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Old Jan 14, 2013, 09:12 AM
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Ed Crowell's Avatar
Southern Calif
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Here are a few more pictures from yesterday. I am still experimenting on setting up the sails on my C-J. I must have had the boat out of the water 6 times to adjust it.
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Old Jan 19, 2013, 12:53 PM
RB
Joined Nov 2012
107 Posts
Walk the Plank

Walking the Plank #563

Some thoughts on planking the deck – now that I have completed this phase of work.

Scale: I believe it is important to have plank sizes that reflect a sense of scale. This becomes a balance between the visual aspects and the installation of workable sized pieces. The full size J’s were 119 – 135 ft long and a beam of 19 – 23 ft. The C-J is 122 cm X 22 cm so, 1 cm per foot seemed a reasonable scale to adopt and is easy to work with.

Plank Size and Spacing: I cut planks 5 mm wide– plus the thickness of bristle board for the caulking seam and almost 2mm thick. Their length is based on a 7.5 cm (3 “) module and the longest planks are 5 modules. The 7.5 cm spacing was marked out along the perimeter of the hull and lines were drawn at right angles to the hull edge to the center line of the boat. This kept all plank joints at 90 degrees. The king plank is double width without a caulked seam in the middle and straight. I did not feel confident I could cut a notched traditional king plank. I found I needed to cut about 50% more planks than I needed. I should mention I used cedar and cut planks 24 “long . I calculated I would need about 100 planks and cut about 160. A 24 “ piece of 2 X 2 will give you 50 – 60 planks.

Weight: The planking obviously adds weight above the CG – but how much, and is that amount acceptable ? If the total boat weight is within the allowable – 6.5 kg, then I guess it is ok. However, any weight savings (below the 6.5 kg) as a result of no planks, means that the savings can be added as additional weight directly on top of the keel. And what is the impact on performance of a planked deck boat? Theory tells us a lower ballast ratio will mean a slower boat under some up-wind conditions. So at this point the weight impact is as follows:
a) weight of the bare hull 613 gr
b) weight of hull plus beams and sub deck (1/32” ply) 1001 gr
c) weight of hull with planked deck (no finish) 1140 gr

I sanded off less that I planned, so I think another 20 g might be gained. I have not installed the ballast but will do this after the hatch opening is cut.

Installation: The longest plank was 5 times the 7.5 cm module, or about 15 “ long. The first row of planks were installed so all were about equal in length and the middle one 15” long.. The next plank was installed starting at the module next forward and so on. This produced a reasonable scale and pattern of joints, and the joints repeat along the 90 degree lines every 5th plank. The black bristle board was glued to the planks in groups of 10 or 12 then separated and before installing on the boat. The edge plank (teak) was installed with push pins, drilled (7.5cm on center) and pushed thru the sub deck and into the wood below. The pin holes were filled with teak treenails. This edge plank provided a secure curved line to attach subsequent planks. The end planks of each row, require cutting very acute angles and this became more of a challenge as the work progressed and the angle became progressively more acute. I used Titebond III applied with a watercolor brush. The glue sets up in 10-15 min and is more or less waterproof.

I hope this may be of some interest and assistance to other plankers.

Richard
#563
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Old Jan 19, 2013, 01:19 PM
RB
Joined Nov 2012
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Keel Question

Keel Question

I am about to attach the keel but before I do…. ?? Should I epoxy it in place and fair it into the hull – a permanent attachment ? Or, should I employ the mechanical attachment afforded by the two screws and fair the keel and not the hull ? This way the keel could be removed if ever necessary ie for travel or shipment. I am thinking of aligning the keel and setting it to the hull with epoxy with wax paper, and then remove it for final fairing and living with a fine joint line between hull and keel. Any advice would be appreciated.
Richard
#563
I
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Old Jan 19, 2013, 06:02 PM
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Southern Calif
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I secured my lead keel to the hull with Bondo. After it cured I faired the lead keel to the hull then filled the seam with more Bondo. The hull appears to be one piece after painting.

How about posting some pictures of your C-J.

Ed
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Old Jan 19, 2013, 06:36 PM
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Pomona, CA
Joined Apr 2007
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In the case of my Canterbury, it took a little bit of filing down of the lead as well as building up the bottom of the hull with fairing compound to make a smooth transition. Personally I think trying to make the lead removeable would be way too much work. The hull and keel are already pretty easy to transport together (the boat lays nicely on it's side if you need to transpot it out of it's stand), I don't see that a removeable lead keel would make it that much easier. I bedded the lead keel with West Sys fairing compound when I bolted it on.

Sounds like your deck will be a real stunner!!!

Kevin
#551
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Old Jan 21, 2013, 11:54 AM
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Sequim, WA
Joined Jan 2004
162 Posts
I used West Systems Six10 to attach the keel to the hull. It's very easy to use, but a little expensive. I needed to do a little sanding on the keel, but didn't have to do anything with the hull. I needed to add a little more filling to the gap after it set up, I should have used a little more at first and them sanded it down to where it was flush with the hull.
Jim
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Old Jan 23, 2013, 02:26 PM
RB
Joined Nov 2012
107 Posts
Waterline question etc

Hello... and another.
Well the keel is on; set in epoxy and faired with 3M filler. I had some left over from a project some years ago. It has a helluva shelf life.

Well I floated the hull with servos, batteries and some lead - 300gr at the mast location etc and marked the waterline. It looks like it might be a bit high when I look at the various pics. Assuming your boat sits on its line; could someone please take a few dimensions - say at the bow and stern plus the distance along the hull from the bottom of the transom and same at the bow. (Unless there is thread somewhere on this.)

The deck is ready for a finish coat of what I'm not sure. I have about 5 trial finishes underway and most darken the cedar too much. I'm leaning to a wiped coat of marine Cetol Light to fix the colour and finish with tongue oil. The tongue oil can be easily renewed. I need about 10 cents of comments on this please.

Richard #563
Ed, I'll post some pics soon.
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Old Jan 23, 2013, 02:45 PM
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Australia, TAS, Penguin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by R Baker View Post
....I'm leaning to a wiped coat of marine Cetol Light to fix the colour and finish with tongue oil. The tongue oil can be easily renewed. I need about 10 cents of comments on this please....
For 1 cent's worth, I am wondering if tongue oil is applied using elbow grease??
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Old Jan 23, 2013, 03:09 PM
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Southern Calif
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Hi Richard,

I don't think Tung oil would be the best to use. I would suggest using several coats of spar varnish. It will also give you UV protection.

If I was doing a wood deck I would fiber glass it (very light weight glass) using West Systems epoxy and then put several coats of spar varnish over it.

My water line measures 7 7/8" at the bow and 6 1/4" at the stern.

Ed
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Old Jan 23, 2013, 04:20 PM
RB
Joined Nov 2012
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Ed,
Are those dimensions measured along the deck or on the hull ?
Richard
ps ya, tongue oil applied w/ elbow grease is probably too lightweight a finish. I'm stuck as a result of using cedar - it will darken regardless of what I use. Perhaps, Minwax Spar varnish...
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Old Jan 23, 2013, 05:34 PM
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Southern Calif
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The dimensions are measured from the top edge of the deck to under the hull in the middle.

Ed
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Old Jan 23, 2013, 11:49 PM
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Pomona, CA
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Since you're going to use Cetol light on the deck, why not overcoat that with the Cetol "gloss" product. I've used this combination on the teak trim on my big boat and it holds up pretty well. http://www.yachtpaint.com/usa/diy/pr...ine-gloss.aspx

If I measure from the tip of the bow down to the waterline (on the centerline) following the curve of the bow with a flexable tape measure, I get approx. 9.5 inches. Similarly if i measure from the edge of the deck at the transom, following the shape of the transom/hull down the centerline to the waterline I get approx.4.25 inches.
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 11:33 AM
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Sequim, WA
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Those two waterline measurements should start a discussion; just saying. Maybe Hans could add his thoughts/measurements.
Jim #503
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 05:23 PM
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Southern Calif
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One way to find the exact water line is to install some weight in the hull so it weights 14lb 5oz. Set it in the bath tub with some talcum powder floating on the water.

Ed
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Old Jan 25, 2013, 05:09 PM
RB
Joined Nov 2012
107 Posts
Waterline question etc

Hello,
The waterline (so far) appears to be 'as it floats', as apposed to the design waterline . The design water line is more important from a trimming perspective. The design waterline becomes the standard , where the 'as it floats' waterline will vary from boat to boat.
I've asked the UK guru and have a dimension or two and now have a dimension or two from y'all. I think it would be helpful to establish a control waterline. Perhaps if Hans is reading all of this; then it might start with his recommendation.
Richard

ps comments from Alan Horne in the UK as follows:

I'm not sure that there is a specified or designated waterline. I identified the waterline by floating a hull in the bath (very scientific!!) and it's about right for a boat that comes in at the minimum weight. I your boat is above the minimum, or the weight distribution is different, the waterline may vary a little. My dimensions are as follows:

255mm or 10 inches along the keel line from the bow.
145mm or 5 inches along the keel line from the stern.
60mm or 2 3/8ths inches measured down from the deck line at the mid point.

ppss what about the Kiwi perspective on this , svp
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