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Old Feb 15, 2012, 11:47 AM
One Idiot is plenty...
Dbox's Avatar
United States, OR, Portland
Joined Jun 2005
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Peter,thats a really cool post.I did not need the translation.
But more surprised with Arcteryxe's "Australian"
Rich,it is all depends on batteries.
Yuri
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Old Feb 15, 2012, 02:41 PM
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Peter M's Avatar
Newcastle, New South Wales, Australia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dbox View Post
.....But more surprised with Arcteryxe's "Australian"....
+1

Masterful command of the language! Especially liked the inclusion of "crack a fat", "burl" & "daks"!
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Old Feb 15, 2012, 03:25 PM
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Mreyello's Avatar
Deutschland, RP, Niederzissen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by la528it View Post

B40 7L 5s. That's a 4k+ kv setup on 5s
Do you mean 4Kw+?

To get there you require 230A at 5S!!
I tried the 9L 4,4:1 with 5S up to 1,5Kw with good results, 2Kw input is possible but efficiency drops down so no major performance benefit and a high risk of overloading.

The 6L Fai with 5,2: GB and 4S was good for 2,5Kw daily use, 3Kw seemed to be on knifes edge, after 10 climbs housing got about 100!
The 5L Fai at 4S and 6,7 GB performed better although it was way over the recommended rpm-limit.With static power about 3,2 Kw( droping down to 2Kw during the climb) i did about 30 flights until the rotor demagnetisised.

I did not try the 7L but i would be very surprised if it would survive 4Kw.


In my experience the 2-pole inrunners have their strong side on medium to high power with good efficiency, for extreme overloading i would prefere the 4-polers (like ARC,Mega or Neu)
Or maybe this one?:http://www.reisenauer.de/artikeldetails.php5?aid=452
as 8-pole with kontronik gearbox,proven to more than 4Kw at about 200g weight!
I desperately wait for a scorpion 6 pole outrunner sized in between the 22 and the 30series!!

Regards
Yello
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Old Feb 15, 2012, 03:41 PM
Livin it UP when Im goin DOWN
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Norway, Telemark, Skien
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mreyello View Post
In my experience the 2-pole inrunners have their strong side on medium to high power with good efficiency, for extreme overloading i would prefere the 4-polers (like ARC,Mega or Neu)
Yello
ARC and NEU are 4 pole motors. MEGA only makes 6 pole motors, and they are the best 6 polers you can find...
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Old Feb 15, 2012, 03:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mreyello View Post
Do you mean 4Kw+?

Pretty sure he was referring to the motor's 4286 KV.


Gryphon
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Old Feb 15, 2012, 03:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GryphonRCU View Post
Pretty sure he was referring to the motor's 4286 KV.


Gryphon
Oh sorry , i misunderstood!

But if 4000+ kv is "ballistic" or not depends on prop and GB ratio!
The RPM itself will probably work, my 5L at 4S has even more.

@Arcteryxxx

Yes, sure you are right,Megas are 6-Pole,sorry!

Yello
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Old Feb 15, 2012, 04:03 PM
Livin it UP when Im goin DOWN
Arcteryxxx's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GryphonRCU View Post
Pretty sure he was referring to the motor's 4286 KV.


Gryphon
That makes sense. (http://www.hacker-motor-shop.com/e-v...&t=3&c=38&p=38)

So was the GB a 6.7:1 ? Does Hacker make teethed shafts that will fit a Kontronik KPG 6.7 GB?

Btw: what will be the gain from using a 4300-ish kv motor and 6.7GB instead of a 3340 kv and a 5.2 GB? (numbers not important - same ratio was the intention)
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Old Feb 15, 2012, 04:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcteryxxx View Post
That makes sense. (http://www.hacker-motor-shop.com/e-v...&t=3&c=38&p=38)

So was the GB a 6.7:1 ? Does Hacker make teethed shafts that will fit a Kontronik KPG 6.7 GB?

Btw: what will be the gain from using a 4300-ish kv motor and 6.7GB instead of a 3340 kv and a 5.2 GB? (numbers not important - same ratio was the intention)
I am not sure, but i think there was a 6,7 FAI F5F version available?

In my case it was a modified Feigao 6,7 GB.
I got the gears hardcoated and did a 1 hour break in run on a speed 600 with no load in oil. i greased it with a f...ing expensive race-car driveshaft grease.
Yes ,i know this Feigao GB used to fail at 1,5KW and it has a poor efficiency but it was provided just for a short test.It works fine until now....

The theoretic advantage of the higher KV(caused by less motor winds) is the lower internal resistance and therefore the higher efficiency at higher currents.
Maybe the advantage is shortened by higher commutation losses but at the end the higher KV motor can usually handle more power.

Yello
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Old Feb 15, 2012, 04:35 PM
Livin it UP when Im goin DOWN
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mreyello View Post
I am not sure, but i think there was a 6,7 FAI F5F version available?

In my case it was a modified Feigao 6,7 GB.
I got the gears hardcoated and did a 1 hour break in run on a speed 600 with no load in oil. i greased it with a f...ing expensive race-car driveshaft grease.
Yes ,i know this Feigao GB used to fail at 1,5KW and it has a poor efficiency but it was provided just for a short test.It works fine until now....

The theoretic advantage of the higher KV(caused by less motor winds) is the lower internal resistance and therefore the higher efficiency at higher currents.
Maybe the advantage is shortened by higher commutation losses but at the end the higher KV motor can usually handle more power.

Yello
Thanks!
The Feigao GB; was it like this one?
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Old Feb 15, 2012, 04:51 PM
One Idiot is plenty...
Dbox's Avatar
United States, OR, Portland
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I personally demagnetized number of Hackers pushing them over the limits.
Never had this "luck" with other motors.
Yuri.
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Old Feb 15, 2012, 05:01 PM
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Yes ,when i received it,it looked like the one on your picture.
It is possible to machine a lot of useless material off,but to get it fit on a 26mm motor you need to drill new fixingholes.
The most important thing is to get it well centered,if you are intersteted i can post all modifications with pictures when i am back in germany at saturday.
To be honest, i would not recommend the use of this gearbox at 1,5+ Kw but in my case it works and it is the only solution i know which gives more than 5,2 ratio on 3,2mm shafts exept the Reisenauer. And it is cheap enough to afford a fail(if it doesnt kill motor and/or cotroller)

Yello
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Old Feb 15, 2012, 05:01 PM
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silicon valley CA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcteryxxx View Post
Thanks!
The Feigao GB; was it like this one?
Those Tacon motors are great (for a $30 motor) through a gearbox. I'm running the 4420kv motor on 4s in one of my hotliners. I have about 50 flights on it now, 2.6kw on a cool pack and 2950w on a preheated pack. Runs like a champ under these loads (185a on a cold pack, 200a on a warm pack). I will be trying one of their 28mm motors very shortly.
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Old Feb 15, 2012, 05:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dbox View Post
I personally demagnetized number of Hackers pushing them over the limits.
Never had this "luck" with other motors.
Yuri.
I still try to do so with my lehners and Hk2221, without success !!
I think i have to try harder!!

Yello
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Old Feb 15, 2012, 05:24 PM
Livin it UP when Im goin DOWN
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Norway, Telemark, Skien
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@Yello & CF:
The motor/GB in the picture has yet to be connected to an ESC, let alone a battery! Resting on the shelf for whenever a 600kv application is needed. Not going into a hotliner, but will be run at a modest level sometime in the future... If anyone wants to try it in a HP setup, let me know and I'll hand it down in exchange for some data and video posts
On the other hand I'll soon be running some tests with another Tacon 3650; the 3500kv with a KPG 5.2 attached. This will be the "little brother" of Joe's budget setup I hope, and after initial testing on 4S and 5S with a CC ICE controller, 15x16, 15x18 and 16x17 props, I hope I'll find the combo that fits the 200A HK budget controller as well. Aiming for 180A on 5S to be on the comfortable side of things. If the 3500kv is too much, the 3200kv will be next in line.
CF: As to the comment about the Tacons in general, did you know that these are in fact KEDA motors (just like in Joe's budget setup, but the 3650 instead of the 3660) but the only ones around with the 3.2mm shaft option (as far as I know....) and very reasonably priced as well. Same motors can be found at HKing, but only with 5mm shafts. Calcs like the ecalc.ch also have'em listed. Will be posting results in the Hotliners - General Talk thread in a week or two.
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Old Feb 15, 2012, 05:34 PM
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silicon valley CA
Joined Mar 2004
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I did not know that, but I certainly had my suspicions. Thanks for the information!

The way I try to find motors with the shaft I need (3.2mm) is by searching for rc car motors, as 3.2mm has been the traditional shaft size for decades. HK has started posting some 36mm turnigy motors with the 3.2mm shafts as well. I wonder how they compare.

I'll be looking forward to your post. I can share some data for mine as well as I test them. If all goes well in my plasma, one may go in for testing in my x-plane.
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