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Old Sep 13, 2003, 11:07 PM
DLG Fan
AZ_Astro's Avatar
Tempe, AZ
Joined Nov 2002
1,966 Posts
I survived the Bandit Maiden

Decided that today was THE DAY and got up pre-dawn to drive to a remote and wide-open location for the Bandit maiden.

Setup:

Bandit 2
Hacker B40-8S
Hacker Master 70-3P Opto ESC
CP1700-scr and CP1300-scr packs
12x8 Aeronaut Carbon CAM

Just before sun-up, I throttled up a little above half and javelin-threw the Bandit straight into the wind. It just soared up and away. Just a click or two of trim required. Beyond that, the Bandit simply performed exactly as expected and gave me no surprises.

Well - I was surprised at the short flight duration. I flew with the CP1300 pack first and it seemed like I only flew about 5 or six ovals before the motor cut out on me. 60 seconds of powered flight? That sound about right?

The 2nd flight with the CP1700 pack was uneventful, but I brought the Bandit in early to avoid a motor shutdown near landing.

Landing appears to be the biggest trick. A long, shallow descent is needed. Spoilers really help cutting lift but the speed still remains high on landing.

I'll be trying again tomorrow on my regular field - four football fields in size. It should be adequate.

***

As it turns out, I felt that I was ready for the Bandit. I had perhaps 200 flights or so with S400 pylon racers, warbirds, and a modified Super Terry. The Bandit flew much like the pylon racers but tracked very cleanly and was a delight to fly. Looking forward to wringing her out in the future.

I'll be practicing landings for weeks though, I'm sure!
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Old Sep 14, 2003, 12:46 AM
high-speed freak
opualuan's Avatar
San Jose, CA
Joined Sep 2001
3,863 Posts
understand that you use the motor to climb... only... that's how you can achieve good flight times...

~50A+ draw, about a minute sounds about right.
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Old Sep 14, 2003, 08:49 AM
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soholingo's Avatar
Laurel, MD
Joined May 2001
12,684 Posts
What Omar said. Use FULL power to climb the bandit to about 300- 400 feet, and cut the motor off. Use the air currents to keep the plane in the air and fly. Good job on the landing.

From 300 - 400 feet up do some large ovals, and let the bandit slow WAY down, so that it stalls, and you can get a sense of how it will react during a stall. (Do this with all your sail planes)

Also get used to pointing the nose down to add speed, don't use the motor unless you are going to climb.

Lastly once you commit to landing LAND!! Even if you over shoot and have to take a long walk.

j
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Old Sep 14, 2003, 08:59 AM
small electrics r BIG FUN
Iowa
Joined Aug 2000
4,299 Posts
You are very brave or slighty crazy for launching at partial throttle. Sounds like you were flying it constant throttle like a sport plane. On you next time out, try climb and glide with some aerobatics mixed in. You'll get much longer flights. Also, try some dives from altitude with the high speed fly by's with the Bandit whistle. Always good for a full grin. Glad to hear the maiden went well.
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Old Sep 14, 2003, 10:01 AM
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Flint's Avatar
Australia, ACT, Canberra
Joined May 2001
1,794 Posts
Quote:
Originally posted by Al P
You are very brave or slighty crazy for launching at partial throttle.
I launched my Absolute at half throttle the other day and nearly crashed it, never again!
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Old Sep 14, 2003, 03:29 PM
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AZ_Astro's Avatar
Tempe, AZ
Joined Nov 2002
1,966 Posts
Thanks to everyone for your comments.

Two more flights with the Bandit this morning. I followed opualuan's advice and used the motor only for climbing. Duration was MUCH better, and I actually had time to enjoy the flights today. On the second pack, I was able to perform a few screaming dives over the field - awesome!

Throttle notes: Perhaps I am launching at 3/4? I'll pay more attention next time, but in any case I have enough throttle to launch and climb the plane out at about 30 degrees, but there is still some extra left. I guess hitting full throttle with the Bandit in my hand just scares the granola out of me.

On flight #2 today, I launched as usual and once the Bandit was about 50 feet out, I went quickly to full and observed a 40 degree torque roll left. Worth mentioning and remembering!

Landing notes: I land the Bandit in much the same way as my pylon racers and warbirds, except that it's hotter and has a shallower glide slope.

I circle down (use spoilers as needed) and bleed off some speed until I'm about 40-50 feet near the end of the downward leg, not moving real fast and with spoilers off; make the first turn; don't let it slow too much, make the final turn, hit spoilers; now at this point I've got about two football fields ahead and the Bandit is about 20 feet high and still moving pretty fast, continue to bring the Bandit down and bleed off speed, aim to just clear the little berm (hill) between the two football fields, clear the berm by about 3 feet, and finally put her down. 30' slide to stop.

Soho:

I will definitely work on stalling the Bandit at altitude until I have a better feel for the stall speed. Great tip!

And "Roger That" on the pointing nose down to increase speed, and committing to landing.

Al P:

As mentioned above, I had enough power to launch and climb, so throttle was probably more like 3/4s, not 1/2. I also give a strong javelin throw, but you're right, there's no substitute for the power! I'll watch it and try to (gulp) increase it.

And you're right - that first flight I flew it like a pylon racer with too much on-throttle. Much better today!


***

Still using the 12x8 Aeronaut Carbon CAM prop. Will switch to the 13x11 when I get brave.
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Old Sep 14, 2003, 04:05 PM
Single-task at best...
tim hooper's Avatar
Telford, UK
Joined Feb 2000
7,488 Posts
AZ,

Well done and welcome to the club!

Like all the rest said, the motor is only used for the climbout at full throttle. For the rest of the flight it isn't used at all - a little strange to begin with, until you realise that the Bandit is actually slower in level flight with the motor running, than it is with the blades folded.

Glad to hear you're using the spoilerons; takes a lot of the drama out of landings.

tim
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Old Sep 14, 2003, 04:30 PM
DLG Fan
AZ_Astro's Avatar
Tempe, AZ
Joined Nov 2002
1,966 Posts
tim hooper:

Thanks! After reading all the Bandit threads here in RCGroups, I definitely wanted the spoilerons to ensure that I could put her down on our somewhat small field. Reading ALL the Bandit info on EZone helped me out a ton...

Motor for climb-out only: definitely a new concept for me. But it works just fine. Now I want to see what kind of duration I can get out of the packs.

<<<until you realise that the Bandit is actually slower in level flight with the motor running, than it is with the blades folded.>>> Really? Wow.

Soho et al:

Power dives: ever with power on??? What about TIC's inverted power dives? Heh heh.
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Old Sep 14, 2003, 06:13 PM
high-speed freak
opualuan's Avatar
San Jose, CA
Joined Sep 2001
3,863 Posts
the pitch speed for your setup is ~40-50mph if I remember right... a committed dive from way up can net 130mph+ pants-filling screaming low passes over the field... gravity gets you the speed, the sleekness keeps you from slowing down too much... a prop will only slkow things down... I've seen bandits with the hacker setup flown normally, and a jeti setup flown like a sport plane, the jeti version the way it was flown was pathetic, the hacker version flown 'right' is a real head-turner.
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Old Sep 14, 2003, 08:09 PM
tic
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New Cumberland, PA. US
Joined Dec 2000
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nope, dives inverted or rightside up are all done power off...what I do at the end of an inverted pass is a full powerup while still inverted and come up over the top... Just started doing that.. it's pretty cool... congrats on your first flights. now try an eggbeater!
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Old Sep 14, 2003, 08:21 PM
DLG Fan
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Tempe, AZ
Joined Nov 2002
1,966 Posts
tic:

How high do you start your dive? Anywhere from 500 and up, I'd imagine... Pull-out at 50 feet or so? Straight up (power on?), then full stick Right and Down, right? Hold for a few secs, then recover...

Whoah boy! I'm gettin ahead of myself. Still gotta work on the landings, for garbonzo's sake.

I'm hoping to get a video of next weekend's flights with the Bandit. Will let you all know! I'm no pro but I think it's worth doing. I had three Bandit videos to help me prepare, but two of them must have been incredibly light setups as the Bandit slowed way down for them. The third video was much more representative and showed the Bandit landing with about 100 feet of sliding....
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Old Sep 15, 2003, 12:38 PM
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originaljoe's Avatar
portland oregon
Joined Mar 2002
149 Posts
A pointer from Bandit flyer

I love thinking about my first Bandit flight so it is great to hear the enthusiasm.

Since the Bandit is often the first high performance plane for many I thought I would mention something important I have learned.

Glue those wing servos directly to the wing and don't use tape or shrink around the servo like you may have learned do do. Use MG servos. If you need to replace the servos it will most likey be easy to pluck them from the pile balsa you have created.

I planted mine (on a hot day) after I noticed it was responding a little sloppy and stupidly kept flying. It was one of those times when I was really "On''. You know, a real hot-shot. (I was able to repair it but it's not the same- heavier.)

All of the servos were loose and by the way it was flying I am certain they were coming loose in flight and didn't jump free in the crash.

Another pointer might be to keep plenty of down elevator in the trim especially when landing. I give mine a lot of up trim when thermaling but always reset it to nice fast glide befor landing to avoid stalling.

I am hungering for an F5B 10 cell ship now but will fly Bandit for a few more months to see if there are any more lessons to be learned.
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Old Sep 15, 2003, 01:31 PM
DLG Fan
AZ_Astro's Avatar
Tempe, AZ
Joined Nov 2002
1,966 Posts
OriginalJoe:

Thankee for the tips. I'll be checkin' the servos and watch the trim...

It is apparent that there is a devoted group of Bandiholics here on the EZone. There is no question in my mind that the shared experiences have saved many a plane! And provided stimuli to try new and of course daring and foolish things with our planes!
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Old Sep 15, 2003, 03:19 PM
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Laurel, MD
Joined May 2001
12,684 Posts
original joe, f5f is EASIER to fly than the bandit. You are proabally ready....
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Old Sep 15, 2003, 07:57 PM
BiggerBetterFasterMORE!!!
Yogi's Avatar
Atlanta Hartsfield, Georgia, United States
Joined Apr 2002
1,046 Posts
check your elevator throw....

What tic hasn't told you in this thread is that his elevator throw is a bit MORE than the amount that they call for in the instructions. You will NOT be able to "push" out of a really fast inverted dive unless you have a bunch more throw on the elevator than what is called for. Ask me how I know...... I did an inverted dive shortly after I got my Bandit, and put it in the ground like a lawn dart. I did not have enough throw to push out, and crunched it up badly. I was able to repair it, and never did an inverted dive again. tic has worked up to this over many flights, and a lot of experimentation. I ended up killing my Bandit on launch by not throwing it directly into the wind. Full throttle, hard throw, left wing stall, inverted full throttle crunch into the ground. Stay on your toes, and pay attention to these things, and you'll be fine. Good to hear it went well. My maiden was just as eventless, but it got difficult after that when not paying attention.

~~fred
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