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Old Jan 03, 2013, 10:43 PM
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AA and tsa are still in court over damages, 5-6 years later.
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Old Apr 05, 2013, 11:51 PM
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USA, CA, El Dorado Hills
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10S vs 12s

I have an Electra with a EVF 2 - 10S setup and works really well.

I recently picked up a EVF 2- 12S PNP fan that I was going to use for another project (Aeroloft T-2). I started thinking, I wonder if I should swap the 12s setup into the Electra.

My questions are:

1. Is it really going to make that big of a difference in either speed or flight duration?

2. Does the additional weight of the 2S booster packs matter when landing (vs. 10s)

3. Anyone know exactly which motors are in the 10S vs. 12s? I don't know this for certain, but I suspect the 12s uses the same motor as the 10s but a bigger ESC. If the took the KV down on the 12s, then it won't have any higher eFlux...right?
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Old Apr 06, 2013, 12:06 AM
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United States, CA, Livermore
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I don't have any experience with 10s but I have heard it runs well. That said I would put the higher performance fan in the higher performance airframe! You will probably notice the 12s power when going vertical, My 12s Stumax and a flying buddies 12s Viofan can both pitch vertical from slow flight and climb straight up so better than 1:1 thrust to weight ratio. This comes in handy extending the flight envelope during acrobatic flight. I fly 5:30 with 5500 mAh packs and of course the TP 6600 packs run 6 to 6:30. Dunno about 10s, what flight times are you getting? Check out the Neu 8200 (?) packs next time you buy if duration is important to you, those are big packs! Landing speeds are ridiculously low with 12s. I can only imagine how light your Electra is. Oh, I run a Castle Cap pack.
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Old Apr 06, 2013, 07:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sbritton View Post
I have an Electra with a EVF 2 - 10S setup and works really well.

I recently picked up a EVF 2- 12S PNP fan that I was going to use for another project (Aeroloft T-2). I started thinking, I wonder if I should swap the 12s setup into the Electra.

My questions are:

1. Is it really going to make that big of a difference in either speed or flight duration?

2. Does the additional weight of the 2S booster packs matter when landing (vs. 10s)

3. Anyone know exactly which motors are in the 10S vs. 12s? I don't know this for certain, but I suspect the 12s uses the same motor as the 10s but a bigger ESC. If the took the KV down on the 12s, then it won't have any higher eFlux...right?
I think the 10S system in the Electra is the sweet setup, not that the 12S isn't great too but watching BV himself fly around with a 10S setup en entire weekend, I asked myself why do I have 12S. If speed is what you demand than 12S is faster, the 10S system has been clocked about 185 but I would say the average top speed should be expected to be around 170 - 175 while the average top speed of the 12S system is 190 -195 (though capable and demonstrated many times easily exceeding 200+). Keep in mind when the first EVF's came out, the 10S and 12S systems both were powered by much earlier generation LiPo's that did not hold voltage near what today's can, so the 12S was really the system you needed based more on voltage sag of the batteries versus design.

To answer specifically;

1.) I don't think the difference is enough to see in general flying but you will notice it in speed and long up-lines without inertia going into the maneuver.

2.) Not at all, the Electra is a pussy cat with flaps down, 10S or 12S. I have seen Rob Lynch fly an Electra on heavy 7,700 packs, 12S, 14S and even 16S and even a high speed variation we did with clipped wings, that plane fly's and lands great, I doubt you would notice the additional weight at all going from 10S to 12S.

3.) It depends on which fans you are talking about. BVM has used several different motors in the EVF's over the years, always Neu but varying between models and kV. In most cases the motor is the same with a different kV but you can't say that as a hard rule as there have been special motors and winds over the years with BVM and Neu working close together to optimize the motors to the point I believe what BV has now (and for the last several years), is a custom wind/build though based entirely on a stock Neu model. My experience is to not swap out the motor on anything newer (last 3 years) because they are not stock, unlike the early EVF's where you can see the motor model and kV clearly to compare.

If you do go 12S, I would opt for the 3 x 4S configuration with the third pack between the intakes, this provides the most evenly balanced weight distribution and allows you to use packs that are all the same, in case you need to swap one out of have an issue, etc. The 2 x 5S plus 2S booster works perfectly fine too but over the long haul, I think having identical packs that you can freely swap out is easier to deal with...

Jack
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Old Apr 06, 2013, 07:56 AM
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I have flown my electra on 12s with the 2 5s tp packs and the 2s booster up top and also with the 3 4s packs and I have found that what jack said is correct, not having that 2s pack up top the airplane seems to land nicer. Also have flown an electra on 10s, really is an economically sweet setup with great performance. Good luck
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Old Apr 06, 2013, 09:35 AM
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Thanks guys....excellent info.

Both fans are the V2 version. I already had several sets of the 5S-6600-65c saddle packs, and picked up some 2S-6600-65c boosters to go with the new fan. So as much as I would like to switch to 4S packs; not really an options for me now.

I think I will keep the Electra on 10S, and use the 12s setup on the new plane. I get about 6 minutes and it lands better than anything else I have, so I might as well leave perfection alone.
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Old Apr 06, 2013, 09:56 AM
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Originally Posted by sbritton View Post
...so I might as well leave perfection alone.
Well said!

Jack
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Old Apr 06, 2013, 10:22 PM
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United States, CA, Los Alamitos
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Jack a question

Jack since I've seen a few of your models close up and a few of your fans. I wanted to know if you have a motor preference with the 12s setup 5612 series. I want to use a older EVF. But I want to put a new motor was thinking about the 1527 3D motor 770 KV. What are your thoughts. I know you've done some serious testing. Your advice would be appreciated.

Thanks,
Jeff
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Old Apr 07, 2013, 12:04 AM
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United States, CA, Berkeley
Joined Apr 2005
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sbritton View Post
I have an Electra with a EVF 2 - 10S setup and works really well.

I recently picked up a EVF 2- 12S PNP fan that I was going to use for another project (Aeroloft T-2). I started thinking, I wonder if I should swap the 12s setup into the Electra.

My questions are:

1. Is it really going to make that big of a difference in either speed or flight duration?

2. Does the additional weight of the 2S booster packs matter when landing (vs. 10s)

3. Anyone know exactly which motors are in the 10S vs. 12s? I don't know this for certain, but I suspect the 12s uses the same motor as the 10s but a bigger ESC. If the took the KV down on the 12s, then it won't have any higher eFlux...right?
Shawn,

Everything said here is true. 12s is pure power, but 10s is not a dog. I was actually very surprised when I flew BVīs electra (built up) on 10s. And for some reason, flight duration is similar.

I did not feel the weight difference on the landing though. but again, different airplanes.

Now, being so easy to swap, why don't you just try it? It wont take you more than 30 minutes to swap the fans, so why not? I would give it a shot and see for yourself. It is part of the fun, right?

and regarding the batteries, I know you already have some, but one thing i really like about the 3x4 set up is the ability to paralell charge. With a powerlab 8 running on 24 volts, I charge in 20 minutes. What I do is to charge at 2C (that is the max you can get) and stop charging as soon as it hits 99%. That last bit of charging takes way to long.

Let us know your thoughts
Jack
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Old Apr 07, 2013, 10:58 AM
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Miramar, Florida
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jefffassbinder View Post
Jack since I've seen a few of your models close up and a few of your fans. I wanted to know if you have a motor preference with the 12s setup 5612 series. I want to use a older EVF. But I want to put a new motor was thinking about the 1527 3D motor 770 KV. What are your thoughts. I know you've done some serious testing. Your advice would be appreciated.

Thanks,
Jeff
Jeff,

The early 5612's had the Neu 1524/2Y (690kV) and some later builds used the 1527/1.5Y (825 kV), which I think was also the first EVF~2 motor in early builds, the motor you are looking at with 770kV should be right where you need it and of course the 1527 can is longer and able to soak up more power, I think it's a great choice. BVM no longer uses the 152x series but I still find them to be great motors. I've used quite a few different variations, even tried the 1527/2Y (690kV) which was used in the 6215, which wasn't really made available too long but ran great. Everyone is going with more mass (larger cans) now it seems...

Jack
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Old Aug 11, 2013, 10:14 PM
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Miramar, Florida
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Oh yeah, I got my baby back! Some may not know but I had to sell this totally sweet Electra a little more than a year ago but I really hated to do it. I found out the guy who bought it flew it maybe once in the last year and since I had the means to buy it back from him, jumped on it. If you never flew an Electra, I highly recommend you get one and do so! Today I flew the new Thunder Power G8 70C 7,700 mAh packs (they only weight 8.25 ounces more than the 6,600 mAh setup) and had an 8 minute flight, sweet! This plane is per-fec-tion ;-)

Jack
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Old Aug 11, 2013, 10:41 PM
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That's awesome jack! great looking plane
I'd like to get one someday.....

nice flight time!
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Old Aug 12, 2013, 08:03 AM
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United States, GA, Columbus
Joined Jan 2006
485 Posts
Very nice Electra-glad you have it back! I don't get to fly mine nearly often enough. Still running 6600 packs-would love to try the new 70C 7700s.
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Old Aug 12, 2013, 08:29 AM
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United States, TX, Kingsland
Joined Sep 2005
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Way to go, Jack!!!! Glad you got your baby back. I love that plane. We've missed you at SEFF. Hope you can make the trip in 2014.
McD
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Old Aug 12, 2013, 08:35 AM
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That Electra sure looks familiar!
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