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Old May 24, 2011, 10:59 AM
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Lama V4 Brushless Boardless Conversion Parts List

I am considering starting a BLBL conversion for my Lama V4 and wanted to get some feedback from those who have been through this on the parts list. I am looking for a budget build that will work (isn't everyone!)

Motor - Turnigy 1811 brushless Outrunner 2900kv

Receiver - OrangeRx Spektrum DSM2 Compatible 6Ch 2.4Ghz Receiver

V-Mixer - Dionysus coax mixer

ESC - Hobbyking SS Series 8-10A ESC

Gyro - HobbyKing GA-250 MINI-MEMS Gyro

Battery - 3S 850mAh

I would like to try and source everything from US vendors but it will be a cost consideration when I get around to this project.

Ethan
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Last edited by mountainsax; May 25, 2011 at 04:19 PM. Reason: Revised the parts list per some good suggestions!
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Old May 24, 2011, 11:27 AM
OlliW
Joined Sep 2009
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hey Ethan,

I would say that your motors would be "a bit" too large in diameter

I use these ones (or the quite similar C10)
Turnigy 1811 brushless Outrunner 2900kv

Depending on how heavily your lama is tuned (weight) you might find them however a bit to weak on 2S, but they are "perfect" on 3S

on 2S you might try
Turnigy 1811 Brushless Indoor Motor 3800kv

though some people report that this is not a good setup (I didn't had problems).

You also will need a gyro!
And it's here there the main "problem" of a BLBL conversion begins, since not all mixers work with any gyro...

Have fun,
Olli
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Old May 24, 2011, 11:54 AM
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Thanks Olli! I forgot about the gyro! I would ideally use something like the Hobbyking version of the 401b.

I am planning on using a 3S battery, so the 2900kv motor should be ok. It just occured to me that the motor is backwards from the Lama motors (pinion pointing up if mounted as shown in the pictures). Can you turn these around so that the pinion points down when mounted or do you just slide the motor shaft down so it sticks out the bottom??
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Old May 24, 2011, 01:49 PM View Post
OlliW
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Old May 24, 2011, 03:21 PM
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I was looking at your website Olli (my German is a bit rusty but good enough to navigate around ) I am thinking that you have to have the mixer...otherwise I'm not sure how you would connect the gyro to both motors...

More research needed...

Ethan
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Old May 24, 2011, 03:34 PM
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The Eflite G110 gyros are much smaller and cheaper used now. But the new GA-250 gyro at Hk is less than $10 and now is programmed for analog servos. This means it is compatible with vtail mixer frequencies. Do not use the Gws mixer. I have gone through half a dozen of them trying different combinations with different esc's and motors. They run so close to motor initialization when gain is set with any piezo gyro that quite often the blades spin at 0 throttle position when gyro gain is set to a usable value. The Dionysus coax mixers work far better since you can dial the sens down on them which allows you to dial the gain up on the gyro for better function. Unless you like playing with the Tx and dialing up gain while flying I would not use them. They also spike easily during any hard setdowns and loose the programming whereas the Dionysus mixer does not.
The motor selection you are using is too fat in diameter. The Turnigy 2900s work perfectly and the shaft simply presses down into position when releasing the allen set screws on the cap and removing the c clip from underneath. Here is a thread from the vtail section showing this. It is a Cx but they are somewhat identical other than motor position on the platform. Post 402. And you might as well do the 3s batt upgrade when doing this since it will more than double your flight times and power. Do not use the C10's as they have poor mounting stability and often come with aluminum wiring. The smaller Turnigy mixer will work flawlessly also as shown.
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...331390&page=27
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Old May 24, 2011, 05:26 PM
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Thanks!

Did you mean the GA-250 gyro? Looks good!

Where do you get your Dianysus mixer?

Will a 220mAh, 20C, 3s battery work?

Ethan
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Old May 24, 2011, 05:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mountainsax View Post
Thanks!

Did you mean the GA-250 gyro? Looks good!

Where do you get your Dianysus mixer?

Will a 220mAh, 20C, 3s battery work?

Ethan
Yes the GA-250. I edited the post. And the Dionysus mixer can be found here
http://www.dionysusdesign.com/produc...roducts_id/185
Dan at dionysus is personally programming this mixer to work with the turnigy esc's. He ordered two sets for programming them. One was the original one you listed, the other was the smaller one I posted on since it is much lighter. It is a pain to fit them under your canopy. So on mine I upgraded to a Trex 250 canopy. Here it is in flight.
2nd Vtail brushless custom 3cell in flight with an $8 chinacam (1 min 42 sec)
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Old May 24, 2011, 06:33 PM
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I must have missed something...which Turnigy ESC's are you referring to? I had originally listed a HK ESC.
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Old May 24, 2011, 11:19 PM View Post
OlliW
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Old May 25, 2011, 12:58 AM
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That is why I have questioned assan as to the timing of them (ga-250)actually hitting HK. Since I will pick one up and try it on existing systems immediately.
And mountainsax, I apologize for the error in escs as I somehow thought you were picking up the Turnigy.
I also agree with olli in that you need a much larger 3s batt. I have been successfully using the 850 ma 3s batts and they work great with more than 14 minutes of very hard flight times with my various vtails. The reason I listed the DD mixer is that it is not a vtail mixer as much as it is correspondingly directed at taking the gyro's output and interpreting the signal for the motors instead of the servos. So it does it far more effectively. That is why it is listed as a coax mixer. I spent considerable time talking to Dan at DD about the tech he is using and have to say it makes sense. Until someone comes up with a better system olli (hint hint) this is the one that has been working well.
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Old May 25, 2011, 03:00 AM
OlliW
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Quote:
Until someone comes up with a better system olli (hint hint) this is the one that has been working well.
to avoid missunderstanding, I didn't wished to say that the DD mixer is not working well... in fact I can't tell since I never had it in my hands... and it in fact might well be the best commercially available solution (which I can't tell because... ).

However, if coming up with a better system also allows for projects, I can mention two projects in the German forum RCLine, and one of it is the "Deluxe" Mixer of Achim, which I personally find impressive (Achim has even upgraded his SW to work with the digital modes of the GA250). So, then it comes to commercial solutions I have little to offer, but some good mixer projects exist.



Olli
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Old May 25, 2011, 04:21 AM
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hi ethan, lmh is the man with these brushless conversions, he has a great knowledge of these conversions. my brushless parts are as follows.....
2xc10 motors
2x turnigy plush esc's

gyro on order at moment, and waiting for funds so that i can order the dionysus mixer. decided myself on the assan ga250, very well priced here in the uk! have not been posting as of late, been over germany for me and the lads annual nurburgring pilgramage, lol.
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Old May 25, 2011, 06:37 AM
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Sorry, I meant to ask about a 2200mAh 20C 3s battery...would this be too much?

I updated the parts list, still a bit confused on the ESCs. Will the ones I have listed work or should I go with a Turnigy? What size Turnigy?

Have you guys used the HK GA-250 gyro, and will it work like the Assan?

Nasgul - welcome back! Nurburgring would be awesome to drive - I'm jealous!!
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Old May 25, 2011, 11:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mountainsax View Post
Sorry, I meant to ask about a 2200mAh 20C 3s battery...would this be too much?

I updated the parts list, still a bit confused on the ESCs. Will the ones I have listed work or should I go with a Turnigy? What size Turnigy?

Have you guys used the HK GA-250 gyro, and will it work like the Assan?

Nasgul - welcome back! Nurburgring would be awesome to drive - I'm jealous!!
just look at it like this Ethan:

a 2200mAh battery weights about as much as a ready to fly stock lama with battery and all ... is this too much ? ... I'd guess so ...
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