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Old Feb 23, 2011, 06:50 AM
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Old Feb 23, 2011, 10:51 AM
Boomer1
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JP
I like the idea of water testing prior to bonding the deck to the hull. I also like the waterproof switch, and already have one, so I am good to go on that.

Are large rubber bands the method used to hold the two pieces (deck and hull )together? Or is there a better method or tool for this?

Since starting this thread, I have been archiving information and photos in preparation for my build, and captured the photo below. Do you see anything that might be missing, that would be of value to have on hand prior to getting started?

Regarding the wood reinforcements, (to install or not ) I have not had one of these boats before, and don't have sense of the wall thickness of the hull and deck to understand the boats overall strength. I know that once it is bonded all together it gains strength as a completed assembly.

I have sailed a V-32 and was always concerned that if I handled the boat incorrectly, it would crack. I felt the hull should have been a bit thicker or made out of ABS, rather than the polystyrene Victor Products uses. ABS has much better strength characteristics that polystyrene. It is also more costly than polystyrene, which may have been their deciding factor? Perhaps weight was a consideration, not sure. Neither material likes UV (sunlight) and can be made to last longer, if they are painted. The UV causes them over time to become brittle.



String,
Thanks for the photos. Nice clean work!

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Old Feb 23, 2011, 12:10 PM
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Old Feb 23, 2011, 01:01 PM
Boomer1
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JP
That percentage wise, is quite a difference in wall thickness!

What does "HIPS" mean? I don't recognize this term. I know what hips are anatomically speaking, but not in this context.

Great tips for sure. The photo of the tools was found on a link a fellow member provided on assembly tips, so I saved it as a good starting point.

I typically will layout the tools I will need for a project prior to actually starting. Saves a lot trips to the hardware store.

I have several levels and other items to insure proper alignment, and from past projects was aware of the importance of this aspect of assembly. I will look forward learning your tips on sail changing.

Thank you
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Old Feb 23, 2011, 02:08 PM
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Old Feb 23, 2011, 02:34 PM
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Lots of pictures.

Here is a nice deck treatment.


For hundreds of pictures of different setups and boats from the German MM site. Galerie technik.

http://www.mm-sailing.de/mm-hp/galerie/technik/

Boomer1, all these will drive you nuts.

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Old Feb 23, 2011, 03:02 PM
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Here is a neat pdf on degree labels for setting main and jib booms and even mast angles.

http://www.mm-sailing.de/mm-hp/daten...nzeigen_V2.pdf
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Old Feb 23, 2011, 03:58 PM
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Just for fun ABS vs. HIPS

JP
Au contraire mon ami. Les deux sont similaires, mais différentes. Référence de l'explication ci-dessous.

For those not familar with French. The two are related, but different. Reference the explanation below.

ABS = Acrylonitrile butadiene styrene (ABS) (chemical formula (C8H8)x· (C4H6)y·(C3H3N)z). It is a copolymer made by polymerizing styrene and acrylonitrile in the presence of polybutadiene. The proportions can vary from 15 to 35% acrylonitrile, 5 to 30% butadiene and 40 to 60% styrene. The result is a long chain of polybutadiene criss-crossed with shorter chains of poly(styrene-co-acrylonitrile). The nitrile groups from neighboring chains, being polar, attract each other and bind the chains together, making ABS stronger than pure polystyrene. The styrene gives the plastic a shiny, impervious surface. The butadiene, a rubbery substance, provides resilience even at low temperatures.

High impact polystyrene = A copolymer of styrene and butadiene known for its good dimensional stability, impact strength, rigidity, and especially for its ease of processing. Amorphous material.


I spent about 30 years in the plastics industry, and on rare occasions, I can remember small tid-bits of information, or at least I remember where to find information.

Keep the good info coming! Thank you

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Old Feb 24, 2011, 06:30 AM
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Old Feb 24, 2011, 01:04 PM
Boomer1
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The UV tends cause many plastics to loose elasticity over time. I do not see boats made out of either material turning to dust at any point. With extended exposure to the direct sunlight, and even in some cases, indirect UV, these materials can become brittle, which in time, are more likely to result in a hull being cracked from a sharp impact, rather than it ever disintegrating.

Were we able to exposed two hulls having the same wall thickness, one of ABS the other of HIPS to the same UV conditions, due to the composition of ABS, it is more likely over time, to retain more of it's elasticity. (less brittle)

Because of wall thickness of the MM and V 32, either one could be cracked from a sharp impact without ever being exposed to sunlight. The easy fix for anyone that might be concerned, is to paint their boat, or just don't leave the boat in direct sunlight for extended periods of time.
I don't mean, it can't sit there all day, but if you stored it outside, you'd see the difference. Clear coat would help too.

I don't store my boats outside, so I am not concerned. I think if I had a choice between these two materials, I'd pick ABS. I like fiberglass even better.

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Old Feb 24, 2011, 04:00 PM
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Old Feb 24, 2011, 04:37 PM
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Ease of use may tend to vary on the type and size of the boat. I have some 30" to 40" power boats that have fiberglass hulls, and I have found them to be very user friendly. Modifications and repairs are very simple. ABS is very a popular material for model boats, and offers a number of benifits.

Pretty much, if you want a specific boat, you take what the builder offers. I have had boats made out of ABS, HIPS and fiberglass and have enjoyed them all.

My favorite RC yacht is my Tamiya Yamaha RTW, which has an ABS hull. The hull should have been a bit thicker in certain areas, as a result, it required adding a bulk head and some fiberglass to reinforce those places to prevent cracking the hull from the stresses the boat sees in heavy winds. With the reinforcements in place, all is now ship shape.

On boats the size of the MMs it is not a major factor. I am sitting here waiting for UPS to drop off my MMs so I can get started on the build.

As my Mom used to say, "a watch pot never boils". They'll be here soon enough.

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Old Feb 24, 2011, 07:34 PM
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Good news.
The first of two boxes arrived with the the two complete boat kits and extra parts. I am very pleased with my first inspection. Even with JPs insight on the difference in hull thickness between the white ABS hull, and the Carbon finished hull, I am surprised at how much more sturdy the black pieces feel.

Included with the kits are two Hi-tech HS-225 MG and two HS-82MG servos, two Sky Shark ll masts and two 21142 keels. So I am good to go in that department.

I am going to take inventory to confirm I have all the parts, and begin to set up my production area.

The second box has the boat stands, and is scheduled to arrive Friday. All the good stuff is here.

Let the games begin!!
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Old Feb 24, 2011, 08:53 PM
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Sounds good Boomer1. It's a good build and mine is coming along. May finish it this weekend.
jpparisy, thanks for the suggestions and the pictures but I will be building my carbon one pretty much stock except for the rudder pushrod. I really don't care about the weight thing since mine is just for fun sailing and only two others around right now (my markI and a friends markI). May do a bunch of mods NEXT time around. I only had some 3p skyshark rods and they are to big. Have some pultruded 6mm rods but they are pretty thick and not long enough since most rods come at a 32 inch length and don't want to mess with extending them and their kinda heavy.

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Old Feb 24, 2011, 09:25 PM
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Suggestions please

Guys,
I just did my first read of the instruction and have a question or two. On the Carbon boat, what is recommened to bond the rear sections of the deck to the hull. In the step by step instructions with photos, it shows you have to sand the access adhesive off to attain an attractive finish.

That works for the white hull, but what do you recommend for the carbon hull?

I don't have any black adhesive/glue I really don't want to damage the finish in those areas, by just sanding them down. I am guessing but, that would most likely sand off the carbon film.

Wonder what others have used to bond this hull together that doesn't mess up the hulls finish. After all, that's why we get this version.

Suggestions please. String how well does you carbon hull and deck fit in the back sections?

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