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Old Dec 10, 2012, 08:05 PM
Quadfather
Coquitlam, BC
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Originally Posted by Vantasstic View Post
I've been using my DL V1 and V2 with my 9X with ER9X firmware with absolutely no problems. Make sure your settings are PPM (not Spektrum or anything else). Try starting off with assigned 8 channels, bind, and try. I've tested with 12ch with no problems, but mostly using 8-10 with no issues.
Hmmm, seems like an antenna problem. If I wiggle the antenna, the LED goes from green to red. That's with the short antenna. If I use the longer antenna, then the problem pretty much goes away.

I also tried it on my Aurora 9 - makes no difference.
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 08:34 PM
Flying Zayin
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China, Guangdong, Guangzhou
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What a company, what a service!

So, Mike made a hit and run touchdown here, flashed a few videos accompanying them with all that usual 'best of the best' blah blahs, addressed no issues, and disappeared again leaving a "help yourselves guys" aftertaste.

Great. What a company, what a service.

I do believe DL is a great thing.
However this is money issue, and this is what I think is important to finally pop up now when the number of unhappy customers approaches critical level.

"We are an American company" - yeah, really? What is the name of the company, legal and physical address, unhidden contact details, etc.?
Where is the cash going, in other words, and how to trace it?
I have only been reading this thread for a bit more than a week, and already saw a couple of angry buyers who had sent their funds into nowhere, got nothing, sent a number of messages, got nothing again, and finally resorted to opening a PayPal ticket.

I am not trying to make a trouble or set off some false alarms.
I am (or I was) a potential buyer who came here with nothing but the best intentions looking to buy a DL set, but now.... errrrrrr....
I somehow believe I am not the only one standing here in sort of bewilderment with gaped mouth and a handful of dollars; we were ready to pay but we're much set off now.

Is there any really reliable place to buy LRS in the world? You know, that old-fashioned place that you could call by phone and not get an outsourced zombie answering you, a place that would issue an invoice and really stand behind their products in action, not just in words?
If there is, please tell me.

Thanks,
- Mark -
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 08:42 PM
'FPV'er...not a "LOS'er
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Las Vegas, NV
Joined Sep 2003
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Originally Posted by Cathay Stray View Post
So, Mike made a hit and run touchdown here, flashed a few videos accompanying them with all that usual 'best of the best' blah blahs, addressed no issues, and disappeared again leaving a "help yourselves guys" aftertaste.

Great. What a company, what a service.

I do believe DL is a great thing.
However this is money issue, and this is what I think is important to finally pop up now when the number of unhappy customers approaches critical level.

"We are an American company" - yeah, really? What is the name of the company, legal and physical address, unhidden contact details, etc.?
Where is the cash going, in other words, and how to trace it?
I have only been reading this thread for a bit more than a week, and already saw a couple of angry buyers who had sent their funds into nowhere, got nothing, sent a number of messages, got nothing again, and finally resorted to opening a PayPal ticket.

I am not trying to make a trouble or set off some false alarms.
I am (or I was) a potential buyer who came here with nothing but the best intentions looking to buy a DL set, but now.... errrrrrr....
I somehow believe I am not the only one standing here in sort of bewilderment with gaped mouth and a handful of dollars; we were ready to pay but we're much set off now.

Is there any really reliable place to buy LRS in the world? You know, that old-fashioned place that you could call by phone and not get an outsourced zombie answering you, a place that would issue an invoice and really stand behind their products in action, not just in words?
If there is, please tell me.

Thanks,
- Mark -
Well Mark...sure sounds like you're trolling here. DL has been around for years and some of your chinese rip-off systems are based on DL. There will be unhappy customers with ANY business. Mike's business address has be posted MANY TIMES on this thread. As for Mike's video contests...he's been running those for years too. I couldn't hazard a guess on how much $$$ he's lost by giving stuff away. If you're not sure of DL, then go buy one of the rip-off systems from your local country and go fly and have fun...good luck with after sales support there...
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 08:53 PM
Creator of the 1st 6S HT-Flip!
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United States, TN, Clarksville
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New video for the contest! Zephyr 2 flight in the clouds at sunset.
Zephyr 2 FPV in the Clouds! Flown w/ Dragonlink (4 min 53 sec)
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 08:55 PM
Work less, fly more!
Australia, WA, Broome
Joined Aug 2012
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Originally Posted by Vantasstic View Post
Well Mark...sure sounds like you're trolling here. DL has been around for years and some of your chinese rip-off systems are based on DL. There will be unhappy customers with ANY business. Mike's business address has be posted MANY TIMES on this thread. As for Mike's video contests...he's been running those for years too. I couldn't hazard a guess on how much $$$ he's lost by giving stuff away. If you're not sure of DL, then go buy one of the rip-off systems from your local country and go fly and have fun...good luck with after sales support there...
well said van, Mark, why dont you buy a HK/orange 433 system instead
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 09:13 PM
Flying Zayin
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Originally Posted by Vantasstic View Post
Well Mark...sure sounds like you're trolling here. DL has been around for years and some of your chinese rip-off systems are based on DL. There will be unhappy customers with ANY business. Mike's business address has be posted MANY TIMES on this thread. As for Mike's video contests...he's been running those for years too. I couldn't hazard a guess on how much $$$ he's lost by giving stuff away. If you're not sure of DL, then go buy one of the rip-off systems from your local country and go fly and have fun...good luck with after sales support there...
1 - I'm a pretty untypical troll then, if I am really trolling. I have made it clear that I came here with the only intention to buy the goods that I had heard was well worth buying.
Few trolls would come for anything like that, huhh?
I am still open to offers, and as soon as (if at all) I have enough information about who I am buying from - I will go ahead and buy. Might not be a DL though

2 - Be careful with labeling. "... some of your Chinese rip-off systems...." doesn't sound decent in any respect, besides I am a foreigner in China, so whatever the rip-offs are by any means not mine.
What really sounds trollish is your provoking "go buy one of the rip-off systems from your local country and go fly and have fun...good luck with after sales support there..." I'll leave it without answer for the sake of reducing the level of noise pollution.

3 - I as a new customer care little about who loses money on what and who gives away tons of goods for free. I came with my money not looking for free give-aways and I want to spend it so that I would not have to open any PayPal disputes months later after having tried to contact the seller for a thousand times. That's the only thing I want: buy a decent LRS and rest assured that the support will come when it is called for, not in a few months. What I see now is sort of pretty far from this.

4 - Mikes private address was published here, yes, but I prefer not to mix business and pleasure. I'd not bother people on their private numbers if I have a question regarding their goods I bought.

and 5 - Yes there are unhappy customers with any business, right. But for different reasons. Taking people's $$$ and not sending goods and not answering messages is not anything nearly 'normal' in any decent business either. Including "my Chinese" businesses. I buy a lot in Chinese online shops. As opposed to some Chinese shops selling to overseas clients, internet trade in China domestic market is very, very reliable and user-friendly.
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 10:15 PM
'FPV'er...not a "LOS'er
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Las Vegas, NV
Joined Sep 2003
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Well Mark, I've been using DL for years and have been on this thread learning and helping out as much as I can. Your first post here was rather accusatory vs inquisitive:
... addressed no issues, and disappeared again leaving a "help yourselves guys" aftertaste.
...Great. What a company, what a service.
..."We are an American company" - yeah, really? What is the name of the company, legal and physical address, unhidden contact details, etc.?
...Where is the cash going, in other words, and how to trace it?
...I am not trying to make a trouble or set off some false alarms.
...I am (or I was) a potential buyer who came here with nothing but the best intentions looking to buy a DL set, but now.... errrrrrr....
...Is there any really reliable place to buy LRS in the world? You know, that old-fashioned place that you could call by phone and not get an outsourced zombie answering you, a place that would issue an invoice and really stand behind their products in action, not just in words?

I've seen Mike provide all sorts of support to his users. He's replaced people's system they bought from private parties only to find out they bought someone else's crash damaged equipment. I've seen him send out replacement equipment to someone who's having problems with the words 'Don't send me your stuff back until you receive the replacements and can verify yours are bad or not'. I've seen him replace stuff that got lost in the mail...both going and coming. I've seen him do all this when he was only a one man, one wife, and one dog organization. I waited over three months for my first DL system...after making payment...knowing he was playing catch up between all the orders, all the production, all the shipping, all by himself. You know...the DL costs the same now as it did when I bought my first system. Between then and now Mike's improved/upgraded the system and even provides additional hardware that didn't come with it originally.

I have no financial interest in DL. I've here because I use it, believe in it, and have never been let down by it. Sure, sometimes Mike's responses are slow and I'd like to see better. I get taken aback when I see posts like yours. There are other systems out there for you to chose from. If you have questions on functionality there's plenty of people here willing to help because WE use the system. I stand behind what I said earlier...if you're not sure of DL then don't buy it. If you want local support then you've got plenty of product choices in your 'local' country; be it their original idea/design or one that's been 'copied' from someone else's work.

FWIW, I spent over half my working career living/working in the far east...never in China though. Personally I really loved the Japanese culture...and my wife is a Pacific Islander...so I'm not speaking out of a prejudice.
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 10:40 PM
Flying Zayin
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Originally Posted by Vantasstic View Post
Well Mark
I'm glad we let the steam out and can talk in a better way. I understand you're happy with DL but what I think is wrong is that you're mixing water and oil (and they don't mix): you're defending a bad company because it sells a good product.

I am saying "bad" company not out of some personal hate or anything alike. But there is something inside me that doesn't allow me to use the word "good" about a company who takes cash today and sends the goods 2 months later.

You are repeatedly trying to push me to buy something else somewhere else. Again, do not mix unmixables.
I WANT a DL, OK?
I DON'T WANT a DL on such conditions as Mike offers (waiting for months and alike).
Consequently, I want a DL preferably from some other (better) seller, but oops, there is only one.

There are good business schemes and there are bad ones, and it is a shame if a good product is marketed by a man and his wife and their dog, and none of the three can put it on smooth sales track.
If they're overtrading, it is not the buyers' problem by all means. Either find a solution or pass this business to someone who can handle it with more ease.
Got too much strain? Too bad, but it doesn't mean I will agree to wait 2 months before you reply my email.
Something like that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vantasstic View Post
I've seen Mike provide all sorts of support to his users
YOU have. I haven't. I am a newcomer to this thread, and I said it more than once that I came here in order to buy, not to start messing about.
What I saw was different: people were asking exact questions to no avail, and then the seller appeared flashing a bunch of videos and mantrically repeating "we are great, our product is the best" - and disappearing again.
Wouldn't it be better if he found half an hour of his precious time and addressed all those people one by one?
For example, the Norwegian guy who opened a PayPal ticket: Sorry man, this is what caused a delay, sorry for not contacting you on time, sure I will refund your money right away, or if you still want a DL I will make sure it is sent out no later than tonight...
And most important thing is the impossibility to contact Mike in case things get stuck. Messages don't get answered, and there is no phone/skype/whatever else. A black box.

You were so upset because I said something you didn't like about product and people you like.
Once again, product is one thing, people is another. Planes don't crush by themselves, people crash their crafts. Excellent product can be ruined if excellent people get themselves buried in unresolved communication problems.

I am no personal friend of Mike's. I am no his woe. I have little, if any, interest in all these reasons that keep him slow. I am a customer. Here is money, where is my thing? As simple as this. And much later, if everything worked fine and I was happy with products and service I might do the same as you are doing now - vouching for the shop and product, seeing these two as one. Not before.
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 10:57 PM
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Mark you've been very blunt in this thread and the range link thread about how the owners are not responding to you.

They have products that are in high demand, and they run their companies with very little staff (if any), so they're forced to deal with issues on a first come first serve basis. That means that you're simply not going to get an answer right away. That's how it is.

But if you read back through the threads, you'll note that customers are still serviced and taken care of, even if it's not necessarily in a timely manner. And in this forum in particular, i've seen a lot of praise for Mike.

I'm in the queue just like you, except i'm waiting for my system. I know i may have to wait a little while, but with a very specialized product, i understand that may be the case.

If you don't like the service, just move on and find another system, but complaining about it numerous times in the same thread is likely not going to produce better results, it may in fact hurt your cause.
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 11:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Vantasstic View Post
Well Mark...sure sounds like you're trolling here. DL has been around for years and some of your chinese rip-off systems are based on DL. There will be unhappy customers with ANY business. Mike's business address has be posted MANY TIMES on this thread. As for Mike's video contests...he's been running those for years too. I couldn't hazard a guess on how much $$$ he's lost by giving stuff away. If you're not sure of DL, then go buy one of the rip-off systems from your local country and go fly and have fun...good luck with after sales support there...
Judging by my personal experience, unfortunately, I really don't think Mark is trolling.
I paid nearly $300 for a DL system, I'm sure that the good units are great, I've seen them in action used by a few of my friends, and that's why I decided to go for a DL system too.
However, I got a non-functional unit, Mike said he'd send a replacement unit, and I believe he actually did. However, I have no tracking number to verify that, and, several requests for such a number were ignored over the past few weeks .
According to Mike, the replacement unit was sent more than a month ago. It never showed up, that's considerably longer time than what it usually takes for packages for the US to arrive, It could even be that it sits somewhere in customs office and that I need to come and release it, but again, no tracking number... I really can't tell.
I guess this is the type of issues Mark is referring too.
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 11:06 PM
Flying Zayin
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China, Guangdong, Guangzhou
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Originally Posted by polix View Post
Mark you've been very blunt in this thread and the range link thread about how the owners are not responding to you.
True.
I might sound over-snappish. But this is really what I feel, and it is the first time in my life when a buyer with cash is just simply ignored. Sort of weird feeling. Really doesn't feel right to me.
I might sound more demanding than most of the guys in these threads but being more demanding than others does not automatically mean being demanding too much, am I wrong?

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Originally Posted by polix View Post
They have products that are in high demand, and they run their companies with very little staff (if any)
Then hire a couple of helpers. High demand? - that's a dream for most business people who would normally respond to this challenge with increasing their production/sales capacity. Unable to handle it? - pass it to the one who can. Customers must not suffer no matter what.

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Originally Posted by polix View Post
complaining about it numerous times in the same thread is likely not going to produce better results, it may in fact hurt your cause.
The only way to hurt my cause is to send a killer to my door. Otherwise I cannot be hurt any worse than I am already, I wanted a LRS a week ago and I am still not having it.

You are yet another one with this banal (and wrong) suggestion to buy something else. The product and the shop are not the same. People who sell are not the ones who make. I want THIS product. But I want it on normal terms, which is transparent, safe and timely.
Me too demanding? Ha.
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 11:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Cathay Stray View Post
I want THIS product. But I want it on normal terms, which is transparent, safe and timely.
Me too demanding? Ha.
I have been sitting back watching the battle over the thread and only come as a neutral piece of information.

Mike does run a small business. Most small businesses in the United states run from homes or use home addresses for billing, transactions, and communication. The cost in the united states of commercial real estate is blown way out of proportion.

DragonLink, is Hand made by the people in his shop here in the united states. With this comes the overhead of building and testing each one. Yes, some may slip through the cracks that have a problem here or there, that is understandable for any product.

The demand for VIP service, rather than just ordering online through his site sort of rubbed some people the wrong way on here. Van is a very loyal DragonLabs customer and tries to help everyone that is having problems. Reading back through your posts, I did not see any statement of ordering the product and just wanting a tracking number like many here. All I saw was a complaint which may have been triggered by the frustration of dealing with the various LRS vendors. They all have a very high demand for their product and have little time to chat with potential customers. That is why myself and a few other loyal customers try to help the new users.

If you want to fly with the best equipment, It sometimes takes time. Patience is one of the biggest things I learned from FPV. without patience, you wont ever get to use DragonLinks full potential... you dont do long range flights by simply saying "I want to be there now!"

Hopefully mile will have some down time and can answer any questions you have.
Chris
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 11:23 PM
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New video for the contest! Zephyr 2 flight in the clouds at sunset.
That is an incredible shot above the clouds!
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 11:25 PM
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...is why myself and a few other loyal customers try to help the new users.

Chris
That's actually why I decided on DL, the users themselves love the product enough to help out.
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 11:26 PM
'FPV'er...not a "LOS'er
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Originally Posted by Cathay Stray View Post
You are repeatedly trying to push me to buy something else somewhere else. Again, do not mix unmixables.
I WANT a DL, OK?
I DON'T WANT a DL on such conditions as Mike offers (waiting for months and alike).
Consequently, I want a DL preferably from some other (better) seller, but oops, there is only one.
Dragon Link is a small business...like real small...Man, Wife, Dog, and he does now have a few folks who do some assembly work I believe. He can't do it all. He's trying to service a world-wide market for a niche product. If he did nothing but answer e-mails, PMs, follow every thread on every hobby BBS then he'd get no production done. If he concentrates solely on production then there'd be zero presence on forum like this. Mike is the sole source for producing/repairing Dragon Link. You can check ReadyMadeRC and UrbanDrones for purchasing a DL...I have no idea what they're stock is though and I'm sure they're only resellers, not support centers, so it all comes back to Mike. Hence, why I keep saying, 'if you're not comfortable then buy something else from somewhere else'.

Perhaps if you started your first post with 'I'm looking into getting a Dragon Link for a good, reliable. LRS. I like the features I've seen, but have some concerns over delivery/support based on the last several pages I've read on this thread. What kind of after purchase support can I expect...' I, personally, would have responded to that a whole lot differently than I did to your (what I felt was an accusatory) first post. It's not what you say, it's how you say it...and you said it in a non-tactical way and got a non-tactical response from a DL user. This thread has over 15,000 replies. If people weren't getting product and if that product wasn't worth getting, then the thread and product would of died out a long time ago.

edit: I guess I should correct an earlier statement. I have been to Hong Kong, before its lease ran out. So I guess I have been to China, but it, technically, wasn't really Chinese, at that time.
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