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Old Jul 13, 2011, 06:31 PM
Your user title is suggestive,
Xptical's Avatar
Warner Robins, GA
Joined Apr 2006
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Originally Posted by G_T View Post

Perhaps another thread is needed for installation of gear in DLGs.

Gerald
I'd appreciate that thread much more. All the programming in the world won't help overcome a bad mechanical setup.

My last DLG had one aileron hole about 2mm further out than the other. I spent days fiddling with EPA, subtrim, trim, and a bunch of custom programs. I got it good enough to fly, but I finally ended up ripping the horns out of the wing and re-mounting them properly.
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Old Jul 13, 2011, 07:02 PM
G_T
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xptical View Post
...
My last DLG had one aileron hole about 2mm further out than the other. I spent days fiddling with EPA, subtrim, trim, and a bunch of custom programs. I got it good enough to fly, but I finally ended up ripping the horns out of the wing and re-mounting them properly.
If you follow the procedure on setting up the flaperons from this thread, that would not have ended up as a problem. Just FYI, in case you encounter a similar situation again.

Gerald
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Old Jul 13, 2011, 07:08 PM
G_T
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Originally Posted by Xptical View Post
Okay. I think I get what you are saying then. Once the mechanical is set up, you center the flap stick and the aileron stick then use subtrims to put both surfaces at the exact same angle. Is that right?

Then you put the flaps up and use end-points to put the ailerons to the exact same angle? Or maybe aileron trim?
Yep, you use the servo subtrims typically accessible through the transmitter's menus to match flaperon dangle angle with the flap stick in the middle of its travel, and then use the servo travel adjustments to match positions with the flap stick all the way up and all the way down. Some offsetting may be required if the all the way up position does not make it to the speed mode setting, or if the all the way down position does not make it far enough down to give some braking action for flaps. Or, if clipping of aileron travel occurs when the flap stick is all the way up.

I hope all that makes sense.

Gerald
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Old Jul 14, 2011, 04:42 AM
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Originally Posted by G_T View Post
If you follow the procedure on setting up the flaperons from this thread, that would not have ended up as a problem. Just FYI, in case you encounter a similar situation again.
I'm sorry to say that but this is a highly optimistic assumption.
If you really want to know what even small deviations can do to your linkage try out this
http://www.envisiondesignusa.com/evd..._Overview.html
program. It is worth every penny of the 9.95$ you have to pay for and you get a feeling about the forces and what non-linearities you get.

jm2c
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Old Jul 14, 2011, 11:33 AM
G_T
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I am familiar with the forces and non-linearities. Using the procedure I suggested, the results will not be perfect but control surface match would have been close enough not to have been a problem. Been there, done that, for other people's planes. That's why I came up with the procedure in the first place.

Gerald

PS - I am not advocating doing a bad setup. Just if a bad setup is done, this is a way to deal with it.
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Old Jul 15, 2011, 07:16 AM
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Originally Posted by G_T View Post

PS - I am not advocating doing a bad setup. Just if a bad setup is done, this is a way to deal with it.
So the question stays, how is a good linkage setup done. Yes, this is a bit dependent on which transmitter is used and it is highly recommended to know the necessities before you setup a plane. Only if done so with as less failures as possible the beauty of your procedures can come in to play to eliminate or reduce the rest of the deviations.
To say the truth, i have not seen a good description of doing linkages here on RCG. Maybe you can lead me to one...

jm2c

maikoflyer
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Old Jul 23, 2011, 11:11 PM
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thanks

this is a great thread i just purchased my first dig and i had no idea the setup was this complicated.
thanks to all of you for your time in compiling all of this info
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Old Jul 24, 2011, 07:05 PM
Walter Roos
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Canton, Ga.
Joined Aug 2004
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Originally Posted by sprintr View Post
this is a great thread i just purchased my first dig and i had no idea the setup was this complicated.
thanks to all of you for your time in compiling all of this info
How complicated it is, is up to you, Somewhat.

You can just sit down on your couch and get the basic controls programmed in, and fly the thing. Adding the details later. It really is a good idea though, IMO, to set some flight modes ASAP. Launch, Speed, Cruise, and Thermal. With flaps for landing. Getting them perfect is not as important as getting out there and flying. And if possible find someone to fly with, and if they have some experience, so much the better. Flying alone can get old pretty quickly. You may just have to go out and recruit a few guys into DLG in your area.

walt
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Old Aug 03, 2011, 04:35 PM
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I'm new to DLG and the hardest part I think is just getting a good radio and receiver set up. I picked up a 72mhz 6exp and a micro receiver that worked fine till it got about 35 yards away it cut out on me. We think it was the carbon fuselage was te problem for the receiver. In the near future I am considering getting a 2.4 to get rid of half of the hassle but at the same time I don't know to well what to look for. For instance the radio I got has mixing and everything but until I got it and started setting it up and the only way it can mix properly is with a six channel rx and there is no way around it. So if any of you can point me to a good radio that has a lot of options for rx and is very easy to set up mixing on I would really like to know. All the different brands I understand have there different Prefrances and I understand that. I'm looking for something that works well particularly for DLGs at 6 ch that you can get good micro receivers for possibly pretty cheap and be able to mix pretty easy and not have to worry about much. Like yesturday I picked up a corona receiver that will find the channel my radio is on and I had no idea I could get a receiver so cheap with out any problems. To me I'm surprised that they wouldn't be more popular
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Old Aug 03, 2011, 06:07 PM
G_T
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This is a whole different subject that warrants a different thread, and has been covered many times before, but what the heck!

For DLG use, you really don't want micro receivers. Micro receivers are typically a major compromise on range and on selectivity. DLGs fly at considerable range at times, at least in the hands of expert pilots. They are also flown in situations where there are many transmitters and planes flying at the same time. They are also not cheap planes, unfortunately. For all these reasons, it makes sense to use full range receivers. These are typically quite a bit larger than micro receivers, but at least now days they are small enough.

For transmitters, there are several good ones and each has a following. Many swear by some particular model and swear at the others.

For disclaimer, I used to use Miltiples EVO on 72MHz, then JR 9303 on 72, then 9303 on 2.4GHz, and now Futaba 8FG on 2.4. I briefly owned an Airtronics SD-10G.

The JR 9303 was a very good radio for DLG use, on 72MHz. About a year after the 2.4 version became available, I picked one up and started converting over. New planes became 2.4, and old ones stayed on 72.

But then JR had two issues on 2.4. First being, their better receivers really needed the satellite receiver. So installation was about double the pain. Second, a little while back they produced a receiver that had problems. These problems cost a number of pilots their planes, and cost JR quite a bit of PR. That receiver was popular for DLGs. It has now been replaced by a newer version and the problems appear fixed.

In that time frame, I went on a search for a new radio. I didn't want to be a victim.

I picked up an Airtronics SD-10G which had just come out. Good radio, well made, but for me it was too bulky for DLG use. It is thick and slick. Various people have made various adaptations to the radio to do with the form factor and it is working well for them. I sold mine.

Airtronics also had a transmitter problem that showed up as shooting down other planes occasionally. All that has been cleared up, but Airtronics lost a little PR of their own in the process.

Futaba in recent years had been quite reliable (Except IMHO the 12MZ and 14MZ but don't take my opinion on that as gospel). So I went with Futaba for my personal choice. Their 8FG has an excellent form factor for DLG use IMHO, being slim and light. It may not look quite as nice as the flashy rigs but I'm not looking; I'm flying. It is also not cheap. Neither are the receivers. But a mid-range receiver would really be full range by the standards of most other manufacturers. And the setups don't seem to be picky with antenna placement, which is nice. The only changes I've made is to swap the left and right upper rear switches to put the spring loaded one on the left (I'm a rightie), and I removed the handle. Who needs a handle??? All the transmitters pack for travel better without handles. I've used two or three different receivers, in multiple planes. Rock solid, IMHO.

I had the HiTech Aurora in my hands and it seemed a quality unit. Stock antennas on the receivers are a good concept but bulky for DLG use, so one ends up changing the antenna. Perhaps they have receivers now without that style of antenna. Anyway not many flying this radio for DLG so no real track record.

The last is an important point. Go with something that has a very good track record for DLG use. Otherwise, you are the guinea pig. Too many have been burned that way recently.

DLGs have receivers crammed right next to servos, batteries, possibly regulators... Carbon close by, etc. Not the best arrangement. So you want to stick with stuff that has been tested out, and not just by people who fly by themselves. IMHO, that level of testing is near worthless. You want stuff that has been tested out rigorously in competition by people who count on it working 100% and are good enough to know the difference.

You can search the threads and you will find many opinions. I'd suggest reading through a bunch.

Gerald
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Last edited by G_T; Oct 29, 2011 at 09:23 PM.
Old Aug 03, 2011, 07:11 PM
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United States, CO, Broomfield
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Thank you for your help and im sorry I have been finding a hard place to ask this question. I can see how much of a hassle it can be for anyone to know how good the product really is for there use. I will be going to colorados blue sky's this week so hopefully I will get to ask around and see what people are using. The hard part is not buying top of the line just to get something you know works. I figure if I can get a good 6ch transmitter 2.4 for 120 or so used that works fine and some good receivers to work wit it for around 40 then im happy but i cant be forking out 100 dollars on a receiver for every glider i buy i just cant justify that so will see how fare I get might stick with a 72mhz for a while will see. Thank you for all your info I found it very interesting and good to know
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Old Aug 04, 2011, 04:26 PM
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Hi Gerald

I'd like to say that i am using the Hitec Aurora 9 for the last 1.5 year on several Dlg's (TopSky2, Steigeisen, and Super TS2 with full carbon fuselage)

The issue with the Optima's special antenna called Boda is not that of an issue to handle even in the thinnest Fuselage like the SalPeter Fuse.

In that period of time i have flown an average of twice a week, and during contests, which i have never found any issues of Reception and interference while arround me other Brands such as JR, Futaba had different issues etc.
I am not trying to say that on Hitec issues can't happened but for me i haven't noticed yet.

I know that Hitec is not a brand with much mileage in the high end TX, but IMO i love this TX and it's reliability and most of all getting the Battery status in my TX so that issue is out of my mind :-)

My 50 c

Gil
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Old Aug 05, 2011, 11:53 PM
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United States, CO, Broomfield
Joined Jul 2011
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thank you for your post I have been wondering about this model because I dont hear anything bad about it and it looked like a great way to go to me. I am going to look more into it, its affording what ever i get that is the major problem
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Old Aug 06, 2011, 11:37 PM
Is my CG correct?
discostu956's Avatar
Wollongong, Aus
Joined Sep 2009
5,096 Posts
Been dying to ask this for ages, and havn't found anything on it really yet....

What makes a radio good for DLG, in comparison to what is classed as just good radio?
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Old Aug 07, 2011, 12:34 PM
Landings are not optional
DeuceTrinal's Avatar
Van Nuys, CA
Joined Sep 2003
1,805 Posts
Lightweight/easy to grip, momentary switch on the proper side/place for launch preset, and enough mixing options to complete the programming of a full house DLG. Typically that means a radio with flight-phase capability, preferably with independent trims per phase.
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