement. HOWEVER, the Master CP servos are only about $10 each. Thats about what you would pay for replacement gears for a set of Align servos, granted they would be metal gears and hardly ever strip. But there are other servos you can replace the stock servos with on the master CP too. Good servos like Futaba too. The Master CP does not use a tail servo since it has a direct drive motor on the tail. Direct drive tail motors in my opinion have no place on a "3D" helicopter. Maybe on the mini /micro sizes like the mini CP or nano CP. But not a 250+ class heli. I just don't expect it to hold the tail well. Being that the motor cannot thrust in both directions, it has to rely on the torque of the main rotor for left rotations. It can't simply change the pitch of the tail rotor in a split second for instant thrust. They are inefficient and too slow to maintain tail hold on hard 3D maneuvers. But it will do basic 3D just fine, per reports of many people flying Master CP and Mini Cp helicopters. I just look at direct drive as a "toy" until they start putting brushless motors back there with collective pitch control and a servo.


Otherwise both helicopters use the same type of 6 Axis gyro now. Which everyone here knows, i have been against since before they were released to the market. But they do fly, and honestly the "issues" with the 6 axis units seem to either be only on some random people's heli. Or everyone else is not noticing the "issues" and are content. I still have not quite figured out what is going on with the customer base and their reports of how the 6 axis works on a individual basis. But it does seem possibly random.

Also, be aware that the V120D02S after some minor modifications is VERY durable. Sheer pin, slipper clutch and maybe a servo saver mod. The thing is nearly indestructible.


Quote:
Originally Posted by microrcfiend View Post
With no reply on the v120 from rc711 yet, I caved in and ordered the v1 rx from buzzflyer as there is a good chance I will get it on Friday and be able to fly a maiden over the weekend.

I enjoy the hell out of even the mini but I also expected way too much from it after only sim practice and the v911, pretty sure the v120 will give me a grin from ear to ear if the new rx flies straight. I got phoenix (had clearview before) after the minicp and flipping with the mcpx was the turning point as I then understood just what true collective management actually meant.

I'd recommend anyone interested in small cp helis try the mcpx and 130x on phoenix to get a better idea of what flight performance they want in terms of power.
Cheers for the experienced opinions, kept my disappointment to the minimum.

I'll let you know how it turns out
I'm glad you did. I will feel bad if you don't notice any difference though . But i'm 99% positive you will have less issues, especially in FFF, and apparently hovering without left drift too. I do like my V120. I just wish it was 2S or something. It's VERY windy where i live. So the 1S upgraded motor gives me great power and awesome flights on calm days. But the windy days it's a bog machine, so i crash it a lot.
IntegrityHndywrk is online now Find More Posts by IntegrityHndywrk
Last edited by IntegrityHndywrk; Jan 09, 2013 at 08:11 PM.
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 09, 2013, 08:09 PM
Mike
miketre's Avatar
Joined Dec 2010
750 Posts
flint723, Spyro37,
Thanks for your detailed response. I'm relatively new to CP helis (about 2 months in) and have not progressed to reverse flights yet.
I will keep an eye out for a used 130x to progress into when I hit the limits of the v120 and the gyro in the future. will check out the 130x thread on things to look out for.

Spyro37, those O rings are cheap!
miketre is offline Find More Posts by miketre
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 09, 2013, 08:21 PM
Registered User
microrcfiend's Avatar
United Kingdom, England, Sheffield
Joined Jun 2012
1,361 Posts
hawk01

What did you do to null out the left drift and do you have a short vid by any chance?
microrcfiend is online now Find More Posts by microrcfiend
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 09, 2013, 08:26 PM
IHW Heli Division
IntegrityHndywrk's Avatar
United States, FL, Palm Coast
Joined Mar 2012
6,571 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atomic Skull View Post
Use Ino-Labs HG-D202's for the cyclics (around $19 each from HK, US Vendors sell them for twice that) and a Hitec 5084 for the tail servo (around $40, recommend getting that from a US vendor for the warrenty) and you'll come in at around $100 for all your servos.
I can get behind that. Ino-Labs are good servos. If you can get them for less than the typical $30+ i see them listed for + shipping.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pmerritt View Post
Hey get back to me on how that thing crashes. I've been considering getting a Fusuno canopy for a long time. But never justified the costs. Fusuno uses a half way decent FRP resin, as they say in their videos and things. But if it cracks up and breaks, even on this little thing. I have no interest. Since the V120D02S is basically the only helicopter i still fly that crashes just about every single day i fly it. I'm SICK of replacing the canopies or gluing them back together or whatever. If the paint scratches and thats it. I'm so all over this. Also do you have a digital scale? Because if it's too heavy, i'm out. Printer ink and gloss or transparent paper is not exactly cheap. But i'm considering giving that a shot if i can ever find all the info and documents to print them. I just haven't seen a canopy that is printed yet that i like. Most are, well... I don't like most of them.
IntegrityHndywrk is online now Find More Posts by IntegrityHndywrk
Last edited by IntegrityHndywrk; Jan 09, 2013 at 08:34 PM.
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 09, 2013, 08:44 PM
Heli Crash Survivor
Crash Survivor's Avatar
United States, AR, North Little Rock
Joined Feb 2011
1,039 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by microrcfiend View Post
hawk01

What did you do to null out the left drift and do you have a short vid by any chance?
Did you over look my post 8169 page 545. Mine V2 is all rebuilt & waiting for this rain to stop. Friday looks good & if my left drift is still going on it's to the V1 & MCP & v2 on the shelf, wasted to much time. If you have good weather try raise/tilt the right side of the RX up looking from the back.
Crash Survivor is online now Find More Posts by Crash Survivor
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 09, 2013, 09:28 PM
WIFE HAND LAUNCHED MY PLANES!
Spyro37's Avatar
Joined Jun 2009
2,130 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by miketre View Post

Spyro37, those O rings are cheap!
http://www.oringsandmore.com/servlet...ize-003/Detail

NOT after they were RE-PACKED by hobby stores :

- http://helidirect.com/lynx-lx0373-13...cs-p-28578.hdx
- http://www.ebay.com/itm/LynX-LX0373-...item53f24bdeb6
Spyro37 is offline Find More Posts by Spyro37
RCG Plus Member
Latest blog entry: 130X Build
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 09, 2013, 09:36 PM
Registered User
microrcfiend's Avatar
United Kingdom, England, Sheffield
Joined Jun 2012
1,361 Posts
Yes CS, I thought why not and just tried a few more configurations in the hope I could influence this heli at all. It feels like a numb experience, anything I do to the swash, links or rx up to around 3 pieces of cable tie stacked under the rx makes any difference that I can see or feel. Just one link turned on the min and I feel and see the difference so i'm not the numb one

Exactly how many mm did you lift on the right, roughly what angle we talking about here?

Tried cable tie underneath both sides and taping it down to the left and right. The backwards does seem to make a slight difference but even with the swash visibly forwards I still get back drift.

I can imagine if you get one that flies straight it would be killer, not sure that exists though.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crash Survivor View Post
Did you over look my post 8169 page 545. Mine V2 is all rebuilt & waiting for this rain to stop. Friday looks good & if my left drift is still going on it's to the V1 & MCP & v2 on the shelf, wasted to much time. If you have good weather try raise/tilt the right side of the RX up looking from the back.
microrcfiend is online now Find More Posts by microrcfiend
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 09, 2013, 09:52 PM
WIFE HAND LAUNCHED MY PLANES!
Spyro37's Avatar
Joined Jun 2009
2,130 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by IntegrityHndywrk View Post
I've been considering getting a Fusuno canopy for a long time. But never justified the costs. I'm so all over this. Also do you have a digital scale? Because if it's too heavy, i'm out..
LOL.
Then, consider yourself as out!
I thought it was cool for micros. Durable? don't know coz I don't even use it on my 130X due to it's weight. I can't do pitch pumps anymore with it. You'd think that the 130X would have not an issue with it's 2S power. I will hit the ground before it would +pitch pump. I don't even wanna see how much it weighs on my scale.
I got it not because of durability (my 130 canopies are still in one piece since I got them). I paid for the LKS, not realizing the weight
Spyro37 is offline Find More Posts by Spyro37
RCG Plus Member
Last edited by Spyro37; Jan 09, 2013 at 10:11 PM.
Reply With Quote
Old Jan 09, 2013, 09:58 PM
Registered User
Joined Jan 2013
15 Posts
This makes the second servo that I have striped for the walkera V120Do2S and I have only flown it twice. The servo gears are so prone to stripping it's ridiculous. Does anyone know where I can get some stronger gear for the servos I already have? If I can't find any good gears, I'm thinking about just buying some stronger servos. Any recommendation on servos would also be appreciated.
LucidSoul is offline Find More Posts by LucidSoul
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Similar Threads
Category Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Discussion new heli from walkera HIKO400? xyzy2 Micro Helis 15 Jan 12, 2012 11:16 AM
Sold Align 70A ESC W/BEC from 500/550 class Heli NEW! HD Hucker Aircraft - Electric - Helis (FS/W) 3 Oct 13, 2011 12:37 PM
Discussion Ultra Durable Diamond Mini Gyro 3 Channel Indoor Ready to Fly RC Remote Control Heli LittleG Coaxial Helicopters 32 Jan 14, 2011 12:55 PM
Discussion Walker 4#3 throttle problem Ė new heli Ronon Micro Helis 2 Jan 24, 2009 04:22 PM