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Old Apr 23, 2012, 11:54 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
United States, MA, Walpole
Joined Dec 2003
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Feedback in blue...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mtz View Post
...
The PM is not in the forum search options...
I explained in the post you respond to how to access the PM option. It's not in the forum search tab because it is directed at ONE individual... accessed through their person blog page.

... and is the enemy of a forum purpose. Is better to have some stupid topic with offtopic because in all that "garbage" can be hidden real values. PM can be used for some sensitive things like price, where to buy to avoid spam, or for things that really break the forum rules...
I could not disagree more! Threads have subjects... for a good reason. By your logic, we don't need threads... just one giant blog talking randomly about anything. This very post is off topic. Do you think those who come to this thread expecting to read about the #11 camera want to wade through all this to find that one tidbit about the #11 camera. I think not! Complaints are coming if from the users of the forum who expect to see the thread topic discussed. Thread decorum will be maintained!

For example I don't like to answer only for one user... I consider when I add some value to a forum using my experience, this is good for all not for only one person...
I agree, but ONLY when the thread topic is being discussed.

Tom, the reason you made the posts 1-5 with so much work and information is just to not answer again and again to the same questions. I am sure you receive many PM regarding download old firmware versions, but this is because you choose that way to not provide old versions.
You are correct on the first part... I just wish ALL new users would heed the forum use topics when they first log on... many don't, thinking "why waste my time when I can just ask and get an answer?'... not caring that they are wasting the time of all the other readers of the thread. That is selfish, lazy behavior in my book, and I don't go find the links for them... I direct them to where THEY can find the links.
...
Again, PM is an enemy for every forum, bigger than offtopic.
Again, I disagree! This is a free web site for users, but that doesn't mean it runs all by itself with no ongoing expense. Who do you think pays for this service? Just look at the ad banners! The sponsors are sellers of our RC hobby gear. No one else, not even the camera developers or sellers. So it is totally improper use of this web site to continue discussion of the camera use for other things. It is this improper use that is killing this thread that so many RC hobbiests have enjoyed and gotten some value from. I stand by my prior belief that the thread will have lost it's intended value if off topic discussion continues, and in that case it should be (and will be) shut down. The clock is ticking...

I broke my own rule to take my reply to PM, because in this case, I want every one to know that your opinions are not shared and why it is important to follow the forum-use protocol that is the rule here. You don't have to like it or agree with it, but you DO have to follow it if you want the thread to continue.
enjoy,
Mtz
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Old Apr 24, 2012, 02:44 PM
Bring It On !!!!!
soundcheque's Avatar
Newmarket, England.
Joined Aug 2006
689 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by ashutoshn View Post
Where can I buy this camera (#11, #16, or #18) who provide international shipping?
It would be even better if it supports HD recording.

I just received my #11 from this guy as recommended on the first section of the thread.
http://stores.ebay.com/hxelepro360-Dianas-Store?_rdc=1

Perfect service and was in my hands within a week of ordering from him.

The first posts in this forum will give you ample information on everything you need to know about these cameras. Well done Tom Frank. My purchase was made purely on all his info.
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Last edited by soundcheque; Apr 24, 2012 at 02:51 PM.
Old Apr 24, 2012, 05:42 PM
So broke I can't pay attention
Naples FL USA
Joined Mar 2009
490 Posts
I just recieved my #11 camera, it took 10 days from China. Charged it up, and did some test video and pics. I used the "MP4Cam2avi-v2.98" app to convert the video to MPEG layer3, and it works perfectly in Windows Media Player, also works with Windows Movie Maker.
So far I'm very pleased with this little gem. Now I have to fit it on my UM Champ and see what it can do. Thanks to all, for the info and tips.
BTW, the time date was removed when I recieved it, so it must be the latest version.
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Old Apr 25, 2012, 07:13 AM
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White balance

Hi,

I hope this topic will be of general interest and I will be ON! ;-)

Yesterday, I was testing my #11 indoor... The video looked very bad yellow/orangish for all the time apart the last few minutes when it turned in a bright white. Probably the white balance didn't work at the beginning, but when the camera went very close to a dark object it started to work properly.
Do you have any ideas how to overcome this problem?

Thx ppl!
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Old Apr 25, 2012, 11:49 AM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
United States, MA, Walpole
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ginetto View Post
Hi,

I hope this topic will be of general interest and I will be ON! ;-)

Yesterday, I was testing my #11 indoor... The video looked very bad yellow/orangish for all the time apart the last few minutes when it turned in a bright white. Probably the white balance didn't work at the beginning, but when the camera went very close to a dark object it started to work properly.
Do you have any ideas how to overcome this problem?

Thx ppl!
This is inherent in the #11 camera unfortunately. It can shift colors back and forth unexpectedly outdoors as well in certain lighting conditions. There is no fix for it.
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Old Apr 25, 2012, 02:19 PM
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#11 to #18 upgrade

I don't know if I should post in the #11 or #18 thread, but I think the #11 is more appropriate.

Has anyone updated the #11 with the #18 firmware and properly tested?

I had a bit of spare time today so I first dumped the SPI #11 firmware and then updated the #18 boot loader and #18 firmware and then took another dump for analysis.

The #18 firmware appears to work, but only partially. I cannot enter photo mode. When the camera should be in photo mode there is no LED and nothing happens when I depress the shutter button. Also, the camera seems to hang from time to time and when I remove the card in the off position, the yellow LED starts to blink telling us that the card was removed - but the camera was off!

Does anyone have any experience with this upgrade?

I plan to add an external SOP8 socket so I don't need to solder/desolder the SPI all the time. Now that I have a #16 I don't use my #11 any more, so would like to use one of them for testing #18 firmware or whatever else seems interesting.

But I must admit, after using the #16, the #11 (#18) is very disappointing!
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Old Apr 25, 2012, 03:00 PM
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Michigan
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#11 to #18 Firmware Update

When I got the new #18 camera firmware they also sent me the firmware to make the #11 camera into the #18 camera...maybe someone with the #11 camera would like to experiment with it and see if and how it works as the #18...You can go from #11 to #18 OR #18 back to #11...

#11 to #18 Firmware Update
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Old Apr 25, 2012, 03:27 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Isoprop View Post
I don't know if I should post in the #11 or #18 thread, but I think the #11 is more appropriate.

Has anyone updated the #11 with the #18 firmware and properly tested?

I had a bit of spare time today so I first dumped the SPI #11 firmware and then updated the #18 boot loader and #18 firmware and then took another dump for analysis.

The #18 firmware appears to work, but only partially. I cannot enter photo mode. When the camera should be in photo mode there is no LED and nothing happens when I depress the shutter button. Also, the camera seems to hang from time to time and when I remove the card in the off position, the yellow LED starts to blink telling us that the card was removed - but the camera was off!

Does anyone have any experience with this upgrade?

I plan to add an external SOP8 socket so I don't need to solder/desolder the SPI all the time. Now that I have a #16 I don't use my #11 any more, so would like to use one of them for testing #18 firmware or whatever else seems interesting.

But I must admit, after using the #16, the #11 (#18) is very disappointing!
Quote:
Originally Posted by finster View Post
When I got the new #18 camera firmware they also sent me the firmware to make the #11 camera into the #18 camera...maybe someone with the #11 camera would like to experiment with it and see if and how it works as the #18...You can go from #11 to #18 OR #18 back to #11...

#11 to #18 Firmware Update
I've had this swapping firmware for several weeks and have converted a #11 Jumbo I had to #18. It performed pretty well in video mode, which was mainly what i was testing. But the camera had an experimental wide angle lens in it, and I bricked the camera trying to put a regular lens in it (the CMOS module had a longer barrel on it to accomodate the longer wide angle lens). I have one more Jumbo with some charging battery issues I need to look at, but won't be doing any more tests yet. The process is NOT reversible (e.g. even though there is a conversion zipped package that will convert a #11 to an #18 and an #18 to an #11 (why would anyone want to do that?), once the #11 is converted to a #18, it can't be returned to a #11 with the other swapping procedure.

I didn't notice the irregularities you mention, but then I wasn't doing testing for it. I was mainly interested in seeing ti the #11 converted to #18 still had the file corruption issue of a stock #18. With the wide angle lens on it, it did not corrupt in my ground-to-sky panning tests.
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Old Apr 25, 2012, 03:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by finster View Post
...You can go from #11 to #18 OR #18 back to #11...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank View Post
....
The process is NOT reversible (e.g. even though there is a conversion zipped package that will convert a #11 to an #18 and an #18 to an #11 (why would anyone want to do that?), once the #11 is converted to a #18, it can't be returned to a #11 with the other swapping procedure.
...
Tom says it's not reversible, finster says it is.

I have not been able to go back, but would love to know how...
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Old Apr 25, 2012, 07:28 PM
Just thumbing through...
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Not a known supplier, but #11 for $25 shipped.

http://item.mobileweb.ebay.com/viewi...id=05229951632

I see they include a micro SD card, sounds too good to be true? Maybe another fake or counterfeit?
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Old Apr 26, 2012, 03:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank View Post
....
I didn't notice the irregularities you mention, but then I wasn't doing testing for it. I was mainly interested in seeing ti the #11 converted to #18 still had the file corruption issue of a stock #18. With the wide angle lens on it, it did not corrupt in my ground-to-sky panning tests.
Well, my first test outside with the #18 firmware and BAMM.
Ground-to-Sky test FAILED miserably!!!! This firmware is total

[UPDATE] Unless there is some trickery that I don't know about, it is, like Tom said, not possible to go back to #11 firmware. However, before I did the #18 upgrade I took an SPI dump. I've just restored the dump, and my #11 is back to #11 firmware and works much better. I haven't noticed anything abnormal (yet?). I really do dislike the #18 firmware! To make and restore the dump I removed the SPI chip. Obviously this can't be done if you don't have the equipment (soldering skills and a suitable programmer). There is no Ground-to-Sky issue with the #11 firmware whatsoever, and the (nice) Kodakchrome colors are back!
I expect the original bootloader could also be restored by the method Tom explained by moving those tiny resistors - but for me, removing the SPI chip is much easier! Oh yes, the battery leads are so well glued (white and transparent) that I didn't remove the battery! I removed and replaced the chip 4 times while the battery was connected, but turned off. Wow - the camera still works...
When taking the case apart I also noticed the "tabs" have been modified and are much more solid. The two rectangle "holes" in one side of the tab are no longer hollow. [/UPDATE]
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Last edited by Isoprop; Apr 26, 2012 at 07:38 AM.
Old Apr 26, 2012, 05:54 AM
Fidler & twidler
empeabee's Avatar
Cranfield U.K.
Joined Mar 2004
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Quote:
Originally Posted by victapilot View Post
Not a known supplier, but #11 for $25 shipped.

http://item.mobileweb.ebay.com/viewi...id=05229951632

I see they include a micro SD card, sounds too good to be true? Maybe another fake or counterfeit?
or the last of the UnUpdated (old) #11's
dumped - you might be lucky, & you'd be +$25 or you might not & be -$25 .. you pays your money & takes your pick
me, I'm not much of a gambling man. but thanks for the reference.
Mike
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Old Apr 26, 2012, 06:22 AM
Mtz
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Romania, PH, Ploiesti
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And now the price is $45.75.
I have a bad experience with that seller so I not recommend.

enjoy,
Mtz
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Old Apr 26, 2012, 07:46 AM
Just thumbing through...
victapilot's Avatar
United States, SC, Simpsonville
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Quote:
Originally Posted by empeabee View Post
or the last of the UnUpdated (old) #11's
dumped - you might be lucky, & you'd be +$25 or you might not & be -$25 .. you pays your money & takes your pick
me, I'm not much of a gambling man. but thanks for the reference.
Mike
I thought also could be dumping old stock or a falling out between producer and resellers. But no joy, probably a miscalculation of currency.
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Old Apr 26, 2012, 11:33 AM
Dance the skies...
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http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...ostcount=9079I posted a while back that you can get the real thing from the verified Ebay sellers ($5 more... $29.99 US). Why would anyone want to take a chance on an unknow to save $5?
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Old Apr 26, 2012, 12:43 PM
Just thumbing through...
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank View Post
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...ostcount=9079I posted a while back that you can get the real thing from the verified Ebay sellers ($5 more... $29.99 US). Why would anyone want to take a chance on an unknow to save $5?
Only suckers for cheap, like me!, LOL

Not getting one, there are many sellers no as seen by searching "#11 dvr"
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Old Apr 27, 2012, 06:33 AM
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Michigan
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Iso-

It was very hard to discribe but you could say #11 camera upgraded to #18 OR #18 camera downgraded to #11...I guess thats for people who like the #11...I dont mind taking chances with firmware so I would try it myself but I got rid of my #11 cams...being not many knew about this firmware I thought someone would give an unbiased opinion how/if it works...Ive only seen one other person that tried it on a jumbo #11 and he said "works great...nice colors"...so im on the edge if its good or not...could you post a short video of how it looked on your #11 with the ground to sky corruption you mentioned?...

BTW...a couple days ago the developers of the #18 camera wrote me saying the ground to sky corruption was fixed in the #18 cameras...
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Old Apr 27, 2012, 06:47 AM
Mtz
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Was fixed by hardware or software? If software, you should ask them for the firmware fix.

enjoy,
Mtz
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Old Apr 27, 2012, 07:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by finster View Post
Iso-

It was very hard to discribe but you could say #11 camera upgraded to #18 OR #18 camera downgraded to #11...I guess thats for people who like the #11...I dont mind taking chances with firmware so I would try it myself but I got rid of my #11 cams...being not many knew about this firmware I thought someone would give an unbiased opinion how/if it works...Ive only seen one other person that tried it on a jumbo #11 and he said "works great...nice colors"...so im on the edge if its good or not...could you post a short video of how it looked on your #11 with the ground to sky corruption you mentioned?...

BTW...a couple days ago the developers of the #18 camera wrote me saying the ground to sky corruption was fixed in the #18 cameras...
Sure. It took me quite a while to find, so you're lucky I usually delete my tests.

I cut out the important part with Avidemux. It was almost at the beginning of the video (about after 4 seconds). Nothing spectacular, just my standard "swing-the-arm" test which I've always used and is 100% reliable.

After I put back the #11 firmware I had no problems whatsoever, however hard I tried!

You can download the original clip here. I'm afraid I didn't do any more real testing - just a few short indoor tests - because there's no point until this issue is fixed. Also, photo mode didn't work, but I don't care about it. What I didn't like is that if you enter photo mode all LEDs are off.

BTW, I'm only biased towards the #16 as far as the configuration possibilities and stability go. The #18 just doesn't give me what I want (no time stamp, mov, 70 min. S/S/C, blinking recording indicator), so, until it can do this I will always be biased

Once it can make a video how I, and most probably a majority of other users, want it to, then I may do the upgrade again. However, you can be assured that it would need a miracle for me to actually purchase a #18. I would love to upgrade all my #11s though - and that is a very positive aspect of the #18 firmware, IMO.

I also can't downgrade indefinitely. One day the solder pads will "lift". I've already removed the chip 4 times so really don't want to take any more unnecessary risks.
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Old Apr 27, 2012, 02:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by finster View Post
...
BTW...a couple days ago the developers of the #18 camera wrote me saying the ground to sky corruption was fixed in the #18 cameras...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mtz View Post
Was fixed by hardware or software? If software, you should ask them for the firmware fix.

enjoy,
Mtz
Based on comments I received from my Ebay seller contact link with the developer, the new camera was fixed with redesign, not with firmware. I should have the new design within a day or two and will be able to test it out. Any findings will be posted in the #18 thread, not here.
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Old Apr 27, 2012, 06:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Isoprop View Post
I cut out the important part with Avidemux. It was almost at the beginning of the video (about after 4 seconds). Nothing spectacular, just my standard "swing-the-arm" test which I've always used and is 100% reliable.
How fast is your standard swing-the-arm test...I only got a 5 sec sound byte...with no video...

Tom-

Yup thats what they told me too...they updated the camera...
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Old Apr 27, 2012, 06:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by finster View Post
How fast is your standard swing-the-arm test...I only got a 5 sec sound byte...with no video...

Tom-

Yup thats what they told me too...they updated the camera...
I posted a video sample of the ground-to-sky corruption test for the #18 in the #18 thread. Since this is the #11 thread, I suggest going to the #18 thread for on-topic discussion of it. Thanks.
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Old Apr 27, 2012, 06:28 PM
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Rite tom...I already did that #18 test myself...we was talking about the #11 to #18 firmware update...
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Old Apr 27, 2012, 09:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by finster View Post
Rite tom...I already did that #18 test myself...we was talking about the #11 to #18 firmware update...
OH, Ok... I forgot! Too many of these key cam threads!
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Old Apr 28, 2012, 04:20 PM
Aka: Tom Jenkins
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Palm Beach County, Fl.
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Hello Tom and all,
No 11 from last spring 2011.
After many videos and letting the cam set for a spell, I'm getting a totally striped pixelated with a slight backgroung image of what I'm shooting. Is it toast or should I try to re seat any plug ins if any on the board. It takes a charge and turns off and on, the blinky sequences are correct for vid and still but the picture is badly distorted. I haven't a clue, my son could have dipped it in his beer for all I know. It did sit for a spell in shop conditions, still holds the date and time.
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Old Apr 28, 2012, 04:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ApexAero View Post
Hello Tom and all,
No 11 from last spring 2011.
After many videos and letting the cam set for a spell, I'm getting a totally striped pixelated with a slight backgroung image of what I'm shooting. Is it toast or should I try to re seat any plug ins if any on the board. It takes a charge and turns off and on, the blinky sequences are correct for vid and still but the picture is badly distorted. I haven't a clue, my son could have dipped it in his beer for all I know. It did sit for a spell in shop conditions, still holds the date and time.
I haven't a clue... other than there is nothing to adjust or reseat inside. Did you try a different flash card> I video of the symptom would help as well. I assume the computer and video player are the same as what you used when the camera was working normally?
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Old Apr 28, 2012, 05:28 PM
Aka: Tom Jenkins
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Palm Beach County, Fl.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank View Post
I haven't a clue... other than there is nothing to adjust or reseat inside. Did you try a different flash card> I video of the symptom would help as well. I assume the computer and video player are the same as what you used when the camera was working normally?
No I have not tried another card. I did stick it in a usb adapter and loaded and played off it and it works that way. Here's a still but the vid has the same, you can make out the palm frons in the back yard.
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Old Apr 28, 2012, 05:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ApexAero View Post
No I have not tried another card. I did stick it in a usb adapter and loaded and played off it and it works that way. Here's a still but the vid has the same, you can make out the palm frons in the back yard.
Nasty! Looks like the kind of thing that can result if there is a bad connection on one or more of the CMOS ribbon cable contacts to the circuit board. But they are soldered in place, so I don't see how that could have gotten broken with the camera just sitting. The only thing I can think of is if the camera went through some very cold winter temperatures, and had some differential contraction that caused one of the trace solder joints to crack. and open up when it warmed back up.

I guess you could carefully try to reflow the solder on those tiny finger contacts to see if that helps (easy to get a solder bridge from one finger to an adjacent one doing that!). My guess is it's toast, so I'd try it the reflow before sending it to the parts bin.
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Old Apr 28, 2012, 06:19 PM
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The color striped video looks exactly like a badly seated CMOS sensor on the #16. In my case I just re-seated it. On the #11, it's a bad solder joint or torn wire. It must have been marginal from the when it was produced.
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Old Apr 28, 2012, 07:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by finster View Post
How fast is your standard swing-the-arm test...I only got a 5 sec sound byte...with no video...

Tom-

Yup thats what they told me too...they updated the camera...
I received my updated test camera today... See the video sample I just posted in the #18 thread...
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Old Apr 30, 2012, 10:03 AM
Aka: Tom Jenkins
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Palm Beach County, Fl.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof100 View Post
The color striped video looks exactly like a badly seated CMOS sensor on the #16. In my case I just re-seated it. On the #11, it's a bad solder joint or torn wire. It must have been marginal from the when it was produced.
Thanks for the lead! I took it apart and found dust across the ribbon traces that must have had moisture, I swabbed with an eraser, dusted off and it works like a charm again! wee!
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Old Apr 30, 2012, 11:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ApexAero View Post
Thanks for the lead! I took it apart and found dust across the ribbon traces that must have had moisture, I swabbed with an eraser, dusted off and it works like a charm again! wee!
Excellent! I am glad you solved the problem.
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Old Apr 30, 2012, 03:58 PM
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I just logged on ok but when I do a search for my previous posts I get" nothing found".

I searched using my user name.

The reason i wanted to find my previous post is that I was introduced to a page that allowed me to set or change various parameters on the camera, such as making it blink while recording. I have another camera now and I want make some changes.

I have looked at FAQs and cannot see that handy program to make camera changes.
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Old Apr 30, 2012, 04:10 PM
Just thumbing through...
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Try the #16 thread
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Old Apr 30, 2012, 06:47 PM
Mtz
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Romania, PH, Ploiesti
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You always can find your posts or any user post clicking on the forum nickname. Then you will find this.

enjoy,
Mtz
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Old Apr 30, 2012, 10:34 PM
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Maryland
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I seem to have struck some bad luck. I ordered one from one of the listed reputable vendors but seems to not work. I can turn it on and turn it off.... sometimes. I can never seem to get the shutter button to do anything. Sporadically it will connect to my computer but it is very unpredictable. Somehow I was able to take a couple pictures and one video but the video was a picture with audio recorded. Any suggestions or take it up with the seller?
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Old May 01, 2012, 01:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Willsonman View Post
I seem to have struck some bad luck. I ordered one from one of the listed reputable vendors but seems to not work. I can turn it on and turn it off.... sometimes. I can never seem to get the shutter button to do anything. Sporadically it will connect to my computer but it is very unpredictable. Somehow I was able to take a couple pictures and one video but the video was a picture with audio recorded. Any suggestions or take it up with the seller?
Simply contact them via their bay web page, but first, have you tried a different flash memory card? Formatting the memory card using the camer's built-in formatting routine? A different USB cable? The reset button after a full battery charge. And finally, flashing in v0.27 firmware?
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Old May 01, 2012, 06:04 AM
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no, no, no, yes, no.... looks like I have quite a bit of homework to do. I only have one flash drive so I may go pick up a new one. I've not been able to find the instructions for formatting or the firmware update. There is so much information out there and especially here. Its a lot to sift through. A different USB cable may be hard to come by. I'll start digging. Anyone have a backhoe?
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Old May 01, 2012, 08:12 AM
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Originally Posted by Willsonman View Post
no, no, no, yes, no.... looks like I have quite a bit of homework to do. I only have one flash drive so I may go pick up a new one. I've not been able to find the instructions for formatting or the firmware update. There is so much information out there and especially here. Its a lot to sift through. A different USB cable may be hard to come by. I'll start digging. Anyone have a backhoe?
In a previous post you mentioned that your camera was acting sporadically. You may be unlucky to have received a dud, but there are lots of things you can check before sending it back.

This is a long thread, and it's difficult for newcomers to find their way around. However, the thread is extremely well organized, and you really only need to read the first five pages and follow the links. Actually, page #3 is by far the most important.

The firmware files are linked from page #3 which will take you to the firmware page.

However, the most important page, which is also linked from page #3, is the instruction manual. Here you will find everything from how to operate the camera to formatting your card to updating the firmware. And of courrse, basic truobleshooting is also included. There is no in-camera formatting and the firmware versions are not numbered. That was a small slip-up. It gets confusing when trying to help both the #11 and #16 users .

If you are capable of making your own "special" cable, or just want to know what it is, then again, from post #3 there is a link to the "The definite Guide to Power connectors, charging, and other power related questions".

If you read and fully understand the information in the above 3 links and your camera still doesn't work, then there may well be a problem with your camera.

The most important thing is to make sure the battery is fully charged (red LED turns off). These cameras have been known to initially "hang" occasionally, but they usually come back to life and from then on work perfectly.
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Old May 01, 2012, 09:23 AM
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Willsonman, you can try also the Web Camera mode first.

enjoy,
Mtz
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Old May 01, 2012, 12:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Willsonman View Post
no, no, no, yes, no.... looks like I have quite a bit of homework to do.
...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Isoprop View Post
...
There is no in-camera formatting and the firmware versions are not numbered. That was a small slip-up. It gets confusing when trying to help both the #11 and #16 users .
...
Arrgh! I can't even use the excuse that it was getting late!
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Old May 01, 2012, 04:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Mtz View Post
Willsonman, you can try also the Web Camera mode first.

enjoy,
Mtz
I did try that and it worked once or twice but I just had it show up as a device... never tested it. I tried again after I started getting frustrated but never could get it to work again. I'll try the firmware update this evening and report back on how thing went.
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Old May 01, 2012, 07:15 PM
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Don't forget to not have SD Card inside camera.

enjoy,
Mtz
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Old May 01, 2012, 08:26 PM
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Ok, I got it flashed. I followed the instructions to the letter. Everything looked fine as it should per the instructions anyway. Cannot get webcam mode to work at all. Tried the reset button as well. Seems to turn on just fine but When I turn it on the light just comes on. Then nothing when I press the shutter button. Long press turns off as it should. I am thinking a faulty shutter button but I'm not 100% convinced. Should I crack it open at this point? I did get it to connect to the computer twice but I had to press the power button and once I would press to turn off it connected. Odd.

Update: Just got the camera to connect and tried recording video from Windows movie maker. Got an error saying it could not save and had no picture on the screen from the camera. I think its dead.
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Old May 01, 2012, 09:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Willsonman View Post
Ok, I got it flashed. I followed the instructions to the letter. Everything looked fine as it should per the instructions anyway. Cannot get webcam mode to work at all. Tried the reset button as well. Seems to turn on just fine but When I turn it on the light just comes on. Then nothing when I press the shutter button. Long press turns off as it should. I am thinking a faulty shutter button but I'm not 100% convinced. Should I crack it open at this point? I did get it to connect to the computer twice but I had to press the power button and once I would press to turn off it connected. Odd.

Update: Just got the camera to connect and tried recording video from Windows movie maker. Got an error saying it could not save and had no picture on the screen from the camera. I think its dead.
Have you tried a different USB cable? It sounds like it could be intermittent connection, but that wouldn't explain the funky behavior when not connected. But the flash memory card could. Have you tried a different card?
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Old May 01, 2012, 10:17 PM
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ITs the only one I have but it does work in my HD camcorder. I even tried using the re-format method mentioned. No-go there.
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Old May 03, 2012, 05:43 PM
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camera settings

Does #11 have the camera's configuration file as in #16?

I have some problems with the white balance... Maybe I could solve these problems by specifying a particular setting for white balance instead of leaving it automatic. Is it possible?
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Old May 03, 2012, 06:56 PM
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Does #11 have the camera's configuration file as in #16?

I have some problems with the white balance... Maybe I could solve these problems by specifying a particular setting for white balance instead of leaving it automatic. Is it possible?
No and no.
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Old May 04, 2012, 03:54 AM
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No and no.
That's a bad news

Does the updated #11 (#18) have this configuration file?
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Old May 04, 2012, 06:56 AM
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Originally Posted by ginetto View Post
That's a bad news

Does the updated #11 (#18) have this configuration file?
More bad news, No.
Mike
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Old May 05, 2012, 06:03 AM
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Originally Posted by ginetto View Post
That's a bad news

Does the updated #11 (#18) have this configuration file?
Sell your #11 while you can. Time to get a #16, but wait a week or two....
A much better camera, IMO, and support in the form of firmware updates is exceptional.
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Old May 05, 2012, 08:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Isoprop View Post
Sell your #11 while you can. Time to get a #16, but wait a week or two....
A much better camera, IMO, and support in the form of firmware updates is exceptional.
Hi Isoprop,
Can you tell us a little more about it ...?
Thanks
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Old May 05, 2012, 08:44 AM
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I think is normal to ask in the #16 topic. But I have hopes about Video Out and Save actual recording function (to not be deleted by the loop recording mode).

enjoy,
Mtz
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Old May 05, 2012, 08:47 AM
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Hi, as written before my old #11 died in Tea so after having good experience with the #11 i ordered another from internet-shop365. but what i received looks like a #18. it has the small usb plug and when i opened it it has the battery connected with a plug. but it does record MOV! So it looks like a #18 but it records in MOV also no AV-OUT cable was shipped but i have one from my friends 1080p Jumbo cam. Tried this, no AV-OUT worked. So what is this camera now? #11 or #18? Or do you have any information that the NEW #11 also have plugged battery connectors and the new usb connector?
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Old May 05, 2012, 12:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buglat View Post
Or do you have any information that the NEW #11 also have plugged battery connectors and the new usb connector?
I just got a new #11 from internetshop365 as my 14 month old #11 finally had the battery die. I've been using it hard these last few months.

Yes, it has the new 8-pin micro usb plug,
it has the new battery connector,
and it does take the #11 firmware.
So I think it is still a #11, BUT looking inside at the board, it also looks like a #18. Interesting.

Also with the crystal clear audio and video sharpness,
and the beautiful large date stamp, these fulfill my needs, so I'm a happy customer.

My #11 special cable won't work, but I'll get over it.

Stewart
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Old May 05, 2012, 01:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buglat View Post
Hi, as written before my old #11 died in Tea so after having good experience with the #11 i ordered another from internet-shop365. but what i received looks like a #18. it has the small usb plug and when i opened it it has the battery connected with a plug. but it does record MOV! So it looks like a #18 but it records in MOV also no AV-OUT cable was shipped but i have one from my friends 1080p Jumbo cam. Tried this, no AV-OUT worked. So what is this camera now? #11 or #18? Or do you have any information that the NEW #11 also have plugged battery connectors and the new usb connector?
This has been reported by others. It appears they are shipping #18 cameras running #11 firmware, so you only get #11 features. But read the #18 thread... there is a way to flash in #18 firmware.

I suspect the #11 cameras are in short supply now, and most likely being phased out since they are not up to snuff with the latest cameras. But if they are out of them, I don't know why they continue to advertised them.
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Old May 05, 2012, 01:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buglat View Post
Hi, as written before my old #11 died in Tea so after having good experience with the #11 i ordered another from internet-shop365. but what i received looks like a #18. it has the small usb plug and when i opened it it has the battery connected with a plug. but it does record MOV! So it looks like a #18 but it records in MOV also no AV-OUT cable was shipped but i have one from my friends 1080p Jumbo cam. Tried this, no AV-OUT worked. So what is this camera now? #11 or #18? Or do you have any information that the NEW #11 also have plugged battery connectors and the new usb connector?
I absolutely understand the developer. Why produce two identical products where only the USB socket is different. Of course it's a pain if you have many USB cables you made specifically for the "old" #11 and now find they don't fit.

Talking for myself, I don't like the tiny 8-pin non-standard USB plugs and sockets but realize this is the only possibility the developer has if the camera supplies audio and video out.

If I loved my #11 and wanted an identical version I would be very if I received another #11 with a completely different USB connection....
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Old May 05, 2012, 01:22 PM
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I think is normal to ask in the #16 topic. But I have hopes about Video Out and Save actual recording function (to not be deleted by the loop recording mode).

enjoy,
Mtz
It was asked there as well. Future features are not defined, and until they are tested and a reality, we will not discuss what might be a work in progress at the developer's request. If testing shows something doesn't work, it will not become reality, and the developer does not want to get users hopes up and then disappoint them.

What is the "save actual recording" function you mention? You can turn off loop recording in the config file if you don't want that to happen, but then when a card fills up, the video recording will stop. Loop recording requires the fixed small clip segments so as not to lose too much video when the camera deletes the oldest file to make room for new clips. With loop recording turned off, you can set larger file clip sizes up to 70 min. duration. What more are you suggesting?
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Old May 05, 2012, 05:06 PM
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Just an example to try to explain simple in the AP area.

I have a 4GB card and I record in loop mode, but I can use 20 or 40 minutes. I fly many times using the same card, and for example from 20 flights I like only one and I want to be sure that video will be never erased by the camera software. I will save myself for keeping or uploading on youtube when I will use some PC, at home.

The save actual recording can be something like renaming the file when pressing the power button (this means the photo feature will be disabled) and in this way the loop mode will never erase because it will not have the MINIxxxx.MOV name. When you will see the SAVEDxxxx.MOV you already know to not erase it.
If this feature will move the saved record named as MINIxxxx.MOV but to some SAVED folder, when using PC you know there is the video you want and the others are not needed or important.

The only way to make read only style some recording is possible only if that recording is still running when you press the button. For that I used the word "actual". If not correct, sorry, I am not an english native speaker.
More discussions, but I think not necessary now is like if I have enabled the 20 minutes feature and I want to save it after just 8 minutes, what will do the camera? Stop and save that 8 minutes? Will continue up to that 20 minutes and than save? Logic answer is first.

enjoy,
Mtz
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Old May 05, 2012, 05:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mtz View Post
I think is normal to ask in the #16 topic. But I have hopes about Video Out and Save actual recording function (to not be deleted by the loop recording mode).

enjoy,
Mtz
I also don't understand what you mean by "Save actual recording". In normal mode, the camera will stop as soon as the disk is full. In loop recording, the camera will continue forever, overwriting the oldest clips. With a 32GB card, you will have the last 10 hours of history if you select loop recording. If you use a 64GB SDXC (unofficially formatted to FAT32 by the camera) you will have up to 20 hours. I don't know what other possibility could exist?

That is also one reason why the clips are fixed at 5 minutes for loop recording. To make sure you can record the whole capacity of the card minus 5 minutes. For a car recorder in loop recordin mode, the ideal solution, I would think?

In the meantime you have added information, but I can asure you that it is much easier to just switch the card if you want to save your files! There is no need to make the operation of the camera even more complicated. That would lead to a lot more problems and in the end you would end up with no recording at all!! Cards are getting cheaper and cheaper, and if you want a different configuration, no problem - just set up your cards with a read-only setup file! Even the GUI can do that fully automatically for you as long as you know the "magic" button to press!

OOPS, this should be in the #16 thread!
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Last edited by Isoprop; May 05, 2012 at 05:19 PM.
Old May 05, 2012, 05:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buglat View Post
Hi, as written before my old #11 died in Tea so after having good experience with the #11 i ordered another from internet-shop365. but what i received looks like a #18. it has the small usb plug and when i opened it it has the battery connected with a plug. but it does record MOV! So it looks like a #18 but it records in MOV also no AV-OUT cable was shipped but i have one from my friends 1080p Jumbo cam. Tried this, no AV-OUT worked. So what is this camera now? #11 or #18? Or do you have any information that the NEW #11 also have plugged battery connectors and the new usb connector?
Can you post the link for the exact one you ordered from that shop. Thanks ahead of time.
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Old May 05, 2012, 05:29 PM
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Quote:
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For a car recorder in loop recordin mode, the ideal solution, I would think?
Yes.
Is more easy to say No, Not possible, I don't think so, but I am not afraid to say yes. But also I like to work firmware for me, not me to replace some card.
If the developer have future plans to release a Car DVR he will need to learn to implement also this function and the firmware is not much different.

A little offtopic: I have a HD media player. It have the torrent downloading function and I am not interested at all about this because never use it. I can't tell developer to not work at that function anymore because I dont't want it.
I know the discussion are here about AP, but the camera wasn't made for AP, was a spy camera. The only reason is used and discussed here is because of it just 15 grams and than because can record HD.

Progress is because of ideas, not because of No. And to have a good idea you can be forced to listen another 10000 (stupid) ideas.
I wrote somewhere my idea about detachable display (monitor). Of course also there we can find 1000 reasons to not make it in that way. But all I can say my idea is original and never used, compared to the save actual recording feature which is not original. So I have a chance to have that 1 good from 10000 ideas.

enjoy,
Mtz
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Old May 05, 2012, 06:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mtz View Post
Yes.
Is more easy to say No, Not possible, I don't think so, but I am not afraid to say yes. But also I like to work firmware for me, not me to replace some card.
If the developer have future plans to release a Car DVR he will need to learn to implement also this function and the firmware is not much different.

A little offtopic: I have a HD media player. It have the torrent downloading function and I am not interested at all about this because never use it. I can't tell developer to not work at that function anymore because I dont't want it.
I know the discussion are here about AP, but the camera wasn't made for AP, was a spy camera. The only reason is used and discussed here is because of it just 15 grams and than because can record HD.

Progress is because of ideas, not because of No. And to have a good idea you can be forced to listen another 10000 (stupid) ideas.
I wrote somewhere my idea about detachable display (monitor). Of course also there we can find 1000 reasons to not make it in that way. But all I can say my idea is original and never used, compared to the save actual recording feature which is not original. So I have a chance to have that 1 good from 10000 ideas.

enjoy,
Mtz
But you can email your off topic ideas to the #16 seller, eletoponline365. He works VERY closely with the developer, and will pass it on. That way the people who come here BECAUSE it's an AV forum and AV thread will not have to keep reading about 1000 ways to improve the camera for 1000 other uses. We do not want to read that here. I hope I don't have to mention this again!

If your agenda is to improve the camera for your specific use or 1000 other uses, you can start a thread in this camera forum. It is strictly a camera forum and not one dedicated to a specific use as this one is.
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Old May 05, 2012, 07:53 PM
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Can you post the link for the exact one you ordered from that shop. Thanks ahead of time.
Here you go..
http://www.ebay.com/itm/250784145088...84.m1497.l2649

Ok i did some testing. Fully charged the battery until red light did stop. Started recording did get an 2,2GB ~42 min MOV file. Audio is having this "battery dying sound" almost all the time?!

What i found out is on Power on, it does NOT operate like a normal #11. A Normal #11 does blink the yellow light on power on ONE time. This one does blink TWO times. Maybe this can help anybody identify this beast. A little bit disappointed from sound quality of this one, also i think microphone position is not that good as on my #11 i did have before
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Old May 06, 2012, 11:36 AM
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Here you go..
http://www.ebay.com/itm/250784145088...84.m1497.l2649

Ok i did some testing. Fully charged the battery until red light did stop. Started recording did get an 2,2GB ~42 min MOV file. Audio is having this "battery dying sound" almost all the time?!

What i found out is on Power on, it does NOT operate like a normal #11. A Normal #11 does blink the yellow light on power on ONE time. This one does blink TWO times. Maybe this can help anybody identify this beast. A little bit disappointed from sound quality of this one, also i think microphone position is not that good as on my #11 i did have before
To me, the picture on the site you linked is a bit confusing. The #11 shows it now has the 8-pin mini USB socket, but the cables, well at least the one on the left, shows the 5-pin mini USB plug

When I turn on my "old" #11, the yellow light turns on for a short duration, then it turns off and then on again and remains on. Is this what you mean by one blink?
I doubt that this is done by HW, so I suspect you have a different firmware version on your "new" #11. Interesting... If someone with a programmer could remove the SPI and dump the contents we would know for sure....

If this is the case, it indicates there is no more support for the 5-pin USB #11 so the color hunting and other minor issues will never be fixed. I don't think it is correct to continue calling this camera the #11 when it is evident there have been major HW modifications made and current #11 firmware will no longer work on the new models.
R.I.P.
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Old May 06, 2012, 01:33 PM
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Hi,
I have a prblem with my #11. Dont work. When I plug to charging, the red led blink very fast, buttons work, but when I dissociate, camera not work. do not power on. any led no light.
What it a prblem ?
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Old May 06, 2012, 01:38 PM
Just thumbing through...
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Try the reset?
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Old May 06, 2012, 01:43 PM
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Try the reset?
Yes,
no result.

in usb cabel, camera wok ok, "web cam" is ok, film is ok quality, ( red led flashin all the time).
Without cabel, camera don't work.
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Old May 06, 2012, 01:44 PM
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Hi,
I have a prblem with my #11. Dont work. When I plug to charging, the red led blink very fast, buttons work, but when I dissociate, camera not work. do not power on. any led no light.
What it a prblem ?
Sounds to me that the battery is dead or not connected properly. open the case and check it. i got same issue if removing battery and then charging it does a fast red blinking.
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Old May 06, 2012, 01:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Isoprop View Post
When I turn on my "old" #11, the yellow light turns on for a short duration, then it turns off and then on again and remains on. Is this what you mean by one blink?
R.I.P.
Exactly. And my NEW #11 is doing this one MORE time, so the "boot up" process it taking much longer than on the original old #11. anyone else having a camera #11 or #18 doing this?
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Old May 06, 2012, 02:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Buglat View Post
Sounds to me that the battery is dead or not connected properly. open the case and check it. i got same issue if removing battery and then charging it does a fast red blinking.
Problem wos in conetions. Now work good.
Thanks.
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Old May 06, 2012, 02:00 PM
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To me, the picture on the site you linked is a bit confusing. The #11 shows it now has the 8-pin mini USB socket, but the cables, well at least the one on the left, shows the 5-pin mini USB plug

When I turn on my "old" #11, the yellow light turns on for a short duration, then it turns off and then on again and remains on. Is this what you mean by one blink?
I doubt that this is done by HW, so I suspect you have a different firmware version on your "new" #11. Interesting... If someone with a programmer could remove the SPI and dump the contents we would know for sure....

If this is the case, it indicates there is no more support for the 5-pin USB #11 so the color hunting and other minor issues will never be fixed. I don't think it is correct to continue calling this camera the #11 when it is evident there have been major HW modifications made and current #11 firmware will no longer work on the new models.

R.I.P.
I was last emailed last night by my Ebay seller go-between with the developer. The #11 now has the same circuit board as the #18, but they have hard-coded a key into #11 and #18 cameras. They have done this to disable the ability of the new #11 to be converted to the #18. I have removed the boot loader that did this from the #18 thread at their request, because it will not work with the new #11 cameras. I was told some were buying a #18 and #11 (the latter at it's lower price), then saying they didn't get the AV out cable for the #18 and asking for another cable to be sent. The seller said they have a way to confirm what was packed and shipped with each order, but sent the cables anyway to keep customers happy. But, they were losing money on the cable and the second shipping cost, so they took necessary action to stop the abuse.

So, a few who chose to act irresponsibly have forced this change, much like what is likely to happen with the threads I started, forced by the few who choose to continue to post off-topic posts under the veil of freedom of speech.
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Old May 06, 2012, 03:45 PM
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(So, a few who chose to act irresponsibly have forced this change, much like what is likely to happen with the threads I started, forced by the few who choose to continue to post off-topic posts under the veil of freedom of speech.)

Doesn't seem to matter how many times you point it out Tom, there are those who can't seem to grasp it.

Let's try again....

** This is an AERIAL PHOTOGRAPHY group.
It is discussing the use of the various key chain cameras for AERIAL PHOTOGRAPHY.

** Each version of the camera has it's OWN THREAD.

** The people who are discussing these cameras are all involved in or interested in AERIAL PHOTOGRAPHY.

** If you are not involved in AERIAL PHOTOGRAPHY then why are you posting non-relevant stuff on these threads ? Why do you think anybody on the AERIAL PHOTOGRAPHY group would give a damn about your ideas for other uses for these cameras.

** If you are not involved in using these cameras for AERIAL PHOTOGRAPHY then shove off and present your ideas and "wish lists somewhere else.

** If your post is not about using these cameras for AERIAL PHOTOGRAPHY then why the hell are you putting them in these threads on the AERIAL PHOTOGRAPHY group. Why,Why, Why ?

** For those still a bit slow on the uptake..... this is an AERIAL PHOTOGAPHY group discussing the use of key chain cameras for AERIAL PHOTOGRAPHY ! If your intended post isn't specifically about the use of these cameras for AERIAL PHOTOGRAPHY then.... go and dump it somewhere else where somebody might just be interested !

You have the patience of a Saint Tom. Thank you for your hard work and research - despite the cretins who keep popping up. May I suggest that posts from those who keep popping up with irrelevant stuff are ignored by everyone ? If they are ignored then they will eventually go and plague someone, somewhere else.

New policy... If it's not on topic then we all ignore it and don't respond ???
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Old May 06, 2012, 10:16 PM
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Northern Ireland
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i cant delete the video files after uploading to my laptop , if i delete them one at a time they reappear , will reformatting the memory card help or would i have to buy a new card ?
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Old May 06, 2012, 10:39 PM
Just a yard bird
kd4wen's Avatar
United States, TN, Springfield
Joined Mar 2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sparklet View Post
(So, a few who chose to act irresponsibly have forced this change, much like what is likely to happen with the threads I started, forced by the few who choose to continue to post off-topic posts under the veil of freedom of speech.)

Doesn't seem to matter how many times you point it out Tom, there are those who can't seem to grasp it.

Let's try again....

** This is an AERIAL PHOTOGRAPHY group.
It is discussing the use of the various key chain cameras for AERIAL PHOTOGRAPHY.

** Each version of the camera has it's OWN THREAD.

** The people who are discussing these cameras are all involved in or interested in AERIAL PHOTOGRAPHY.

** If you are not involved in AERIAL PHOTOGRAPHY then why are you posting non-relevant stuff on these threads ? Why do you think anybody on the AERIAL PHOTOGRAPHY group would give a damn about your ideas for other uses for these cameras.

** If you are not involved in using these cameras for AERIAL PHOTOGRAPHY then shove off and present your ideas and "wish lists somewhere else.

** If your post is not about using these cameras for AERIAL PHOTOGRAPHY then why the hell are you putting them in these threads on the AERIAL PHOTOGRAPHY group. Why,Why, Why ?

** For those still a bit slow on the uptake..... this is an AERIAL PHOTOGAPHY group discussing the use of key chain cameras for AERIAL PHOTOGRAPHY ! If your intended post isn't specifically about the use of these cameras for AERIAL PHOTOGRAPHY then.... go and dump it somewhere else where somebody might just be interested !

You have the patience of a Saint Tom. Thank you for your hard work and research - despite the cretins who keep popping up. May I suggest that posts from those who keep popping up with irrelevant stuff are ignored by everyone ? If they are ignored then they will eventually go and plague someone, somewhere else.

New policy... If it's not on topic then we all ignore it and don't respond ???
My My guess someone pissed on your tea and crumpets today huh oh lord god bless the queen and all her grumppy old men lol
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Old May 07, 2012, 04:51 AM
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Documentation no longer supports the "new" #11

Since the developer has decided to modify both the firmware and the hardware of these once excellent cameras, both the Operating Manual and the "The definite Guide to Power connectors, charging, and other power related questions" are no longer valid for the new hardware design. Both documents can still be used as a guideline, but they are not correct in many cases. Especially the "special" cable is no longer valid.

Since I don't have a "new" #11, I will not be updating any documents previously posted. I have modified the two most important documents to make this clear.

Any newcomers should also take note that many previous postings in this very long thread are, unfortunately, also no longer valid.

The #11 served me well for over a year and I was very happy using it. However, technology advances, and the "new" #11 and it's sister the #18 are, IMO, far inferior to the #16 which boasts more stable colors and many, many configuration possibilities. I believe the #11 has reached it's end-of-life and will no longer be sold as soon as the serious bugs currently present in the #18 are finally solved.

The #16 thread, which already has over 5400 posts, can be found by clicking here. I hope to see you over there soon
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Last edited by Isoprop; May 07, 2012 at 05:00 AM.
Old May 07, 2012, 05:35 AM
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10 Posts
I did receive a special cable for this NEW #11 and a normal cable. With the normal cable i can mount it as a logical drive in windows, with the special cable NOT! I did not test recording until memory card is full until now. I hope the NEW #11 does not have the BUGS of the #18.
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Old May 07, 2012, 08:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buglat View Post
I did receive a special cable for this NEW #11 and a normal cable. With the normal cable i can mount it as a logical drive in windows, with the special cable NOT! I did not test recording until memory card is full until now. I hope the NEW #11 does not have the BUGS of the #18.
The NEW #11 appears to treat the cables exactly the same as the OLD #11. The "special" cable (on the OLD #11) was designed for charging and recording with external USB power - you could not use the "special" cable to mount the camera as an external drive.

If the developer starts using the same libraries from the chip manufacturer as he does in the #18 firmware, then expect the same problems as the #18 has been having for the last month....

Unfortunately, it is impossible to know which firmware is installed in the #11 without taking an SPI dump or maybe dumping the memory via RS232, if those contacts are still available on the NEW #11.
I don't think anyone documented the serial port contacts on the OLD #11 so maybe now is the time to document them on the NEW #11/18 and help the developer find his (#18) bugs...

From Tom's picture on post #1 on the #18 thread, those three solder contacts next to the Novatek processor look very suspicious and could well be TX, RX, GND. I don't have a NEW #11 or a #18, so I can't check them.
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Old May 07, 2012, 09:48 AM
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Ireland, County Dublin, Dublin
Joined Mar 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Isoprop View Post
The NEW #11 appears to treat the cables exactly the same as the OLD #11. The "special" cable (on the OLD #11) was designed for charging and recording with external USB power - you could not use the "special" cable to mount the camera as an external drive.

If the developer starts using the same libraries from the chip manufacturer as he does in the #18 firmware, then expect the same problems as the #18 has been having for the last month....

Unfortunately, it is impossible to know which firmware is installed in the #11 without taking an SPI dump or maybe dumping the memory via RS232, if those contacts are still available on the NEW #11.
I don't think anyone documented the serial port contacts on the OLD #11 so maybe now is the time to document them on the NEW #11/18 and help the developer find his (#18) bugs...

From Tom's picture on post #1 on the #18 thread, those three solder contacts next to the Novatek processor look very suspicious and could well be TX, RX, GND. I don't have a NEW #11 or a #18, so I can't check them.
I received a new 11 the other day. I got one cable with it. It works fine for me. The difference I notice between the 11 and the 16 are:
(1) The colors are a little over saturated on the 11.
(2) The audio is stronger on the 11 thereby reducing the "white noise" in the background. However I get this slight "cracking sound" on the audio from time to time which is not on the 16.
(3) Also no settings on the 11.
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Old May 07, 2012, 10:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clarebanner View Post
I received a new 11 the other day. I got one cable with it. It works fine for me. The difference I notice between the 11 and the 16 are:
(1) The colors are a little over saturated on the 11.
(2) The audio is stronger on the 11 thereby reducing the "white noise" in the background. However I get this slight "cracking sound" on the audio from time to time which is not on the 16.
(3) Also no settings on the 11.
I don't think the audio will ever satisfy everyone. It just isn't HI-FI, but is as good as can be expected from these tiny cameras. Some cameras will always perform better than others, be it the #11, the #16 or the #18. The audio may also vary from camera to camera depending on the component tolerances. I know the #16 developer is still trying to find the optimal solution.

I'm surprised you only received one cable with your camera, or has the charging circuitry also been changed? Can you record, say, 2 hours of video using the supplied cable when connected to an external USB chârger? If you don't need long recording times this is obviously not important.

So, are the colors of the NEW #11 similar to the OLD #11 (Kodachrome)? Some people prefer these unnatural colors.
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Old May 07, 2012, 10:27 AM
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Ireland, County Dublin, Dublin
Joined Mar 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Isoprop View Post
I don't think the audio will ever satisfy everyone. It just isn't HI-FI, but is as good as can be expected from these tiny cameras. Some cameras will always perform better than others, be it the #11, the #16 or the #18. The audio may also vary from camera to camera depending on the component tolerances. I know the #16 developer is still trying to find the optimal solution.

I'm surprised you only received one cable with your camera, or has the charging circuitry also been changed? Can you record, say, 2 hours of video using the supplied cable when connected to an external USB chârger? If you don't need long recording times this is obviously not important.

So, are the colors of the NEW #11 similar to the OLD #11 (Kodachrome)? Some people prefer these unnatural colors.
I haven't tested it out recording over a long period . The colors are similar with the old 11 but I am impressed with the audio quality. I have done various tests if you want to have a sneak preview...

http://www.youtube.com/user/sentimen...e=results_main
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Old May 07, 2012, 11:44 AM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
United States, MA, Walpole
Joined Dec 2003
17,980 Posts
Does the new #11 produce corrupted files?

Quote:
Originally Posted by clarebanner View Post
I received a new 11 the other day. I got one cable with it. It works fine for me. The difference I notice between the 11 and the 16 are:
(1) The colors are a little over saturated on the 11.
(2) The audio is stronger on the 11 thereby reducing the "white noise" in the background. However I get this slight "cracking sound" on the audio from time to time which is not on the 16.
(3) Also no settings on the 11.
I don't have the new #11 either, but I do have the #18, and I think the circuit boards are identical. If the new #11 has colors the same as the #18, I agree they will still be over-saturated, but (hopefully) much more stable and not have that "shifting" issue. Then the saturation can be easily tweaked during editing.

The #18 sound most likely has the same issues since the circuit boards are identical. The "cracklink sound is most likely cause by clipping (over-driving) the electret microphone. Low frequency noise does this very easily (such as recording while driving with the camera mounted to the car). The road noise rumble, some of which is below audibility, is easily picked up by the electret and gives constant static in the sound. I also found speaking with the camera held very close to my eye while doing test recordings results in very garble speech. In short, the mic sensitivity is set too high and needs to be attentuated for AV use.

The big question is whether the #11 is also susceptible to the sudden file corruption that has been identified and easily replicated (with my #18) by simply pointing the camera at the ground, then swinging it up in about 1 sec. or less to point at nothing but sky (not at the sun!). This will corrupt the #18 recordings at least about 90% of the time. Does the new #11 also do this?

Since I don't have the #11, I can't support it either. So maybe it's time to shut down further posts to this thread.
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Old May 07, 2012, 02:30 PM
Just thumbing through...
victapilot's Avatar
United States, SC, Simpsonville
Joined Feb 2009
4,476 Posts
Why shut it down? Some folks still use it and may have questions. Let the community take care of that, if you personally have no further interest. On the other hand, the new camera seems quite different to the REAL #11...
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Old May 07, 2012, 03:40 PM
Bring It On !!!!!
soundcheque's Avatar
Newmarket, England.
Joined Aug 2006
689 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank View Post

Since I don't have the #11, I can't support it either. So maybe it's time to shut down further posts to this thread.
Would be a shame to shut it down Tom,,

Mainly due to the fact that the very first posts regarding these cameras certainly gives the impression that the Real #11 is the one to go for.

That's how it reads to me anyway

You also have links to the Ebay sellers who are supplying the #11
I bought mine just 2 weeks ago on the strength of this information in the first instance.

As the opening comments state, Read the posts 1 - 5,,, that's what I did and bought the Real #11 on the strength of that

You've done some excellent work here to provide massive information so all Kudos to you, be proud of what you have achieved here and as Victapilot says let the community take care of it. Naturally your commitment and info will still be regarded highly.
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Old May 07, 2012, 04:34 PM
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finster's Avatar
Michigan
Joined Feb 2006
502 Posts
I agree victapilot...the quality does look better than my old #11...nice job clarebanner on your #16 vs #11 comparison video both look real good and can hardly see a difference...lets hope the ground to sky issue is fixed on the new #11 and this will be a great camera...
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Old May 07, 2012, 05:42 PM
Just thumbing through...
victapilot's Avatar
United States, SC, Simpsonville
Joined Feb 2009
4,476 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by finster View Post
I agree victapilot...the quality does look better than my old #11...nice job clarebanner on your #16 vs #11 comparison video both look real good and can hardly see a difference...lets hope the ground to sky issue is fixed on the new #11 and this will be a great camera...
Yes, the video by clarebanner is very nice. Seems the greens are not as brilliant (unnatural), as is my older #11, and that is the Emerald Isle I suppose!
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Old May 07, 2012, 08:19 PM
Dance the skies...
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United States, MA, Walpole
Joined Dec 2003
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The problem with keeping this thread alive is that the early information is now obsolete and doesn't apply to the new #11 cameras. It would not be helpful to someone buying a new one... just adds confusion. It's not something I want to try and remedy. If the thread is shut down, it is still readable, just not postable. There really should be a new thread started for the new #11... who wants to step up to the plate?
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Old May 07, 2012, 08:42 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
United States, MA, Walpole
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Quote:
Originally Posted by soundcheque View Post
Would be a shame to shut it down Tom,,

Mainly due to the fact that the very first posts regarding these cameras certainly gives the impression that the Real #11 is the one to go for.

That's how it reads to me anyway
But those early posts are almost 1-1/2 years old, and there in lies the problem. The #11 camera has evolved, making the early info obsolete... even the Ebay sellers are different now. And other more capable cameras are now available and still increasing in their abilities. A new thread is needed...
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Old May 07, 2012, 09:09 PM
Just thumbing through...
victapilot's Avatar
United States, SC, Simpsonville
Joined Feb 2009
4,476 Posts
Tom, I'm sure I'm not alone in applauding your support and dedication to the users of this camera.

Why not leave the thread open, just like the Mega thread, but add a note to the early posts to clarify that they are specific to the 2010-2011 vintage. That would allow current users to still share info, you could still chime in as you sometimes still do on the Mega thread
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Old May 07, 2012, 11:06 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
United States, MA, Walpole
Joined Dec 2003
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Quote:
Originally Posted by victapilot View Post
Tom, I'm sure I'm not alone in applauding your support and dedication to the users of this camera.

Why not leave the thread open, just like the Mega thread, but add a note to the early posts to clarify that they are specific to the 2010-2011 vintage. That would allow current users to still share info, you could still chime in as you sometimes still do on the Mega thread
I'll give it a shot, but will rely on others to provide the ongoing support and to keep the thread from evolving into some way off-topic rambling blog!

I'll post a heads-up in the first thread, but as many of you know, a lot of new users don't bother to read them, so be ready to field the questions.

Tom
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Old May 08, 2012, 03:26 AM
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"NOTE: POSTS #1-#5 ARE NO LONGER BEING UPDATED BY YOURS TRULY AS OF 05/07/2012. THE ORIGINAL #11 WAS A LATE 2010 VINTAGE CAMERA AND HAS NOW BEEN TOTALLY RE-DESIGNED WITH A DIFFERENT CIRCUIT BOARD (EASILY DIFFERENTIATED BY THE THINNER 8-WIRE MINI-USB PLUG) , DIFFERENT CABLES, A SLIGHTLY DIFFERENT (THICKER) CASE, AND MOST IMPORTANT, DIFFERENT FIRMWARE! AS SUCH, MUCH OF THIS EARLY INFORMATION, ESPECIALLY THE FIRMWARE, IS NO LONGER APPLICABLE TO THE LATEST DESIGN! THIS THREAD IS BEING KEPT OPEN FOR ON-GOING DISCUSSION AND WILL BE SUPPORTED MOSTLY BY OTHER MEMBERS HERE WHO FREQUENT THIS THREAD AND ARE STILL USING THE #11 CAMERA. ENJOY!"

Tom,

The 11 Camera I received uses just one USB cable which I also use on my 16.
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Old May 08, 2012, 08:01 AM
Just thumbing through...
victapilot's Avatar
United States, SC, Simpsonville
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank View Post
I'll give it a shot, but will rely on others to provide the ongoing support and to keep the thread from evolving into some way off-topic rambling blog!

I'll post a heads-up in the first thread, but as many of you know, a lot of new users don't bother to read them, so be ready to field the questions.

Tom
Thanks Tom, that will help!
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Old May 08, 2012, 01:28 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
United States, MA, Walpole
Joined Dec 2003
17,980 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by clarebanner View Post
"NOTE: POSTS #1-#5 ARE NO LONGER BEING UPDATED BY YOURS TRULY AS OF 05/07/2012. THE ORIGINAL #11 WAS A LATE 2010 VINTAGE CAMERA AND HAS NOW BEEN TOTALLY RE-DESIGNED WITH A DIFFERENT CIRCUIT BOARD (EASILY DIFFERENTIATED BY THE THINNER 8-WIRE MINI-USB PLUG) , DIFFERENT CABLES, A SLIGHTLY DIFFERENT (THICKER) CASE, AND MOST IMPORTANT, DIFFERENT FIRMWARE! AS SUCH, MUCH OF THIS EARLY INFORMATION, ESPECIALLY THE FIRMWARE, IS NO LONGER APPLICABLE TO THE LATEST DESIGN! THIS THREAD IS BEING KEPT OPEN FOR ON-GOING DISCUSSION AND WILL BE SUPPORTED MOSTLY BY OTHER MEMBERS HERE WHO FREQUENT THIS THREAD AND ARE STILL USING THE #11 CAMERA. ENJOY!"

Tom,

The 11 Camera I received uses just one USB cable which I also use on my 16.
Then you don't have the newer model. The seller must have the old model still in inventory to clear out before changing to the new model. Just a guess...
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Old May 09, 2012, 10:47 AM
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Joined Apr 2012
10 Posts
as far i can say i am almost happy with the NEW #11. the only disadvantages i found is

Microphon is now more in the INSIDE instead behind the original microphone hole in the case, in my opinion sound is not as clear as on old #11

the boot time (blinking two times, instead of one time) is a disadvantage. it takes longer now for the camera to be ready. that was one great feature of the old #11 it was fast powered on if needed.

except for the new micro usb plug and the possibility to change the battery fast (+ for me) it should be almost the same resulting quality as on old #11.

but even the normal cable seems to be different. i have another which was shipped EXACTLY with the same micro usb cable like the NEW #11. I tried THIS cable and the NEW #11 DID NOT DO ANYTHING. No red light charging, no usb drive mounting nothing. but the cable DOES work for the OTHER device.

So i here have now THREE exactly looking like 8pin Micro USB Cables. I think it is time to sign them all
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Old May 09, 2012, 12:28 PM
Just thumbing through...
victapilot's Avatar
United States, SC, Simpsonville
Joined Feb 2009
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Looks like the #11 is evolving, hopefully for the better! The new #15 (see Mega thread) is setting a price point at $25, but is not a good choice for video.
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Old May 10, 2012, 03:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buglat View Post
.....
but even the normal cable seems to be different. i have another which was shipped EXACTLY with the same micro usb cable like the NEW #11. I tried THIS cable and the NEW #11 DID NOT DO ANYTHING. No red light charging, no usb drive mounting nothing. but the cable DOES work for the OTHER device.

So i here have now THREE exactly looking like 8pin Micro USB Cables. I think it is time to sign them all
The 8-pin mini-USB is not standardized, so the the pins can be connected any way the manufacturer decides. Of course, this can be dangerous. You always run the risk of destroying your device if you use a cable not designed for the device. It certainly is time to mark your cables! Be warned
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Old May 10, 2012, 07:23 PM
CURIOSITY Has Landed!
Fugitive_Bill's Avatar
Sydney, Australia
Joined Jul 2005
1,178 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Isoprop View Post
The 8-pin mini-USB is not standardized, so the the pins can be connected any way the manufacturer decides. Of course, this can be dangerous. You always run the risk of destroying your device if you use a cable not designed for the device. It certainly is time to mark your cables! Be warned
ISO, That is a VERY GOOD WARNING
Everyone should take notice and label all those funny little cables.
I have been doing so using my DYMO Label Maker for about a year now.
(well about the time I got my first few #3 cam's and kept mixing cables up with the Kodak still camera cables)
And of course you don't have to ask WHY!!! (POP - Magic smoke)-LOL
B!LL!
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Old May 10, 2012, 09:27 PM
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United States, CA, Morro Bay
Joined May 2012
74 Posts
New 808 HD #11 from hxelepro360 won't power on

OK I'm new with the cam thing, but got the cam supposedly (flashed?) with the no date/time. Charged cam yesterday and my new Micro SDHC Class 10 card arrived today. I inserted the card and pressed power button and cam won't power up. Read through all the help me files and tried all the resets etc to no avail.

Now I see everyone talking about the files on the card, well of course my new card came empty so there is no files? What am I doing wrong here or did I receivea bricked cam?

Cam plugs into usb port and the red light comes on fine and it was fully charged until the red light went off. That's as fa as I can get. Any help?
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Last edited by firedude52; May 10, 2012 at 09:45 PM.
Old May 10, 2012, 09:38 PM
Just thumbing through...
victapilot's Avatar
United States, SC, Simpsonville
Joined Feb 2009
4,476 Posts
When the cam is turned on it creates a directory, but no files. Is your card inserted correctly, gold pins up, towards the button side?
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Old May 10, 2012, 09:40 PM
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United States, CA, Morro Bay
Joined May 2012
74 Posts
Card is in correctly, the problem is as stated the cam won't turn on. All I get is the red solid light when plugged into the usb posrt
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