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Old Jun 24, 2011, 07:07 PM
BahamaHeli
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The Bahamas
Joined Dec 2010
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Just ran a test with a 2200mah battery and found that the tail right wag was caused by a power drop. The same issue i was haveing with the rtf system before. I have not changed the leads on this convertor yet, so i'll do that after my gig, and run some more tests tomorrow. I'm now able to hover in my bedroom, with enough control to do small tail turns. With the bigger battery the power drop wags were few and far inbetween. And the start ups with the rtf main motor still suck.
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Old Jun 25, 2011, 12:08 AM
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United States, CA, Rancho Cordova
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpadCat2000 View Post
The 45C will allow the motor to run at higher R's which in the case of brushed motors will make them wear the brushes out faster due to friction and heat. You can control the power with the throttle, so unless you are pushing the limits of the motor all the time, I cannot see that happening. These motors should be broken in and there is a procedure, but cannot remember what it is. Saw a post about that topic not too long ago and if I run across it, I will post it. When done properly, it will make a brushed motor run cooler, with more power and last longer.

Can you just go back to using the 25C and see how long one lasts? I got 25 flights (10-15 min ea) before my stock motor failed, then I replaced it with BL.

SpadCat
Hi V400d 02 guys, I got mine put back together a few days ago. It worked great till the motor toasted. I put a new main shaft, gear and feathering shaft. Thanks for the info on the feathering shaft,the Trex 450pro works perfect. I had another motor and installed it. It seems that the motor it came with lasted a long time compared to the ones I've put in. I think this is the fourth motor. In the past I had it set up where the motor only gets warm but now it gets so hot you can't touch it. I thought that by running the head speed up without to much pitch would let the motor run cooler? Anyway, that would be interesting to know the break in procedure because I've never done it.

Also, after I replaced the motor it got some kind of intermittent vibration. It has all new parts and flew smooth after installing them. When I first take off its fine, but after it warms up it acts like the gyros or servos are twitching.

I got my nose in hover down. I practiced on the sim, 4#6 and V370D. Then I took the V400 to the flying field and was easily able to nose in. Not ready to try with the blueray yet. Trying to practice more slow speed circles and turns using rudder only. This is a great heli for that. I'm getting better at my inside figue 8s but need more practice to be smooth.
-Craig
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Old Jun 25, 2011, 12:26 AM
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United States, AZ, Lake Havasu City
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Installed the new BL system today (very easy) and with the blades off, did a test run (I had already bench tested the system) and running it up to full power I heard two very loud sharp POPS and promptly shut down and disconnected the battery. Looked everything over and nothing looked or smelled bad, so tried again and no further pops. Held it at 1/2 power for a little bit and then went on up to full power. Worked fine, except the gear whine was very loud. Powered down and checked gear lash, and it was fine, so powered up again, and could not believe how loud the gear whine was. It was nearly intolerable and thought something had to be wrong. All of a sudden it dawned on me that I forgot to order the new pinion and I was running the one that came with the motor. What an idiot!! Took a close look at the main gear, and surprisingly, it looked in good shape. I expected all the teeth to be shaved off!

So, now what were the mystery POPS? I took the motor off and in the process, three pieces of a small green tyrap drop out of the area near the motor and it was clearly broken, not cut. Can't quite figure out what happened except that something (the motor) put a heck of a lot of pressure to make even a small tyrap break in two places. At least I now know where the POPs came from even if I can't figure out how it happened. The tyrap had been in use, not just a loose unconnected one.

SpadCat
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Old Jun 25, 2011, 12:38 AM
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Have you balanced your blades? Even a slight variation can cause a vibration.

Sounds good that you are mastering nose-in hovering. I have practicing that and have around 6 or 7 flights. Problem is, I am doing this in my backyard, and so have to do any maneuvers in slow motion, otherwise, one mistake and I slam into a wall, in which I have done. I figure that once I get out in the open (hopefully tomorrow morning) that it will be a lot easier. I have done full nose in circles, very slow pirouettes, and a couple of figure 8s. I am becoming a master of spinning it around quickly if I get into trouble.

Lots of Fun.

SpadCat
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Old Jun 25, 2011, 12:46 AM
BahamaHeli
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The Bahamas
Joined Dec 2010
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hey spad,

i had the same thing happen when i was bench testing mine. Two gun shots, no smoke or damage. How ever I did not see any green tyrap. After the first pop, the sticker on the motor came off, so I thought it was that. Started up again, took it up to full throttle, and pop again. I adjusted the throttle curve in my tx to 90%, thinking that the esc was pushing more power than the motor can handel. (its only 23A max burst, and I had a 40A esc pushing 100%) I dont know if that solved the poping or not, I've never had to use 100% throttle anyway.
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Old Jun 25, 2011, 12:50 AM
BahamaHeli
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The Bahamas
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Barn,

Try turning the gains down on your rx (alie and elev sens). Also, when doing so, you may think your turning it down, when your really turning it up. My #3 had me stumped one day at the field, until I started turning the gain pots the other way. I guess in walkera world, + means less and - means more, sometimes.
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Old Jun 25, 2011, 09:27 AM
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Hi Kdean, My blades did need to be balanced a little. I think your right because I recently turned the ALE and ELEV up to 80%. Looking at the heli head on they're at 3:00.
-Craig
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Old Jun 25, 2011, 09:31 AM
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United States, AZ, Lake Havasu City
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Well, I guess my tyrap theory is wrong. Couldn't imagine why the electronics would do it, but hopefully it does not happen again. Maybe Wasp could shed some light on it.

SpadCat
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Old Jun 25, 2011, 09:48 AM
They call me plan B
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United States, GA, Covington
Joined Mar 2011
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I believe you are suppose to put a AA battery to the motor for a few minutes for break in . Your motor should last longer after this.





Quote:
Originally Posted by barnstorm100 View Post
Hi V400d 02 guys, I got mine put back together a few days ago. It worked great till the motor toasted. I put a new main shaft, gear and feathering shaft. Thanks for the info on the feathering shaft,the Trex 450pro works perfect. I had another motor and installed it. It seems that the motor it came with lasted a long time compared to the ones I've put in. I think this is the fourth motor. In the past I had it set up where the motor only gets warm but now it gets so hot you can't touch it. I thought that by running the head speed up without to much pitch would let the motor run cooler? Anyway, that would be interesting to know the break in procedure because I've never done it.

Also, after I replaced the motor it got some kind of intermittent vibration. It has all new parts and flew smooth after installing them. When I first take off its fine, but after it warms up it acts like the gyros or servos are twitching.

I got my nose in hover down. I practiced on the sim, 4#6 and V370D. Then I took the V400 to the flying field and was easily able to nose in. Not ready to try with the blueray yet. Trying to practice more slow speed circles and turns using rudder only. This is a great heli for that. I'm getting better at my inside figue 8s but need more practice to be smooth.
-Craig
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Old Jun 25, 2011, 01:16 PM
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Canada, ON, Ottawa
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Originally Posted by kdean View Post
Did more testing today. The tail control is getting better. But still wags after left rudder input. The tail blade is getting smaller and smaller. Its now down to 4" and about as slim as i want to make it. It still has +10 degrees pitch, and the only way to get less pitch would be to make it slimmer. So, i'll take another inch off of the length and see if it gets better.
It looks a 1000KV tail motor is about right since you have taken that much of the tail blade surface away.
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Old Jun 25, 2011, 01:37 PM
BahamaHeli
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The Bahamas
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Originally Posted by Wasp09 View Post
It looks a 1000KV tail motor is about right since you have taken that much of the tail blade surface away.
Its very hard to find a motor with the right specs. Around 1000kv, 2mm shaft, works with 3c, 12mm diam (inrunner). The only motor I found with specs close to this is still rated at 3200kv. And cost $50. Which may work if you use the stock gear set-up.

I like the idea of using a smaller, and stronger rotor on the tail. I have three different options on the way. All are 4" in lenght, two have 4 degrees of pitch but one is made of nylon and the other made from a stronger composit material. and the other option is nylon with 2.5 degrees of pitch. The nylon props come in a pack of 6 for about $4, and the stronger ones are only $1.50 each.

The pitch on the stock rotor is +10 degrees even after I shaved it down, so these lower pitch props should allow the motor to spin at a confortable rpm.
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Old Jun 25, 2011, 10:14 PM
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United States, GA, Acworth
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got mine flying again tonight turns out the one servo had no ability to reduce its throw so it was throwing things off.
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Old Jun 26, 2011, 08:09 AM
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Canada, ON, Ottawa
Joined Jun 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kdean View Post
Its very hard to find a motor with the right specs. Around 1000kv, 2mm shaft, works with 3c, 12mm diam (inrunner). The only motor I found with specs close to this is still rated at 3200kv. And cost $50. Which may work if you use the stock gear set-up.

I like the idea of using a smaller, and stronger rotor on the tail. I have three different options on the way. All are 4" in lenght, two have 4 degrees of pitch but one is made of nylon and the other made from a stronger composit material. and the other option is nylon with 2.5 degrees of pitch. The nylon props come in a pack of 6 for about $4, and the stronger ones are only $1.50 each.

The pitch on the stock rotor is +10 degrees even after I shaved it down, so these lower pitch props should allow the motor to spin at a confortable rpm.
I think there are a lot of cheap motors of lower KV on the plane side as we seldom use gears on planes, e.g.

http://www.lowpricerc.com/index.php?cPath=7

The mouting is different though, usually at the back of motor. The props for planes usually comes with adaptors. Hence the shaft diameter does not really matter.

We know once a BL motor stops, it takes time to restart. We have to shift the normal operating point well away from the stop point to prevent the motor from stopping completely on yewing left. That could be the other issue of using a high KV motor besides the gain.
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Old Jun 26, 2011, 01:06 PM
BahamaHeli
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The Bahamas
Joined Dec 2010
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I really like the look of the inrunner, though the turnigy out runner that gege has been using does not look that bad.

I've changed the programing on the esc for the tail for normal start, and have the rudder travel adjust in the tx set at 30%, so the motor does not stop. Although it does make left rudder a bit sluggish. I'm gunna take it out to the field today and play with the settings more.
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Old Jun 26, 2011, 02:14 PM
BahamaHeli
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The Bahamas
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Winds are up to 12mph+, not ideal for initial testing. So, i'll hold off on takeing #3, and take #1 and my T-XI V450. The V450 had some rudder set-up issues, i set the rod lenght to short and the gyro had a hard time trying to find center. Kind of the same problem im having with my brushless tail mod.

BTW, I did shoot some video of #1 w/alpha 400, but some kids came to the park, and i spent most of the time yelling at them to stay away from the heli. Why do kidz and people in general think that its safe to just stand next to something with high speed, exposed, spinning blades???
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