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Old Jul 31, 2011, 06:29 PM
I fly, therefore, I crash!!!
SteveT.'s Avatar
San Jose, CA
Joined Jan 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WBFAir View Post
I appreciate your comments Lee and I give you credit for taking the time and making a Sunday post here, but just tell me/us just one thing.

Tell me you are not going to be taking the controllers you have already gotten an modifying them and then holding them for stock instead of sending them right back out to the senders all so you can hand them out to others at this show.

Ergo if you have any stock at this show and anyone other then ones that have arranged to pick theirs up there are getting one, that means that all the other senders who have sent in ones prior to this show who are not going to it will already have a controller modified and on the way to them, correct?
I think Lee already answered that question, when he said that as the cases and boards are glued together, and would probably get mangled in the process of taking them apart, I really think everybody is getting a brand spanking new one....

SteveT
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Old Jul 31, 2011, 06:42 PM
Registered User
United States, CT, Stamford
Joined Jan 2007
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Retooled...new...what ever.

Not to sound snippy but my main point here is that with what ever stock they have of controllers that they have before this show, that they are first sending them out to all the ones who have sent ones first and not instead holding on to that stock as they want to be sure to have enough for walk-in trades at this show.
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Old Jul 31, 2011, 09:18 PM
Lee Estingoy
Overland Park, Kansas, United States
Joined May 2003
723 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by WBFAir View Post
I appreciate your comments Lee and I give you credit for taking the time and making a Sunday post here, but just tell me/us just one thing.

Tell me you are not going to be taking the controllers you have already gotten an modifying them and then holding them for stock instead of sending them right back out to the senders all so you can hand them out to others at this show.

Ergo if you have any stock at this show and anyone other then ones that have arranged to pick theirs up there are getting one, that means that all the other senders who have sent in ones prior to this show who are not going to it will already have a controller modified and on the way to them, correct?


Geez, give this up. Please. Nobody is getting preference. If you've sent your controller in, you'll get a controller back. FIFO.

We are producing a large number to cover the early returns.

We aren't leveraging this with your controller, or anybody else's for that matter. We're guessing at maybe 50 walk ups at IRCHA and there are 10,000 out there to be replaced. Not sure what the issues with IRCHA are, and this isn't the place, but IRCHA will not interfere with you getting your controller.



Lee
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Old Aug 01, 2011, 06:42 AM
madgooner99's Avatar
Essex UK
Joined Jul 2007
40 Posts
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Originally Posted by lestingoy View Post
Geez, give this up. Please. Nobody is getting preference. If you've sent your controller in, you'll get a controller back. FIFO.

We are producing a large number to cover the early returns.

We aren't leveraging this with your controller, or anybody else's for that matter. We're guessing at maybe 50 walk ups at IRCHA and there are 10,000 out there to be replaced. Not sure what the issues with IRCHA are, and this isn't the place, but IRCHA will not interfere with you getting your controller.



Lee
Lee thanks for your reply. I think you've made it very clear that everyone is being treated equally in terms of availability of units

Can I ask, i have returned my controller that is brand new. How do I know I won't get an old refurbished unit that had 300+ flights on it.

Sorry what I'm asking is, do I get a new controller or my original controller returned fixed

Many thanks again

Ray
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Old Aug 01, 2011, 07:46 AM
A man with too many toys
United States
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Lee, are you guys modifying the 80HV also?
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Old Aug 01, 2011, 08:58 AM
Registered User
United States, CT, Stamford
Joined Jan 2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lestingoy View Post
Geez, give this up. Please. Nobody is getting preference. If you've sent your controller in, you'll get a controller back. FIFO.

We are producing a large number to cover the early returns.

We aren't leveraging this with your controller, or anybody else's for that matter. We're guessing at maybe 50 walk ups at IRCHA and there are 10,000 out there to be replaced. Not sure what the issues with IRCHA are, and this isn't the place, but IRCHA will not interfere with you getting your controller.



Lee
Well I'll tell you what, one of the first problems here is that I as a paying customer of your products one of which is known to be defective who has sent that product in for a repair who is having a problem with the way it's repair conditions are being handled is getting responses like "Geez, give this up"

Quite frankly Lee, and I guess this one is directed at you but, your responses to the questions I have asked here are a bit riddled with issues and contradictions and vagueness so if you have a problem with this going on so long, perhaps you can just give more simple and direct answers to questions.

Sorry to have to say that but I am asking simple questions here and am getting attitude and could go both ways answers. So if you want this to be "given up" as you put it, perhaps you could just give some direct answers.

Second, seeing as you have asked and quite frankly I have gone over what my problem is here but I guess to put it all out again.....


On about the 18th of July it was announced that Castle had tested and found a problem with a particular few of their controllers, and that as specifically it was mainly the HV120's, they did the great and right thing and announce they would for free be taking returns of these controllers and sending back ones that were corrected.

Later that week the send-in instructions were made on about the 20th I think and so for example, I and as I'm sure many others sent in their controllers very soon after that and since then, as we wanted to be in as close a FIFO thing as could be.

Not to long after that and I'm not sure where, it was announced that due to the volume of controllers expected to be sent in along with the limited resources Castle had to send corrected ones back, it could be around a 4 to 6 week wait for their return.

Which again, I say is fine and while the thought of waiting a whole month without a flying model is miserable, give why, I can take that.

So to recap the time line here at that point, being that you probably have gotten some of the earliest controllers in the early week of July 25-29, the earliest those early senders might see these would be late the third week of Aug or the 4th week of it.

So next we get to a question that was posted here on RGG on the 25th and replied to on the 25th to as if there would be any controllers available for exchange at IRCHA which is going to be held on Aug 10th-14, and the reply was, possibly if they have any available, and as well was also again restated by a reply by you on the 29th that this is actually a certainty as you posted that if you have not sent in a controller and want to exchange one at IRCHA, to write you so that you would know how many to bring.

So here in lies the first problem as if the reason that others who have sent in their controllers way before IRCHA are not able to get their return before IRCHA is for as Castle has stated, that is would take longer due to its limited resources, then where are all these controllers you intend to hand out coming from???

And if you have these, why aren't they going to the people who have sent in controllers much sooner who are going to be waiting weeks without one, but instead are going to ones who just show up at this show?

So simply put Lee, as I said, if you really are doing a full FIFO thing as you say, then this will only be the case if all the people who sent in controller's prior to Aug10th have one in the mail and or on its way so that what ever ones you are handing out at IRCHA are from a more then that stock.

Otherwise given that I suspect there will only be a certain amount available by Aug10th, you are not doing a FIFO thing at all, but instead taking the ones from what ever that limited stock will be and keeping them to instead give out others who are well behind in the way of FIFO sender, which in no way is a FIFO thing on any level.

Now I know you have replied vaguely that you expect that some should be going out this week but that really isn't a full answer to my question regarding your intentions at IRCHA.

So then I guess my third problem is why would Castle do this?

Which I can only think is because they know how much the IRCHA is such a public exposure situation and so are more concerned with what might happened there and in regards to Castle's rep and direct person to person situations there, then getting the controllers back to the ones who sent theirs in already and so as such, are not doing a FIFO thing but instead focusing on that situation first.

And like I said, if this is the case then I'm sorry but that is too bad as if this is what Castle is first concerned about, then they should have done this testing way before IRCHA so that they could have already addressed this problem and gotten out controllers to ones who are either are going or not going to this show, and so as that was their decision to not do this, I don't think it is fair to make the ones who sent in their controllers before Aug10th suffer by waiting longer so that Castle and can use the limited amount of controllers they have by Aug10th to save face at IRCHA.


So given all that I just stated Lee, this is what I want to know and it is a really simple thing answer.


YES we are committed first to a FIFO thing but as well, do plan to have controllers at IRCHA so yes, as these are going to be above the stock we needed to complete the all the returns from send-ins what have gotten to that date, this means all the ones who have sent in controllers before Aug 10th will either have been sent theirs already, and or have one in the mail.

NO, we have decided that we care more about things at IRCHA then the people who have already sent in a controller before that, so as we will only have a certain number of corrected controllers by then, we are not going to be sending all of those out first in a FIFO thing, but instead are going to hold a certain amount of those so that we can hand them out to walk-ins at this show ahead of those who already sent them in.

That is all I am asking and given all that has been stated, it is either going to one of those two answers, so just quote one, and just say that is what you are doing.
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Old Aug 01, 2011, 11:19 AM
Lee Estingoy
Overland Park, Kansas, United States
Joined May 2003
723 Posts
So far we've only received one controller from CT. The customer's initials are SP.

Is that you?- WBFAIR isn't' much for us to go on.

Lee
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Old Aug 01, 2011, 11:31 AM
Registered User
United States, CT, Stamford
Joined Jan 2007
809 Posts
Lee I received your PM asking for my personal information in regards to this matter and quite frankly, I really don't see what this has to do with anything.

Quite frankly I am not inclined to reply to that as about the only reason I could see that you would want this is either that you want to single me out in a bad way because of all that I am posting by who knows how.

Or that you want to single me out in a good way to be sure I get a controller as you think that is all I care about.

The point here and my concern is not what happens only to me but how others are treated as well.

So here we go again in all I have asked is a simple question and again, I am getting round about responses to that.

Just answer the question I have posed so that I and others know what Castle is going to be doing.

That is all I want from this.
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Old Aug 01, 2011, 11:36 AM
Lee Estingoy
Overland Park, Kansas, United States
Joined May 2003
723 Posts
Not much more I can do for you.

This is a no win situation.

Regards,

Lee
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Old Aug 01, 2011, 01:59 PM
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United States, CT, Stamford
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lestingoy View Post
Not much more I can do for you.

This is a no win situation.

Regards,

Lee
Actually Lee this is a very simple win situation.

Really Lee, I just can't understand why you just won't answer a simple question.

From all that has been said as well as the recent indirectness and oddness of your behavior of first wanting to know who I am and actually trying to research this, for what relevance that has to do with this I don't know, and as well refusing to say that you guys are not planning to hold stock back from people who have already sent in their ESC's so that you have that to give to walk-ins, and then commit that this is going to be true by saying all the people who have sent in controllers prior to this show will be getting ones returned before it...

The only conclusion I can come to is that you guys are in fact going to be holding back stock so that can give them to walk-ins at this show.

So sorry to say but since that is the case, one, I think its pretty low that you are just plain lying to us about that you are in fact doing a FIFO thing when you are not. And two that I think its pretty scummy of you guys to exploit a bad situation that your company created to your companies advantage by providing controllers to people at such a public event before you return ones to the people who will be having to wait weeks, and now it seems even more, to get theirs back because you are using the limited amount of stock you will have to do this with.

So think of me what you will but any ill feelings about this or its ultimate exposure or fall out from that, is on your guys heads as one you are doing this, and two, you are refusing to even admit it and are lying to us about what it is you are doing.

So if this is a no win situation, you certainly have been given the chance to make it one but it was you guys who chose not to.
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Old Aug 01, 2011, 03:24 PM
Registered User
Michigan, East of Hell
Joined Jan 2009
90 Posts
WBFAir,

You're taking this WAY, WAY too far -- to the infantile, even. I think Lee has been more than fair with you. Note the word fair. Lee has written under no uncertain terms that replacements are FIFO -- First In First Out. I understand your points but to refuse Lee's PM requesting information so he could find YOUR ESC is simply beyond the pale.

I'm done.

Scott
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Old Aug 01, 2011, 03:32 PM
Registered User
Chicago 'burbs
Joined May 2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dunkonu23 View Post
WBFAir,

You're taking this WAY, WAY too far -- to the infantile, even. I think Lee has been more than fair with you. Note the word fair. Lee has written under no uncertain terms that replacements are FIFO -- First In First Out. I understand your points but to refuse Lee's PM requesting information so he could find YOUR ESC is simply beyond the pale.

I'm done.

Scott
Hmm, it would seem more fair to replace those ESC's from the guys that bought them first!
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Old Aug 01, 2011, 03:33 PM
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United States, CT, Stamford
Joined Jan 2007
809 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by dunkonu23 View Post
WBFAir,

You're taking this WAY, WAY too far -- to the infantile, even. I think Lee has been more than fair with you. Note the word fair. Lee has written under no uncertain terms that replacements are FIFO -- First In First Out. I understand your points but to refuse Lee's PM requesting information so he could find YOUR ESC is simply beyond the pale.

I'm done.

Scott
Actually Scott, that is not true.

Look at post the #63 that he made just yesterday and he writes it exactly that way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lestingoy View Post
Geez, give this up. Please. Nobody is getting preference. If you've sent your controller in, you'll get a controller back. FIFO.
In fact is was him that even coined the phrase, "FIFO" by saying that exact thing.

As well this has been my main question for this whole thing and along with continuing to sometimes elude that this is the case, he refused to say it up till then as to if this will 100% be the case, but further more to back that up by committing that will be true by saying they will be supplying all the people who sent in controllers with their returns before they give ones out at this show.
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Last edited by WBFAir; Aug 01, 2011 at 03:38 PM.
Old Aug 01, 2011, 03:36 PM
Registered User
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Hahn View Post
Hmm, it would seem more fair to replace those ESC's from the guys that bought them first!
Well with them giving them out at the show, just buy one the day before and show up there and you got one.

Don't even need to send it in and you get one ahead of others else who did.
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Old Aug 01, 2011, 03:49 PM
Registered User
United States, CT, Stamford
Joined Jan 2007
809 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by dunkonu23 View Post
I understand your points but to refuse Lee's PM requesting information so he could find YOUR ESC is simply beyond the pale.

I'm done.

Scott
Also Scott I just wanted to add, that this is not about me and I am not doing all this to get special treatment by being a squeaky wheel gets the grease person.

As I've stated, so long as it is for the right reasons, I don't care how long it is that is takes for me to my controller back and if that is all I wanted, I would just have called them directly.

Its about right and wrong and doing the right thing and not taking a thing you did wrong and that has done much wrong to others and figuring out a way to exploit that to your own advantage.

And so sorry if I believe these are principles you don't think are worth making such a fuse over but I happen to think they are.
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Last edited by WBFAir; Aug 01, 2011 at 03:55 PM.
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