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Old Feb 16, 2013, 02:02 PM
Trying to grow up !
lt.Hayata's Avatar
Brazil, MG, Belo Horizonte
Joined May 2012
161 Posts
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Originally Posted by lt.Hayata View Post
This is happenig to my quad:
carbon birds 775 + carbonbird18A ESC programed as /low voltage cutoff protection=low;start mode= normal; timing= medium, using 3s or 4s .
No matter NAZA or Paris V4 as CB, after a wile,( +/- 5 min hovering very stable in LEVEL OR AUTOPILOT) when I command yaw turn to right, the left(oposite) motor reduces more than needed and there is a "death flip".
This does not happnes with turnigy plush 25A ( old, not 400hz) nor even in manual mode.
I can only think about ESC issue, even the orange receptor was replaced.
NAZA was covered from sun liht.
Any suggestion?
I did some changes: isolate BEC from ESC, change motor bearing, Change timing from medium to low, swap ESC and motor. Discovered motor has the problem. After new motor instaled, the problem does not happened anymore so far. I could try with NAZA too. It worked fine.
Those were bench test ( I īm afraid to fly...)
As soon as I can fly over soft grass I īll try it.
Thankīs everyone.
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Old Feb 16, 2013, 03:15 PM
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Joined Dec 2012
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first flight tune up

Thanks for the previous help folks! (I cleared the EEPROM and reloaded code, much better ; ) )

I am reasonably happy with the hand maiden on my Y6 and trying to get off the ground for a first flight. I am almost there but the Y6 wants to take off forward instead of straight up and also slightly Yaw right. From reading the noob guide I think that I need to adjust the rotation of the front booms slightly (they are set at three degrees in). Am I thinking correctly? If I change the rotation to 2.5 degrees say, that should decrease forward thrust? And... if I rotate the left boom slighty less than the right boom it should help with the clockwise Yaw?

Or? should I being doing something else entirely?

I have the Paris Sirius600 v4r3 with 2.1 code Quinton sent me.

Cheers,
Wigobo
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Last edited by wigobo; Feb 16, 2013 at 03:26 PM.
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Old Feb 16, 2013, 04:09 PM
I dont work here
Australia, SA, Adelaide
Joined Apr 2012
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Originally Posted by wigobo View Post
Thanks for the previous help folks! (I cleared the EEPROM and reloaded code, much better ; ) )

I am reasonably happy with the hand maiden on my Y6 and trying to get off the ground for a first flight. I am almost there but the Y6 wants to take off forward instead of straight up and also slightly Yaw right. From reading the noob guide I think that I need to adjust the rotation of the front booms slightly (they are set at three degrees in). Am I thinking correctly? If I change the rotation to 2.5 degrees say, that should decrease forward thrust? And... if I rotate the left boom slighty less than the right boom it should help with the clockwise Yaw?

Or? should I being doing something else entirely?

I have the Paris Sirius600 v4r3 with 2.1 code Quinton sent me.

Cheers,
Wigobo
Are you doing a stick calibration of the Gyro and Acc before the flight?

Is the COG correct?

Yes, you can tweek the angle to tune out yaw, but make sure the radio is set correctly first and you really have 1500 on the yaw channel at centre stick

Are you taking of in Level mode? It will need to be trimmed in flight before you get level take-offs, and you will always need to fly the aircraft "off the ground".. Until you are two meters off the ground you will not be in stable flight
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Old Feb 16, 2013, 05:24 PM
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[QUOTE=Deet_aus
Are you doing a stick calibration of the Gyro and Acc before the flight?[/I]
Yes, I think... Gyro - disarmed/collective back /yaw left led blinks
Acc - full throttle/yawleft/collective back led blinks... however - on rereading the ACC cal it appears I have to take off first and use the physical switches next to the sticks to achieve still hover...? I haven't been adjusting the slide switches... are these what are refered to as "sub-trims"? I guess I thought that other than the initial transmitter cal (1095/1500/1905) endpoints which I have done, I should make adjustments in software not with hardware...

problem is that I have too much forward motion at takeoff to have time to try and hover.

Is the COG correct? I have the battery mounted so that the Scarab is _slightly_ front loaded.

Yes, you can tweek the angle to tune out yaw, but make sure the radio is set correctly first and you really have 1500 on the yaw channel at centre stick
I have 1500 on yaw center.

Are you taking of in Level mode? It will need to be trimmed in flight before you get level take-offs, and you will always need to fly the aircraft "off the ground".. Until you are two meters off the ground you will not be in stable flight[
I am using acro (I have used level while in hand). It is winter here (and at night) so I am flying in the barn for now. It has too much forward motion for me to try and hover.
/QUOTE]

Getting closer!!!

thanks Deet_aus! I am in Upstate NY USA BTW
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Old Feb 16, 2013, 05:53 PM
I dont work here
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Joined Apr 2012
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move the lipo back until you have neutral COG
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Old Feb 16, 2013, 06:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Deet_aus View Post
move the lipo back until you have neutral COG
That makes sense.... I was following the directions...

Can you explain what you mean by this --->It will need to be trimmed in flight before you get level take-offs

Should I be using the trim switches on the radio next to the sticks? and as part of the ACC calibration? or are you talking about using stick banging.. I think that is what is confusing me.

Sorry I am totally new to the RC world.
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Old Feb 16, 2013, 06:34 PM
I dont work here
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There is a proceedure, that uses the radio sticks to trim ACC mode

DO NOT use the radio trims to try and trim out a mutlirotor
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Old Feb 16, 2013, 08:47 PM
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Australia, NSW, Sydney
Joined Sep 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlouetteIII View Post
it called ground effect GE - ground cushion or re-circulation - go straight up to 2m - then hover -
During GE you get variations in air pressure and AA - its random - air is a
fluid
Quote:
This can be a normal behavior. You can not be afraid to push throttle a little. All the turbulence so close to ground make this "ocillation.
Interesting I will hold that point.

Quote:
@robeast - post your GUI and a video of the quad flying (hand maiden always comes before a flight as per user instructions). Make sure your in acro mode - Futaba and JR work differently - Your problem is most likely assumption lock - so your convinced and locked onto one possible problem when its actually something else you set. Could be anything. For trouble shooting keep an open mind. Clear eeprom - reload code - reset GUI to default - set ACRO. if you want to return your 8J under warranty thats no problem. We will send it to Futaba AU and they will check it out fully for faults.

The hand maiden appears to be correct as much as it can be. All my tests have been in ACRO mode. My defaults for the Multiwii GUI match the screen shot as per your website Paris plug and play page http://www.multiwiicopter.com/produc...irius-v4r6-usb

My transmitter is set up as per shipped by you in model one using

stick trims are Zero
ch 1-8 sub trim : -7 / +8 / 0 / -7 / 0 / 0 / 0 / 0
ch 1-8 end point : 102/102 ; 102/102 ; 102/102 ; 104/104 ; 78/78 ; 78/78 ; 100/100 ; 100/100

I have not altered anything else and even attempted creating a new model and entered the above sub trims and end points the results have been the same. See the image of the GUI . The machine will not fly into a hover at 2 meters currently its practically uncontrollable. Having just changed to Futaba and having such a massive difference between the DX6i and T8J suggests that's going to be the issue especially when I cannot get a decent read out from the multiwiii GUI .

@Deet
Quote:
If the airframe istt level on power up then the gyro will be set incorrectly, or if it gets moved during initialization

Use the sticks to do the gyro and acc calibrations before you take off and you wont get that problem
So it might not be ground effect ? . I thought calibration of the gyro was a one time thing. I calibrated on a table and used a bulls eye to make sure my machine was pinpoint level. Why would you calibrate again on a launch surface that's never going to be perfectly flat ? . ie in a field.
I normally place my machine on the ground for launch then connect the battery.

Quote:
then take it one step at a time

if it pitches back at you , adjust the sub trim until that stops

THEN

use subtrim to fix the yaw

as long as you have enough stick throw to arm/disarm and do the stick calibrations don't worry too much about endpoints for now
I have tried this but because I cannot get a good read out on the GUI , it makes it near impossible. To get rid of the yaw I tried a nudge of a value of 2 in the sub trim and the craft immediately refused to de arm and still looked like yaw was being applied.

Rob
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Last edited by robeast; Feb 16, 2013 at 08:56 PM. Reason: add image
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Old Feb 16, 2013, 10:05 PM
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Australia, NSW, Sydney
Joined Sep 2012
77 Posts
So Debug : -

Default Multiwii gui matches what i have on my osx 10.6.7 screen
http://cdn1.bigcommerce.com/server36....1280.1280.jpg

Handmaiden done 1/3 power balanced on the palm on my hand 1/3 power. ok ACRO mode only.

Add props
Stick calibration of ACC and Gyro while on grass landing zone , if I move LZ do I need to re calibrate the gyro every time ? . My whole understanding was that the gyro should be calibrated once using a spirit level making sure the craft is totally flat. Other wise the craft will not hold auto level and hover as the gyros will be off.

I have managed to take off but the craft drifts all over the place I have managed to adjust the subtrims by a few notches, I also note that the sticks seem way more sensitive than the DX6i .

Rob

rob
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Last edited by robeast; Feb 16, 2013 at 10:28 PM.
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Old Feb 17, 2013, 12:10 AM
I dont work here
Australia, SA, Adelaide
Joined Apr 2012
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robeast, the gyro re-sets itself every time the board is powered, just like the tail gyro on a heli

If you bump the frame or its not level on power up the gyro gets set to the wrong initial point

that is why you need to do the stick calibration every time

The sticks on the Futaba will be more sensitive

Now you have it reasonably stable in ACRO mode, you can fine tune the yaw by adjusting one of the motor's tilt angle

And then try a flight in ACC mode

Auto level (is a bad description) uses the accelerometer NOT the gyro


NOT according to the GUI above you are flying in ACC mode unless Aux1 is set high
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Old Feb 17, 2013, 12:16 AM
I dont work here
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one tip for you rodeast
In the gui lower the rate and add a bit more expo until you get the hang of this
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Old Feb 17, 2013, 02:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Deet_aus View Post
robeast,

And then try a flight in ACC mode

Auto level (is a bad description) uses the accelerometer NOT the gyro


NOT according to the GUI above you are flying in ACC mode unless Aux1 is set high
I am not sure what you mean "NOT according to the GUI above you are flying in ACC mode unless Aux1 is set high" ACC mode is controlled by a 2 postion switch for AUX 1 . A test in the multiwii gui show it works and turns green.


Your last tip > lowering the the rate and expo. What does this do and how does it help ? . I am making a set of notes from all these tips which I will share.

Rob
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Old Feb 17, 2013, 03:58 PM
I dont work here
Australia, SA, Adelaide
Joined Apr 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robeast View Post
I am not sure what you mean "NOT according to the GUI above you are flying in ACC mode unless Aux1 is set high" ACC mode is controlled by a 2 postion switch for AUX 1 . A test in the multiwii gui show it works and turns green.


Your last tip > lowering the the rate and expo. What does this do and how does it help ? . I am making a set of notes from all these tips which I will share.

Rob
You said earlier you were flying in ACRO mode, But the GUI would indicate you are flying with the ACC ON, ACC= accelerometer, which is NOT ACRO mode

dropping the rates and the expo will make the quad less sensitive to the sticks

Rates is an overall sensitivity, expo works around mid stick
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Old Feb 17, 2013, 04:55 PM
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Australia, QLD, Hope Island
Joined Jan 2013
106 Posts
Deet,

I am sure I speak for other noobs on here but the one thing I have found hard to get my head around is all the jargon ie ACRO ACC BARO MAG etc etc

I have not found a reliable source yet that details what each mean and or if activated or deactivated what the cause and effect of each does.

And it appears depending on what GUI you use it changes for example the latest dev GUI has
Horizon and Angle and ACC no longer there...

I have not been able to find a wiki that clearly defines the Jargon
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Old Feb 17, 2013, 06:38 PM
Trying to grow up !
lt.Hayata's Avatar
Brazil, MG, Belo Horizonte
Joined May 2012
161 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by pacmanAUS View Post
Deet,

I am sure I speak for other noobs on here but the one thing I have found hard to get my head around is all the jargon ie ACRO ACC BARO MAG etc etc

I have not found a reliable source yet that details what each mean and or if activated or deactivated what the cause and effect of each does.

And it appears depending on what GUI you use it changes for example the latest dev GUI has
Horizon and Angle and ACC no longer there...

I have not been able to find a wiki that clearly defines the Jargon
we are trying to do this "ABC" here: http://www.multirotores.com.br/forum/topics/abc, but in portuguese!
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