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Old Jun 07, 2011, 01:51 AM
Crash Tester
Tuctronics's Avatar
USA, WA, Walla Walla
Joined Sep 2010
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Build Log
Guillows B-17 Electric Conversion

Stock Guillows B-17. All wood as supplied in kit. 5 Gram motors with 6 Amp ESC. 5/3 props. Carbon fiber pushrods. Linear servo ailerons. Fixed Tailwheel with Carbon Fiber post.
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Old Jun 07, 2011, 08:07 AM
An itch?. Scratch build.
eflightray's Avatar
South Wales U.K.
Joined Mar 2003
13,795 Posts
Nice going. I started out many years a go on scale rubber job kits, sadly I just haven't got the patience or finger flexibility for build them anymore.

A balsa framework just has a touch of art about it, (so why do I build in Depron these days ? ).

Have you looked in the 'Sticky' thread up top on 'Guillow's Conversions', there's a few B-17 conversion threads. I'll stick with my 100" B-17 though, (I can still see it ).
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Old Jun 07, 2011, 12:36 PM
The "pro" in procrastination
Steve85's Avatar
Canada, ON, Kingston
Joined Mar 2004
2,899 Posts
Tuctronics,

Nice work so far! I have one of these partially finished, waiting until I find the inspiration to get back at 'er.

What are going to cover it with? Are those retracts?

Steve
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Old Jun 08, 2011, 12:16 PM
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USA, WA, Walla Walla
Joined Sep 2010
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I prefer very light wing loadig (Cause I crash) so I plan on using So-Lite Olive drab on top with Grey on bottom. Will be using the decals too. (after I scan them so I can print them on proper sticker paper later after they fall off. No retracts. Wheels will stay removeable as designed in the kit. I wonder if my plane weighs in less than the Beaver's? I will fly this with no LG over a wheat field for first flight.
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Old Jun 08, 2011, 09:26 PM
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Arvada, Colorado
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Nice work on that airframe!

The servos look like HS-55's...? What's the source of the motors? Any figures on the weight at this point of the build?
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Old Jun 08, 2011, 11:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Jugjock View Post
Nice work on that airframe!

The servos look like HS-55's...? What's the source of the motors? Any figures on the weight at this point of the build?
Basically HS55 copies. A lot of folks have had good success with the HXT 500 from HobbyKing.

I was wondering about the motors also. They are the 5gm motors, and not the 10gm?
They looked like this one, although I know so many look the same:
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...idProduct=5358
Those motors have held up on 3s for me, with the GWS 5030prop, although I believe most of them have been downsized to using the 4530 prop.

Looks like you've been pretty busy on this one. Coming along well.
You may think I'm nuts for saying this, as I once thought it was nuts also, but I've been covering planes that size and larger with Coverite Microlite, painting with as light and efficient of a coat as possible. I started ending up with AUWs that I once never imagined possible, especially given the way I initially started building.

Bill
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Old Jun 09, 2011, 12:35 AM
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Heavy man, and good luck.
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Old Jun 09, 2011, 02:01 AM
Crash Tester
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USA, WA, Walla Walla
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Thanks Jugjock. Thanks Ocminimoto. Thanks Onna. These are the 5 gram and not the 10 gram motors.
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...idProduct=6312
For those of you who don't know Onna, he just put my Stuka on notice. Onna, you over power your planes anyway. (): With a Lipo in the nose, The B-17 actually balances proper CG the way it is in the pictures. The weight of the plane with all gear, motors, servos, pushrods, as seen in the photo. No battery or receiver or covering. 14.8 ounces. all 4 motors should provide about 11 ounces of thrust.
GWS 5030 prop 8,950 rpm, 1,83 amps, ~76g thrust. But will it ROG with those little motors? Standby.
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Old Jun 10, 2011, 12:02 AM
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Originally Posted by Tuctronics View Post
Thanks Jugjock. Thanks Ocminimoto. Thanks Onna. These are the 5 gram and not the 10 gram motors.
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...idProduct=6312
For those of you who don't know Onna, he just put my Stuka on notice. Onna, you over power your planes anyway. (): With a Lipo in the nose, The B-17 actually balances proper CG the way it is in the pictures. The weight of the plane with all gear, motors, servos, pushrods, as seen in the photo. No battery or receiver or covering. 14.8 ounces. all 4 motors should provide about 11 ounces of thrust.
GWS 5030 prop 8,950 rpm, 1,83 amps, ~76g thrust. But will it ROG with those little motors? Standby.
The motors look the same as the 10gm, as they must be from the same HK supplier. I have one of those 5gm motors running on 2s in my Rumpler with a 5030 prop. I thought it was a 4530, but just checked and it is a 5030. They are impressive little buggers. I have a feeling that they may survive 3s with a 4530 prop, for a bit of added power.

I'll be optimistic about your plane. My 19+oz Guillows DC3 does quite well on 2 relatively small outrunners with 5" 3-bladers. It only has 2 motors, while you have 4. It will ROG also, and the labored takeoff looks really good. It requires really smooth pavement to keep rolling straight however, after the tailwheel comes off the ground. When on the ground, the little hard plastic tailwheel bounces all over the place.

Good to hear that the CG is on target. The large area of covering on the tail surfaces was what I concluded was killing my CGs, when I had frames that looked promising. I got sold on the ultralight stuff for all tail surfaces, after that.

Bill
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Old Jun 10, 2011, 02:25 AM
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Onna, What kind of paint do you paint your covering with? Do you prep the covering with sand paper or anything? Do you use airbrush? Clearly you have the painting under control from the look of your planes.
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Old Jun 10, 2011, 06:41 PM
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Onna, What kind of paint do you paint your covering with? Do you prep the covering with sand paper or anything? Do you use airbrush? Clearly you have the painting under control from the look of your planes.
I just live with the chipping, as it's not that bad. I've used light Scotch padding on standard weight coverings, but no prep on Microlite. I just spray Model Masters cans and airbrush paints on the covering. I've found other sprays that work well too. The Microlite needs to be painted slowly, and will relax considerably. After drying, the covering will tighten back up, and careful heat gun or high power hair dryer shrinking is used when needed. Pat Tritle has used vinegar for etching on Microlite, I believe.

The little Stuka has airbrush paint on the underside, and masked can spray on the top, with some brush painting of can sprays. The airbrush spraying is good for extremely light weight finishing, as you can mist it on from a distance, applying very slowly and evenly.

For the B17, the reason I brought up Microlite is that it has really helped me lighten planes that have a tendency to become heavy for their size. I love the scale look of sheeting, but I have come up with an acceptable compromise between looks and light weight. I sheet the fuses with light 1/32" balsa and often cover with Econkote, but use Microlite on the tail surfaces and wings. I've been living with the open framework appearance on the wings, as it doesn't look too bad as long as the fuse is sheeted. There's always the option of partial light sheeting on the top forward section of the wing panels, which is where covered open framework shows the most. Given the amount of covering used on wings, you can really shave some weight off with Microlite covering. I recently finished a 53" Curtiss America biplane seaplane at around 32oz, which never would have been possible without Microlite covering on the wings and tail surfaces.

Bill
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Old Jun 11, 2011, 02:32 AM
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Arvada, Colorado
Joined May 2004
914 Posts
Tuc -

Bill is spot on about spraying Model Masters on Microlite foil coverings in the above post. I second his recomendation to proceed with very light coats. On my Stearman conversion, I got carried away and attempted to cover the film in one coat. Evidently, the propellant or other chemical in the built up paint layer warped the foil and I could never get the wrinkles out, even with a heat gun. It's tempting to keep applying more paint during that first coat, but resist the temptation to do it all at once.

My guess is that the outer layer of the paint dried just enough to trap the solvent type elements in the still wet paint below, in effect trapping them. Unable to evaporate quickly, the solvent had a longer period of time to attack the foil. With a light coat, the solvents more readily evaporate and have less time to affect the foil.

I pickled my Microlite with vinegar, and scuffed it up a bit with a 3M Scotch Brite pad. The scratches were somewhat visable through the paint, but most people probably wouldn't notice them at first glance.

Just my 2 cents worth, based on limited experience.

Chris
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Old Jun 13, 2011, 04:54 PM
Crash Tester
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USA, WA, Walla Walla
Joined Sep 2010
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Here is a bulkhead graphic inspired by the Guillows plans.
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Last edited by Tuctronics; Jul 06, 2011 at 03:48 PM.
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Old Jun 19, 2011, 12:55 AM
Crash Tester
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USA, WA, Walla Walla
Joined Sep 2010
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Name: B17NoCover.jpg
Views: 353
Size: 118.4 KB
Description: 18.2 ounces including battery.
18.2 ounces with everything except covering and plastic nose and cabin windows.
Name: AileronServo.jpg
Views: 309
Size: 89.8 KB
Description: Small linear servo for AilerionName: B17Elec.jpg
Views: 342
Size: 83.7 KB
Description: Electrical wiringName: B17MoodShot.jpg
Views: 295
Size: 120.9 KB
Description:
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Last edited by Tuctronics; Jun 19, 2011 at 01:04 AM.
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Old Jun 19, 2011, 12:59 AM
Crash Tester
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USA, WA, Walla Walla
Joined Sep 2010
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I used this program: CG Calculator for RC Aircraft
Guillows B-17 CG reported at 3.7 inches back from leading edge at root of wing.
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Last edited by Tuctronics; Jun 19, 2011 at 01:10 AM.
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