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Old Nov 15, 2011, 11:16 AM
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Farnborough, Hampshire, England.
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Yes, the Dutch roll is usually due to too much dihedral, but as far as the fin/rudder area is concerned, this model has flown very well(according to the kit maker), so I have no doubt that all in that department is fine.
Having said that, I increased the output arm on the servo to the rudder, as I figured that more is better than less in the way of rudder movement!But I did that after the initial flight.

The plan shows 2.75inch of dihedral at the wing tip, but the ply wing braces were much more than that!!The plan shows one wing PANEL FLAT on the board, SO, I assumed that the brace was wrong..............well, I was not wrong, its 2.75inches at BOTH wing tips.

I have just measured the wing, and have got 2.25inch at each tip............which seems enough to me, but not as much as the plan shows.

Ian
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Old Nov 15, 2011, 03:03 PM
I like real wooden aeroplanes!
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South-west France
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2.25" should be enough. I take your point about the fin area - but that would be referring to the model as a free-flighter - I think you will find that some of these old FF designs react rather differently when we start to control them and make them fly around where we want them to go rather than at their normal one speed/constant turn FF regime. Three of mine certainly have!
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Old Dec 12, 2011, 04:33 AM
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Cambridge, UK
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Hi

Did you get anywhere with this?

I have the self same kit beside me, also going brushless lipo ret, just wondered if you had any tips.

Nige
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Old Dec 13, 2011, 02:51 PM
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Maybe a little wingtip wash out (raise trailing edges of tips by 1/8") Your dihedral looks good.
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Old Dec 13, 2011, 04:18 PM
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I'd welcome feedback from anyone who has one of these flying successfully?

Nige
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Old Dec 14, 2011, 04:49 PM
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Farnborough, Hampshire, England.
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This is a nice kit, and should go together well..............my tip is to keep the aft end light.

I used fibrefilm on the wing, and for the fuselage, and tail feathers, balsaloc and litespan.
Although I decided that a short pushrod to the elevator was a good way to go, the 6 gram servo mounted in fuselage does not help the balance..........as there is still a 10 gram lead weight under the nose.

The wing tips were wedged at the leading edge by an 1/8th packing, but I still may have a little wash 'in'................so i really need to apply the hot air gun to untwist before I attempt another flight.

Ian
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Old Dec 14, 2011, 06:16 PM
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Hi Ian

Have you got yours flying successfully then?

Your last post seems to suggest lots of dutch roll and uncomfortable to fly?

Nige
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Old Dec 21, 2011, 02:29 PM
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I would be interesed to know how you are progressing in solving your problems with this model.

The reason for my curiosity is that earlier this year I attended the Vintage Rally at Cockabarrow Farm in Gloucestershire and saw this model flying and was sufficiently impressed to purchase a kit there and then, which is now sitting in my workshop waiting for my attention.

One thing that I did notice on the model I saw flying was that it had the recommended motor in it and a whacking great chunk of lead stuck underneath the nose! That being so it occurred to me that rather than follow suit it would be much neater to choose a heavier motor which reduced the need for so much lead. It also prompted me to note that the electrics should all be housed as forward as possible to minimise this situation.
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Old Jan 04, 2012, 09:08 AM
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Farnborough, Hampshire, England.
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I had to add some lead to the nose.............I hate adding any weight that does nothing for it's ride!!!.............In retrospect, I may well have been less than generous in this regard.

Come the warmer weather, I will endeavour to sort this model, and I'm sure that she will fly fine.............fingers crossed.

Ian
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Old May 09, 2012, 12:23 AM
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Ian,

It's been a while since you last posted and whilst the weather in the meantime has not been brilliant we have had occasional good days, so I wonder if you have made any progress yet? In the meantime "Quiet & Electric Flight" have published a reiew of the Ballerina by Roger Traynor in their May 2012 edition which does not appear to report any problems. From the photographs in the article the dihedral does appear to be somewhat greater than yours.
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Old May 09, 2012, 07:23 AM
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The model has been looking at me, and seems to say ' am I ever gonna fly?'..............so now the milder(but still wet down here) weather is here, I will be giving her another go.

Yes, I saw that article in Q&EFI at the bookstalls, but have not purchased it. I also recall that the flying bit does not report any obvious problems............
I will post as soon as I fly it.

Ian
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Old May 26, 2012, 09:30 AM
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I have ironed out a slight wing panel warp...........and fitted a 800 3 cell pack in the battery box(the last time was with a smaller battery stuffed up front). and have added about 25grams of nose weight in the way of two small copper wire coils..........
Its a little windy down here at the moment, but I hope to give her another go in the next day or so!.

ian
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Old May 26, 2012, 11:08 AM
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Ian,

I hope that your recent mods will have the desired effect. Fingers crossed!!
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Old May 29, 2012, 03:16 PM
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Monday morning was warm and only a light breeze................everything was crossed, and that was difficult when you have to hand launch, and work the sticks.......umm!!

The cricket pitch was being trimmed by the local authority, so I had to use the adjacent meadow.
Often that is ideal for models without gear, but at least the long grass makes a softer landing................in the event.

I launched with about 50-75% throttle, as I knew that with three cells she had more than enough power to get to height with ease.
The model was almost uncontrollable ,(as before, no change), and after a few seconds I got her down with the result shown in the photos, the front former was pushed back!!She was swinging from side to side in a sorta crazy Dutch roll , as it was on its maiden flight.

I did not have any tools with me, so I pulled the bulkhead forward by the prop.........this produced some downthrust, so I launched again with a couple of clicks of up...........this time, I gave it the beans................This effort produced loads of power, and she flew....but still she was not at all
easy, OR pretty in flight.
The second arrival pushed the motor bulkhead even futher back, and split the cross sheeting under the motor. See all the pictures for the damage. I'm pleased to say that the repair is easy, but I am still puzzled by this latest flight??? or lack of flight.

Ian
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Old May 29, 2012, 04:28 PM
I like real wooden aeroplanes!
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South-west France
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Very puzzling, there is no obvious reason why the Ballerina shouldn't be a perfectly stable two channel R/C model. The dutch rolling is normally the product of lack of fin area and/or too much dihedral, and is exacerbated by a rearward CG and too much rudder movement. Your dihedral looks pretty shallow in the photos, so that should be OK, I note you have added some nose weight, where is the balance point now as a percentage of wing chord? Can I suggest that when you next try it you tape a 1/16" balsa dorsal fin on to increase the fin area. The fact that it at least flew when you added some downthrust suggests that there may be too much incidence for the power you have.
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