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Old May 22, 2012, 06:31 PM
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ricoalonso's Avatar
USA, KS, Derby
Joined Mar 2003
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Originally Posted by lcc014 View Post
Great information. Also, when I spool up my heli, it has the similar "shake" as yours. I definitely will try out this method instead of getting a mini camera.

Thanks,

Ching-Ho Cheng
definitely, you need to find the cause of the 'shake' and try to minimize it. I know I never took the time to check if my head is balanced. In fact, I know there is a slight play between the main shaft and the main bearing and it woobles a little. I'm still working on it, replacing parts a piece at a time. For the meantime, I see it as a good test as to how tolerant the ZYX to vibrations and it is passing so far .
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Old May 22, 2012, 08:15 PM
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lcc014's Avatar
United States, MA, ALLSTON
Joined May 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ricoalonso View Post
definitely, you need to find the cause of the 'shake' and try to minimize it. I know I never took the time to check if my head is balanced. In fact, I know there is a slight play between the main shaft and the main bearing and it woobles a little. I'm still working on it, replacing parts a piece at a time. For the meantime, I see it as a good test as to how tolerant the ZYX to vibrations and it is passing so far .
My heli "shake" during spool up was not as much as yours. Once it get to mi-stick, no more shaking. Both of the main blades and head were balanced. I balanced main blades first - dynamic and the head + blades balance - static. I am using 250 Pro main shaft to get rid of the collar. No play at all - same as using collar. I loaded the new pitch and roll gain of 45 to ZYX. Swashplate level was checked again at mid-stick, highest stick and lowest stick. Level at all these 3 positions. I will try it out in the weekend, hopefully, weather will be good.

Ching-Ho Cheng
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Old May 22, 2012, 09:36 PM
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Joined Oct 2011
550 Posts
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Originally Posted by PHMX View Post
I'm starting to think there's no real issue at hand, but perhaps you're surprised about how different these flybarless systems work?
For a good example of this see Bert's "hands off fff " @ ~3:30 min.

http://youtu.be/9xXJpyzlOE4
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Old May 23, 2012, 12:40 AM
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Joined Jan 2007
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90 degree wash out when pitch pumping

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Originally Posted by Arey View Post
Try this solution by beenflying.
Quick update: Changing the "collective tail compensation" did not fix the problem. I even tried a setting of +12, but the result was more or less the same.

I am back to thinking it might be a mechanical problem (flex in the tail push rod or tail rotor control arm?).
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Old May 23, 2012, 01:04 AM
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Philippines, NCR, Taguig
Joined Aug 2011
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Tail Blade Pitch

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Originally Posted by Slinger1 View Post
Quick update: Changing the "collective tail compensation" did not fix the problem. I even tried a setting of +12, but the result was more or less the same.

I am back to thinking it might be a mechanical problem (flex in the tail push rod or tail rotor control arm?).

In case you don't have enough right tail pitch..try this. Details here.
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Old May 23, 2012, 01:50 AM
Team Mulikow 3D
Oxfordshire, UK
Joined Jan 2007
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Originally Posted by Slinger1 View Post
Quick update: Changing the "collective tail compensation" did not fix the problem. I even tried a setting of +12, but the result was more or less the same.

I am back to thinking it might be a mechanical problem (flex in the tail push rod or tail rotor control arm?).
The other thing to consider is your pitch and throttle curves - if your HS is too low and you put in a big pitch change the tail won't have enough power to hold and will kick out anti-clockwise
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Old May 23, 2012, 07:22 AM
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The Netherlands, ZH, The Hague
Joined Apr 2007
146 Posts
Question on hover with ZYX

Hey guys,

i maidened my Mini Titan V1 today with the ZYX gyro and the new Mini Titan V2 FBL head. The flight was successful but i have one important question.

When lifting of or landing the heli drifts more side to side and in pitch more than it was when flybarred. (ie. it does not lift off slowly and hold in a stable hover). It also tends to drift a bit in hover and does not sit in the same place as much as when flybared. It does not woble though and apart from the drifting seems quite stable in forward flight. Tail is locked in. I used the setup recomendations from Raptor technique, who has provided great instructions on setting up the ZYX.

Should i adjust the gains on the main setup screen of the software (configuration page), and therefore increase the gain a bit on the ROLL and PITCH menu? (I will quote my settings later today on what they are configured at).

OR is this something to do with the PID settings in the advanced menu?

Very happy it flies and came down after several short flights in one piece.

Tim.
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Old May 23, 2012, 10:17 AM
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United States, WA, Port Angeles
Joined Nov 2010
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Originally Posted by PHMX View Post
I know it's tough when dealing with a low budget, but I still wouldn't recommend analog servos when going flybarless though. There's a bigger risk that they won't perform well enough to keep up with the flybarless unit.

Obviously you'll have to select the analog servo setting, but it will also be the slowest setting of communication for the flybarless controller.

Digital servos, especially when you take care that they do not have binding issues, will give a much better performance at almost the same price when you're buying quality analog servos.
Well i went ahead and pulled the trigger on some 65mgs cause thats what the lhs had in stock. So i got home and put em in and hooked everything up and wah la! Sittin on the bench worked good for about 10secs. Then the collective stopped working up and down. Then the aileron and elevator stopped and the servos just stopped. Wouldn't work at all. Funning thing is the rudder works fine. Just to make sure that it was getting enough power i disconnected the esc bec and hooked up an external 6v regulator. Same results.
So i contacted infinity hobby and the gyro is going back today. Nothing but troubles with this thing lately and now its prolly gonna be 2 months before this birds is airborne again and no backup. fk it! Back to airplanes for a while...
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Old May 23, 2012, 10:18 AM
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United States, WA, Port Angeles
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65mgs are going back to the shop too. Thanks for the advise, think i'll pickup some digitals when i get a gyro back.
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Old May 23, 2012, 11:04 AM
Never trust laughing dolphins
Joined Feb 2011
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Originally Posted by airtimeallen View Post
Well i went ahead and pulled the trigger on some 65mgs cause thats what the lhs had in stock. So i got home and put em in and hooked everything up and wah la! Sittin on the bench worked good for about 10secs. Then the collective stopped working up and down. Then the aileron and elevator stopped and the servos just stopped. Wouldn't work at all. Funning thing is the rudder works fine. Just to make sure that it was getting enough power i disconnected the esc bec and hooked up an external 6v regulator. Same results.
So i contacted infinity hobby and the gyro is going back today. Nothing but troubles with this thing lately and now its prolly gonna be 2 months before this birds is airborne again and no backup. fk it! Back to airplanes for a while...
That really socks man. Hope the LHS is going to help out.

The important thing when using analog servos is really that using the ZYX or CopterX flybarless gyros or any other flybarless system that supports analog servos is to FIRST select the right analog servo modes, before you plug your servos in.

It's true that it can ruin perfectly good and brand-new analog servos within 10 seconds. Not sure if that's what happened of course, but just to clarify what might have happened.
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Old May 23, 2012, 12:02 PM
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airtimeallen's Avatar
United States, WA, Port Angeles
Joined Nov 2010
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Yeah, i changed the settings in the gyro before plugging in the servos. I have the programmer so the settings change is real easy. The servos are fine so the shop doesn't have any problem taking em back. Especially if i order digital servos from them to replace the 65mgs
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Old May 23, 2012, 01:12 PM
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Truglodite's Avatar
Carmichael, CA
Joined Feb 2007
3,513 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zr_Flyer View Post
For a good example of this see Bert's "hands off fff " @ ~3:30 min.

http://youtu.be/9xXJpyzlOE4
Thanks, that's the first I heard about the MSH controller and Bert gave a very compelling review. The price, performance, and features seem revolutionary; almost too good to be true. Can't wait!

Kev
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Old May 23, 2012, 06:09 PM
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USA, KY, Florence
Joined Aug 2007
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The high dollar Skookum has a lot of the same stuff like the recovery switch, etc.

They have Gyros as well as Accelerometers built in. I wonder if Bert has tried one of those yet?
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Old May 23, 2012, 07:14 PM
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Carmichael, CA
Joined Feb 2007
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I'd like to see more heli god videos with SK hardware too, but the "switching from vbar..." statement pretty much says it all for me. I've been leaning towards vBar for my fb 450, but I've been waiting for the verdict on the 540. Now the MSH Brain and Align APS are just around the corner... wish everyone would give me a break launching new stuff so I can actually buy a darn controller for my dream heli, LOL! j/k Good times and affordable controllers ahead!

Kev
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Old May 23, 2012, 07:28 PM
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United States, NY, New York
Joined Nov 2010
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Originally Posted by Truglodite View Post
I'd like to see more heli god videos with SK hardware too, but the "switching from vbar..." statement pretty much says it all for me. I've been leaning towards vBar for my fb 450, but I've been waiting for the verdict on the 540. Now the MSH Brain and Align APS are just around the corner... wish everyone would give me a break launching new stuff so I can actually buy a darn controller for my dream heli, LOL! j/k Good times and affordable controllers ahead!

Kev
There is something for everyone's budget...
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