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Old Jan 23, 2011, 09:53 PM
AMA # 949551
rikybob's Avatar
USA, FL, Orlando
Joined Oct 2009
2,214 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by ASSAN View Post
ok, there have some reports about the GA-250's bounce.there have something need to talk openly.

First, why bounce happened in your heli? Amp give us some advice and a useful link. http://www.spartan-rc.com/resources/...&search=bounce . thanks,Amp. actually, you can got this basic knowloge in some gyros' maual papers too.

Second, if we conside simply, we can see the bounce arise is because your tail servo speed with load can't catch up your gyro's need.some guys maybe didn't agree and they will ask another question, why it's suit to 401 class gyro before and not worked in GA-250 now? the answer is simple, 401 class gyro not need such fast respond speed tail servo like GA-250's, and there have a "delay" swtich can ajust the answer speed too. GA-250 haven't such ajust setting.so, when you want use GA-250, you need a fast speed tail servo with enough tarque.

Third, why GA-250's work mode like this? that's because when we design GA-250, our target is Quark,GY520 etc. not on 401 class. we conside the pilots use it flying 3d more.for that application, the basic equipment is a fast tail servo. we forgot there have many pilots just want use GA 250 drive slow speed tail servo,because they need't want 3d flying anymore. that's our misunderstand and make a mistake.

Fourth,next step we do. our egnineers will try to impove the software to make GA-250 suit slow speed tail servos also.this one seems easy but the fact is it's too complex and no one do it before.we try.

best,

meng
What then is minimum specification for a tail servo to work?

B
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Old Jan 23, 2011, 10:12 PM
Registered User
Australia...we live inverted.
Joined May 2008
5,409 Posts
Hi Meng,
Can that be made as a setting?

...also perhaps a naming scheme that would not make either setting sound better than another....ie so newer flyers with lesser setups wouldn't choose "3D" mode thinking it would be better.


Something like
Delay A: for servos with marginal performance
Delay B: for servos well suited for the particular heli
Delay C: for servos capable of very high performance


Delay A: would be longer deceleration period, lower stop gain and larger delay

B: Would be "average" to suit most of the better "cheap" digital servos...so middle settings

C: Fast and crisp stop with very little delay suitable for high end servos and very well set up helis only.


Obviously the three latter descriptions would be not be in the manual so as to reduce the chance of someone selecting C in a setup not capable of C.


Two things to address for your gyro to be well received imo...
1) Gyro works well
2) Being these are sold very cheaply you will unfortunately get a higher percentage of newer flyers rather than say the Quark/520 as they are expensive and attract the more experienced. So the gyro has to be easily set up by a newer flyer.

Maybe a table of servos and what delay (A,B,C) and ball positions for more common helis may help too.

Amp

PS I hope they come of back order at HK soon. I missed the first run and want to try on on a Gaui 200. Can you let us know when they are likely to arrive so we can be knocking their door down!
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Old Jan 23, 2011, 10:22 PM
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CHINA
Joined Apr 2005
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ampdraw View Post
Hi Meng,
Can that be made as a setting?

...also perhaps a naming scheme that would not make either setting sound better than another....ie so newer flyers with lesser setups wouldn't choose "3D" mode thinking it would be better.


Something like
Delay A: for servos with marginal performance
Delay B: for servos well suited for the particular heli
Delay C: for servos capable of very high performance


Delay A: would be longer deceleration period, lower stop gain and larger delay

B: Would be "average" to suit most of the better "cheap" digital servos...so middle settings

C: Fast and crisp stop with very little delay suitable for high end servos and very well set up helis only.


Obviously the three latter descriptions would be not be in the manual so as to reduce the chance of someone selecting C in a setup not capable of C.


Two things to address for your gyro to be well received imo...
1) Gyro works well
2) Being these are sold very cheaply you will unfortunately get a higher percentage of newer flyers rather than say the Quark/520 as they are expensive and attract the more experienced. So the gyro has to be easily set up by a newer flyer.

Maybe a table of servos and what delay (A,B,C) and ball positions for more common helis may help too.

Amp

PS I hope they come of back order at HK soon. I missed the first run and want to try on on a Gaui 200. Can you let us know when they are likely to arrive so we can be knocking their door down!
Dear Amp,

thanks for your advise. we conside improve the working way.a.b.c is one good choice.i will talking with our engineers about this.

for next delieve time. we try shipping some before CNY,but we can't control everything,such as express agency will close soon for CNY too, maybe we have no way to ship the stock to HK at that time.

we will try our best

meng
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Old Jan 23, 2011, 10:35 PM
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CHINA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rikybob View Post
What then is minimum specification for a tail servo to work?

B
it's not easy to answer. the helis with different situations,and there have so much tail servos in the market.for example, at our 450 heli, GS D9257 with same speed as DS520, but the torque,D9257 stronger than DS520. so, we think D9257 is better than DS520 in our situation. but, you can see, in beenfly's case, DS420 still fine in his 450 sport. but,DS420 is with weak torque than DS520 in table. this two with different story.


meng
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Old Jan 23, 2011, 11:25 PM
Barnwell, SC
Barnwell, SC
Joined Sep 2004
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Originally Posted by ASSAN View Post
it's not easy to answer. the helis with different situations,and there have so much tail servos in the market.for example, at our 450 heli, GS D9257 with same speed as DS520, but the torque,D9257 stronger than DS520. so, we think D9257 is better than DS520 in our situation. but, you can see, in beenfly's case, DS420 still fine in his 450 sport. but,DS420 is with weak torque than DS520 in table. this two with different story.


meng
I have the GoTeck GSD9257 mounted on a new HK450V2 waiting to try this gyro. I ordered two
The item (RB284******HK) left Hong Kong for its destination on 24-Jan-2011
I did 4 trim flights on the heli using a E-flite G90 so I have a benchmark for performance on this particular heli.
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Old Jan 24, 2011, 02:52 AM
This helicopter smells funny
scottyvisco's Avatar
Berwick,Victoria,Australia
Joined Dec 2008
221 Posts
Hi everyone i just thought i would share some photos and info on my setup, its on a 450 gt completely stock no align bits, there is the usual slop in the tail ,the slider is put equally in the center on rate mode but i always fly in avacs ,I mounted the gyro at the front and are useing a henge md922 servo the timing is 1520us 250hz and the ball is 9mm from center .I am running a gyro gain of 60% and the tail seems to be nice and solid, pirouettes seem to stop well and as i said before there hasn't been any drift in all of the flights i have with this gyro [20 plus] just came back flying before and the wind was quite strong and the hell tail handled the gusts great put a battery through doing tight banked turns and pitch pumps tail was controllable at all times cheers scott
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Old Jan 24, 2011, 05:31 AM
Looptastic!
sp00fman's Avatar
Enschede, Netherlands
Joined Nov 2009
2,338 Posts
interesting it works with the henge 922. i might try that if i'm in the mood. How does it hold out in pitch pumps?
One thing i noticed the henge gets pretty sloppy on the gears after some time,and then started to misbehave on my 401.

Oh, by the way, your motor will also run without the fan if its not blistering hot where you fly. it will run quieter that way.
Do get rid of the stickers.

--
Meng, thanks for explaining. it was indeed not clear you were aiming the Gyro at the high end users. I hope the future software versions will open up options for the people who want to fly with cheaper parts.
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Old Jan 24, 2011, 06:54 AM
This helicopter smells funny
scottyvisco's Avatar
Berwick,Victoria,Australia
Joined Dec 2008
221 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by sp00fman View Post
interesting it works with the henge 922. i might try that if i'm in the mood. How does it hold out in pitch pumps?
One thing i noticed the henge gets pretty sloppy on the gears after some time,and then started to misbehave on my 401.

Oh, by the way, your motor will also run without the fan if its not blistering hot where you fly. it will run quieter that way.
Do get rid of the stickers
Gee spoofman you must be up late, the pitch pumps are nice except when i bog down the cyclic occasionally.

Fan noise im a bit deaf from work so the noise wont worry me but it can get hot here it was 45c last January ,i see where you are getting at with the sticker thing ,i will get to balancing the motor one day i suppose.

cheers scott
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Old Jan 24, 2011, 07:43 AM
Looptastic!
sp00fman's Avatar
Enschede, Netherlands
Joined Nov 2009
2,338 Posts
Its the middle of the day here now, and Monday is my day off

Balancing a motor canmake a huge difference in vibrations. It depends how bad it is from factory. Just mount it on a test stand and put a tie wrap around it. the thicker end will act as a weight . just shift it around until you find the spot where vibes are lower, and epoxy between the magnets in the can.


sorry for off topic
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Old Jan 24, 2011, 08:50 PM
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CHINA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sp00fman View Post

--
Meng, thanks for explaining. it was indeed not clear you were aiming the Gyro at the high end users. I hope the future software versions will open up options for the people who want to fly with cheaper parts.
actually, i need say thanks to you.because of your guys' tests and reports,which pull us to improve the design and product quality.thanks.

we will try a little changed software in next supply GA-250, which improved the working way on tail servo. at inner tests show, that make the GA-250 suit the slow tail servo better than before,i mean,less the bounce.


meng
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Old Jan 24, 2011, 09:14 PM
AMA # 949551
rikybob's Avatar
USA, FL, Orlando
Joined Oct 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ASSAN View Post
actually, i need say thanks to you.because of your guys' tests and reports,which pull us to improve the design and product quality.thanks.

we will try a little changed software in next supply GA-250, which improved the working way on tail servo. at inner tests show, that make the GA-250 suit the slow tail servo better than before,i mean,less the bounce.


meng
(Hmmmmm lets see.......I am at least two back orders behind.....maybe I will get lucky)??
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Last edited by rikybob; Jan 24, 2011 at 10:00 PM.
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Old Jan 24, 2011, 09:53 PM
Cereal Killer.
branflake12's Avatar
USA, IA, Iowa City
Joined Jun 2009
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Ive been paid up for mine since the 19th...any idea when mine might ship out (or when you will send hobbyking more stock?)
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Old Jan 24, 2011, 10:04 PM
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Originally Posted by branflake12 View Post
Ive been paid up for mine since the 19th...any idea when mine might ship out (or when you will send hobbyking more stock?)

sorry,

we will ship the goods to Hk tomorrow or the day after tomorrow. normally, which will cost two days on the way to HK.but you need undertand,this is so near to CHY holiday,every thing is not 100% sure.

meng
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Old Jan 25, 2011, 12:33 AM
Cereal Killer.
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USA, IA, Iowa City
Joined Jun 2009
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Originally Posted by ASSAN View Post
sorry,

we will ship the goods to Hk tomorrow or the day after tomorrow. normally, which will cost two days on the way to HK.but you need undertand,this is so near to CHY holiday,every thing is not 100% sure.

meng
Oh i am aware of your guy's month long party over there, i was just hoping to make it in under the wire, so to speak.

Thanks for the update!
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Old Jan 25, 2011, 12:33 AM
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Sonex128's Avatar
Claremore, OK, USA
Joined Feb 2004
369 Posts
Received my GA-250 today from HK. It is now installed on my heli. Just have to redo how I had the servo wires ran. Hopefully will get to test it out soon.

Brian
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