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Old Feb 02, 2013, 10:43 PM
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United States, NY, New York
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Originally Posted by H2SO4 View Post
Just my personal opinion of course - prop spinners are entirely useless for 3D planes. Their only positive effect is cosmetic, and even that is debatable, but they block airflow and make it that much more difficult to balance the prop.
Especially true for the Bandit. After having the spinner fly off after 20 flights (see similar stories earlier in the thread) I just decided to do without one. Part of the issue is that the way PA mounts the CF spinner to the metal backplate, it is very hard to get it centered perfectly. (The holes for the screws allow too much wiggle.) It take a lot of trial-and-error to get it on, and even then it is often not balanced. I say don't bother, unless you find a better spinner than the one PA is selling.
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Old Feb 03, 2013, 09:32 AM
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United States, GA, Pooler
Joined Nov 2008
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Originally Posted by bmschulman View Post
Especially true for the Bandit. After having the spinner fly off after 20 flights (see similar stories earlier in the thread) I just decided to do without one. Part of the issue is that the way PA mounts the CF spinner to the metal backplate, it is very hard to get it centered perfectly. (The holes for the screws allow too much wiggle.) It take a lot of trial-and-error to get it on, and even then it is often not balanced. I say don't bother, unless you find a better spinner than the one PA is selling.
I haven't had any issues with mine yet, but I'm expecting to. While it makes the Bandit look good, they need a new design that is more full-proof. It's sad when even the PA team pilots have the issue (one person going through 3 spinners) and nothing is done.
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Old Feb 03, 2013, 11:44 AM
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Originally Posted by pilot_keeter View Post
It is helpful to have the backplate when position the cowl but not 100% needed to get it right. Eye-balling from the front/using a ruler to measure will do just fine.
Thats also why i thought there was some kinda plastic spinner included.
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Old Feb 03, 2013, 03:53 PM
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I've tried two PA spinners as well, absolutley useless spinner, I'll never waste my money on a PA branded accessory again. Between rubbish spinners and prop/motor adaptors (i've tried two of those aswell) that can't clamp on the shaft correctly if you fit a spinner without modifying it.

My Bandit flys nice, and I still consider the idea of picking up an Addiction X but I don't think I could bring myself to do it. The quality is just not there, between bad accessories, cheap rubbish covering, and structure that has been excessively lightened in areas where it shouldn't have been and bits of CF in locations where it is achieving no added strength yet it is left out of areas where it could actually give large gains in strength.

As for a spinner that is actually well priced and spins pretty true whilst also being light, take a look at the EF spinners, they don't have the exact size but 2.25" vs. 2.17" you'll barely notice.
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Old Feb 03, 2013, 04:47 PM
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USA, CA, Healdsburg
Joined Dec 2007
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2nd impressions

I flew the Bandit today and while it's a nice flyer, lands easy, is very responsive, it is very pitch sensitive. Started moving the CG between flights and haven't yet found the sweet spot. Lots of EL coupling when I KE, but it's only slightly nose heavy when I do dive and inverted tests to validate the settings. I've maxed the resolution on my DX8/AR7100 by setting the travel adjusts to 100% and played with a lot and a little expo.

I do think the Voltec servos contribute to the pitch sensitivity. I'm going to look for a high res digital servo and put it on the tail. I've played with expo a bit. I'll give it a go again next week with a new servo.

Paul
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Old Feb 03, 2013, 06:44 PM
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Australia, QLD, Ipswich
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Originally Posted by gtoguy View Post
I flew the Bandit today and while it's a nice flyer, lands easy, is very responsive, it is very pitch sensitive. Started moving the CG between flights and haven't yet found the sweet spot. Lots of EL coupling when I KE, but it's only slightly nose heavy when I do dive and inverted tests to validate the settings. I've maxed the resolution on my DX8/AR7100 by setting the travel adjusts to 100% and played with a lot and a little expo.

I do think the Voltec servos contribute to the pitch sensitivity. I'm going to look for a high res digital servo and put it on the tail. I've played with expo a bit. I'll give it a go again next week with a new servo.

Paul
I fitted Hyperion DS13 servos in mine and went out to about 120% end points and High rate, but that ended up in the servos binding at full throw so using the programmer for the Hyperions I limited the end point on them. This still gives you full resolution unlike when you limit your end points in your TX.

These steps made quite a noticable improvement in pitch sensitivity, but it is still a very pitch sensitive airframe.
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Old Feb 03, 2013, 11:14 PM
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Looks like an HS-5065MG will fit, a little less torque, any other recommendations?
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Old Feb 04, 2013, 08:49 AM
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Sydney Australia
Joined Jun 2004
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Originally Posted by pilot_keeter View Post
I haven't had any issues with mine yet, but I'm expecting to. While it makes the Bandit look good, they need a new design that is more full-proof. It's sad when even the PA team pilots have the issue (one person going through 3 spinners) and nothing is done.


There is a certain method of how to mount the spinner properly. follow it and you'll be find. i use the CF spinners on all of my planes, no problems at all. Just push the cone firmly in while fastening the mounting bolts. as long as the cone sit flush it won't wobble. Sometimes the mounting drills needs to be filed a bit to allow the bolts to fit well but that takes seconds to do with a needle file.
I re-designed the prop adapter used on the Bandit and KMX to be longer in order to have a better grip while the front of the collet to be a tad shorter.

Shaun
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Old Feb 04, 2013, 10:33 PM
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I purchased a pair of HS-5065MGs and will try on the rudder and the elevator next weekend. Let you guys know if the repeatability of a digital servo (hopefully improving centering) will help with my pitch sensitivity problem. Hard to say if the resolution is actually improved over the Voltecs.
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Old Feb 05, 2013, 01:03 AM
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H2SO4's Avatar
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Why is pitch sensitivity a problem? I rather like the fact that the Bandit can do loop-de-loops in its own length

If you'd rather tone that down, more expo or lower rates are the way to go.
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Old Feb 05, 2013, 01:49 AM
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Originally Posted by H2SO4 View Post
Why is pitch sensitivity a problem? I rather like the fact that the Bandit can do loop-de-loops in its own length

If you'd rather tone that down, more expo or lower rates are the way to go.
There is a difference between sensitivity and authority.
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Old Feb 05, 2013, 02:16 AM
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Originally Posted by luke352 View Post
There is a difference between sensitivity and authority.
What's the difference? I'm not being a smart alec - I just want to understand.

Thinking out loud, perhaps a hypothetical airframe could be said to lack directional stability, which would mean that frequent input from the pilot is required to keep it pointing in any given direction, maybe because its tail surfaces are comparatively small.

Personally, I don't detect any such tendencies with the Bandit. It doesn't appear to want to pitch up or down on its own, meaning its directionally stable in that plane. But if I do crank the elevator input, it can respond very strongly, if that's the current rates+expo setup. That's what I'd assume is meant by "pitch sensitivity" - the aircraft is sensitive to pitch input from the pilot.

Or is there a better definition for "pitch sensitivity"?
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Old Feb 05, 2013, 04:33 AM
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Originally Posted by H2SO4 View Post
What's the difference? I'm not being a smart alec - I just want to understand.

Thinking out loud, perhaps a hypothetical airframe could be said to lack directional stability, which would mean that frequent input from the pilot is required to keep it pointing in any given direction, maybe because its tail surfaces are comparatively small.

Personally, I don't detect any such tendencies with the Bandit. It doesn't appear to want to pitch up or down on its own, meaning its directionally stable in that plane. But if I do crank the elevator input, it can respond very strongly, if that's the current rates+expo setup. That's what I'd assume is meant by "pitch sensitivity" - the aircraft is sensitive to pitch input from the pilot.

Or is there a better definition for "pitch sensitivity"?
I would describe the Bandit as being very difficult to get on a line and then if you need to make a small adjustment even on low rates it needs a very soft touch to make a small adjustment without over correcting. Once you have it on that line it will hold it well it's just getting it there can be a real bear. So sensitive. Yes it still has good authority, i.e. when you yank on it you have plenty of response.

Whereas pitch authority means it still has excellent response when you yank on it and that ability to flip in it's own length yet isn't such a pain to get on line and is still smooth around centre and you don't find yourself over-correcting when trying to get on just the right line.
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Old Feb 05, 2013, 05:17 AM
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Luke, if you're finding your Bandit very pitch sensitive try moving your CG forward in small increments. Your Bandit sounds like it is on the tail heavy side.

dG
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Old Feb 05, 2013, 07:53 AM
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Would HS-65mg's not be suitable all around on the Bandit? I was thinking of making a switch. Maybe 65mgs on the ailerons and 5065s on the tail??
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