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Old Dec 02, 2012, 06:54 PM
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With ample paint and three servos, my last rMM is 863gm ... but my keel is 400gm.

Credit 350mAh LiPo and yes, nice servos for the advantage, but I'd rather have the 20gm in the bulb than the paint.

With this boat, I won't have any spray-on weight to add.

I'm hoping to add navigation lights and some graphics to my carbon edition - weight of the hatch, minus rubber seal is 20gm for this version.

I'd rather add fun (like night-sailing ability) rather than ballast so I'm looking for every gram I can find.

Any advice on 7.4v sub 20gm servos? I don't want to live without jib trim!
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Old Dec 02, 2012, 08:18 PM
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Originally Posted by northernmike View Post
With ample paint and three servos, my last rMM is 863gm ... but my keel is 400gm.

Credit 350mAh LiPo and yes, nice servos for the advantage, but I'd rather have the 20gm in the bulb than the paint.

With this boat, I won't have any spray-on weight to add.

I'm hoping to add navigation lights and some graphics to my carbon edition - weight of the hatch, minus rubber seal is 20gm for this version.

I'd rather add fun (like night-sailing ability) rather than ballast so I'm looking for every gram I can find.

Any advice on 7.4v sub 20gm servos? I don't want to live without jib trim!
Mike

As you know MMi Racing is 860g Min wiith 2 Servo control.

Jib Twitch turned off but carry 3rd Servo is OK as ballast.

Have you ever tried Sailing at Night with small LED lights.. Barely worth the effort. Very Difficult & really can become frustrating if at distance.. Been There Done That...

Carbon Look MM, Good Luck on losing weight...

http://www.aus.magicmicro.org/p/foru...pic.php?2662.0

If you are serious on a Race Boat down to Minimum Weight, I suggest some of the UK Champ Edition Ideas.. Lots of weight saving on the Internal Supports & Add to Keel..

Most, if not all of the Internal Supports are non-structural & can be left out. Small reinforcements only & that gets rid of 20g-30g..

Suggest Buy a Hull Kit & make some servo mounts (or UK have some special). That way you build to your own Spec & not playing catch-up on a boat already built that might not allow weight loss ideas...


Or maybe drop the 3rd Servo & Change out to a Heavier Keel... Simply revert after Racing & you have best of both worlds...

Cheers

John
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Old Dec 04, 2012, 11:30 AM
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Looking over your spreadsheets again, John, I see what you mean.

I can't help but wonder if the MMi rulemakers might be petitioned into allowing weight-reduction measures on carbon-look models to allow them to be competitive...
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Old Dec 04, 2012, 03:52 PM
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its a myth that the carbon boats arent competetive ! i bought a carbon edition this may and hve been using it once or twice a week at our local group , which includes one of the competetors who was racing at this years euro cup , my boat is often near the front of the pack !
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Old Dec 04, 2012, 04:53 PM
Boomer1
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I am not sure of the weight difference between the CF version and the standard, but it must not be much. My experiences have been similar to Jon's.

Pretty much it is the skipper that makes the difference. I have both boats and seem to fair about the same with either boat. Sometimes a little extra weight can be a good thing.

Boomer
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Old Dec 04, 2012, 07:49 PM
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I am not sure of the weight difference between the CF version and the standard, but it must not be much. My experiences have been similar to Jon's.

Pretty much it is the skipper that makes the difference. I have both boats and seem to fair about the same with either boat. Sometimes a little extra weight can be a good thing.

Boomer
Boomer

Side by Side the Carbon Look vs MMr is about 100 grams heavier in pure Kit Build (as per instructions).

Selection of Electronics & Battery Power is perhaps the easiet way of reducing weight on the CL MM..

In very light conditions it is quite noticably slower to get up to speed & needs far more attention.

Over a Longish Course the sailing Skills will reduce the Disadvantage of the Weight for the better sailors & improves the skills of those that concentrate harder on keeping up.

As the wind comes up the CL weight difference isn't such a disadvantage as it can carry the speed for longer.

If I was to build another one, I would do away with ALL the Internal supports, I would use ABS Off-cuts a small reinforcing where needed... The wood internal supports are not needed as the Hull is a lot thicker. That saves quite a bit of weight.

I really like the finish of the Hull & would love to see one with Thinner ABS or the option of buying just a Hull Kit similar to what we can get with the rMM.

Knowing what I know now I would build a lot different.


Cheers

John
AUS 137
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Old Dec 05, 2012, 01:08 PM
Boomer1
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John
I used Carbon Fiber internals on mine - I got them as a kit - they were very poorly cut and required me to rework them so they'd fit properly. Not sure how much weight they might have saved? Posted the only pictures I could find.
Sorry about the quality of the picture
Boomer
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Old Dec 05, 2012, 05:19 PM
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Here's the progress so far on my Carbon. Will start a build thread, I suppose.

Thanks to Myra Davidson for the blue Icarex!
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Old Dec 06, 2012, 01:29 AM
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John
I used Carbon Fiber internals on mine - I got them as a kit - they were very poorly cut and required me to rework them so they'd fit properly. Not sure how much weight they might have saved? Posted the only pictures I could find.
Sorry about the quality of the picture
Boomer
Boomer

I got some of the same style Carbon replacemnt parts & was bitterly disappointed.. Too much re-working to make fit & in the end I found them not up to scratch.

The Main Bulhead support which is there for the Main Sheet Guide and Rudder Servo Mount can be done away with.. I found by making your own rudder servo tray & extending the Tongue about 50% longer I could glue direct to the underside of the cockpit area. Plenty strong enough.

Rear Transom only needed as a filler & abs offcut would do just as well.

Cheers
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Old Dec 06, 2012, 02:17 AM
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Mid Week MM Sailors Port Kennedy WA (OZ)

The Final Day for the Year for the Mid Week sailors was held earlier today with 6 brave soles turning up at the Lake to Battle for the Final Points available & bragging Rights for the next two days. After that all is forgotten..

Since August we have been running a variety of Sail Days with Combined Scratch & Handicap days to settle on a format that we will use for next year.

Finally it looks like a Mix of 5 Scratch Races followed by 5 Handicap Races...

Today is a good example of how Even the Format has become. Bob started out with a Flyer, 2 wins straight off the Bat & was almost untouchable in his NEW purpose Built MM, 3 @ 1st's & 2 @ 2nd's out of 5 Races... From there his accumulated 80 Second Handicap bit hard & the best he could do was a 2nd in the last race.

With 2 distinct Race Formats we decided on 1 Discard for Scratch Races & 1 Discard for Handicap.. Which meant Bob had very little to smile about with only 7 coming off his Total Score..

Bill & Jack were battling it out for the minor places & Brian was holding back for the Handicap Series.. When it came Brian started to make inroads into Bill's overall total for the day, only to be outdone by bill in the 9th Race of the Day..

Jack was always thereabouts finishing top 3 quite regular.

After the Final Race with Discards checked & totals agreed we ended up with a 3 way Tie for 1st Place on the Day.. Bob with his Lightning start (3 wins) managed to Hold Off Bill with 2 wins followed by Jack on 1 win.

Points Champion which was what we were playing for since August came down to a tight tussle at the top.

After 6 Sail Days with the Best 3 counting towards the Championship we came down to Bill on 95 Points closely Followed by Brian on 94 Points. Bob's effort today lifted him from the pack into 3rd Place on 90 Points.

5 Points covered the first Three Placegetters.

Bill G. 95 Points
Brian E. 94 Points
Bob W. 90 Points

A Small Trophy & a $20 Hardware Gift Voucher was awarded to Bill for his Best 3 result.

Engraved; MICRO MAGIC Great Fun Standing Up.....

The Overall Points Scorer was even closer with Bill & Brian equal on 163 Points.

On count back Brian won the Day with a Highest Score of 35 Points for 1st November.

Small Engraved Medallions were awarded to the Top Three for their efforts over the Last 4 Months of Competition.

Best Wishes for the Coming Festivities to All Micro Magic Sailors out there & we hope to be back racing after the Christmas New Year Break...

Maybe the Occasional Social Sail day in the meantime.


Cheers

John
AUS 137
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Old Dec 15, 2012, 06:43 PM
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WANTED- MM racing kit

Does anyone know where (in USA) I can get a MMr kit, other than the Florida Graupner distributor?

Thanks for looking!

Sammy
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Old Dec 15, 2012, 06:50 PM
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v-eastonline

http://www.v-eastonline.com/products...-Racing--.html

MM kits

Baron Bremer
MM-81
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Old Dec 16, 2012, 07:14 PM
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Sail makin'
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Old Dec 16, 2012, 08:12 PM
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Mike

Nice Job..

Now for some practice in Panelled Sails...

One problem I have seen with the Icarex Material is any material used to reinforce the corners has a big effect on how the sails set. Especially the Luff & Foot of the Jib.

The Kit style square piece in my opinion is a big No No.. From experimenting with various sails I have found that a minimal amount of reinforcing is required.. Just enough for a small eyelet/hole to secure the sail to the booms..
Short thin piece along the Luff & short along the Foot.. Same for the Main..

Attached are a few examples where the square is replace by this idea.

The Foot & Overall Shape of the Jib are greatly improved.

Cheers

John
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Old Dec 19, 2012, 04:51 PM
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Thank you John!

That first suit was just to see what could be done, to get the feel of the materials.

This is just the very, very beginning!

I was able to iron out my wrinkled Icarex for another suit of blue ones, but my attention has been diverted -

Mom used to be a Librarian, and has a STACK of Mylar book jackets - all with a nice crease on one edge - perfect for super-light sails.

Panelling will be another adventure, my first attempts will be flat.

Any favoured sources for information on sail engineering? Or favourite brands as best examples?

Regarding the corners, FAST sails from Okanagan, BC (Canada) made some interesting ones I've seen on Victorias, using very thin pinstripes to hold a tiny split-ring... might give it a try.
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