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Old Jun 14, 2011, 09:00 AM
KC
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Originally Posted by reptor
What hardware you use for FPV? This #11 Key Cam and what else? How do you connect if this cam doesn't have video OUT?
Can anyone answer on this?

thanks
This was discussed a few pages back.

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...postcount=4641

Two cameras are used. One for the FPV and the #11 is just along for the ride.

Discussion about FPV equipment in this thread is probably not appropriate.

KC
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Old Jun 14, 2011, 09:41 AM
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Originally Posted by reptor View Post
What hardware you use for FPV? This #11 Key Cam and what else? How do you connect if this cam doesn't have video OUT?
Reptor, please use PM for FPV discussion. He said several posts back he used two cameras... the #11 only took the video record... not part of FPV.
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Old Jun 14, 2011, 09:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Isoprop View Post
Please don't be discouraged by the non-techies .
I, for one, find your tests just as interesting as the flight videos and thank you for sharing. For me, they are not boring at all! - Actually they are quite exciting!

I would do the capacitor swap without hesitation, but since I don't want any sound on my videos there's not much point! Also, I would first have to buy a "book" (set) of SMD capacitors to play with.

I also love you supply voltage test!

Your tests help us understand the #11 much better and maybe even inspire the manufacturer.

OK, I guess we're in the minority here... ... but should you make any other amazing #11 tests, please do post the results.
Yes, by all means. This thread is for all things about the #11HD, including intricate repairs, tests, and hacks! Videos are interesting and appropriate, too, but I'd add the topic of the forum is RC aerial photography, so I'd like videos to focus on RC plane clips, aerial or ground, shot with the #11HD camera. Comparisons with other new small HD cameras suitable for instaling on an RC plane are good as well, as long as the discussion doesn't migrate to the other cameras.
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Old Jun 14, 2011, 10:17 AM
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Here is my #11 camera vid from my Parkzone Radian on Sunday morning. Any suggestions as to why the video "slows" at about the 4:12 minute?

http://www.youtube.com/user/78bgalle.../0/u7T_yWmqZnE
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Old Jun 14, 2011, 10:26 AM
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Originally Posted by geives1 View Post
Here is my #11 camera vid from my Parkzone Radian on Sunday morning. Any suggestions as to why the video "slows" at about the 4:12 minute?

http://www.youtube.com/user/78bgalle.../0/u7T_yWmqZnE
Your link doesn't work.
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Old Jun 14, 2011, 10:44 AM
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Is this your vid?

Radian (14 min 9 sec)
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Old Jun 14, 2011, 10:50 AM
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Hello all

This is a follow-up to post #4371 on page 292 addressing the problems many users have had with 'clipping' audio (sharp clicks and pops) when recording with the 808 #11.
It is caused due to variations in low-frequency air pressure, and is normally encountered in a moving car enviroment or caused by wind (in flight on a RC plane for example).

I'll split this into two posts, starting with a description of the nine pictures shown in the collage attached to this post.

1 This is a diagram of the electret microphone circuit, showing the biasing, decoupling and supply splitting arrangement.
You will notice the very high value of the microphone decoupling capacitor : 1.5uf (circled in red) - this is what we need to change.

2 A close-up of the PCB showing the location of the components depicted in the circuit diagram, figure 1.
These are outlined in the same colours for easy reference / identification.

3 A size comparision of the 1.5uf capacitor against a peppercorn and a grain of sugar.

4 Measuring the value of the audio decoupling capacitor using a digital capacitance meter - coming in at a huge 1.504uf.
This value is excessive in the extreme and will allow very low frequency and sub-sonic audio to be amplified and digitised, causing clipping.

5 & 6 The 1.5uf capacitor was removed and two single wire stands were seperated from an off-cut of hookup wire.
Holding the PVC sleeving, these were then soldered to points A and B (see figure 2), so I could test different values.

7 This shows a test capacitor soldered in place - in this instance, a 470nf was been 'auditioned'.

8 & 9 Showing the finally selected value of 220nf soldered in place on the PCB - plus the addition of a small jumper wire.
I decided to use a phsically larger capacitor than the original type, because I couldn't find one that small and even if I could find one, I wouldn't be able to solder it in place !

In the next post is a description of the test, the different capacitor values tested and the results, plus two videos - before and after.

Richard


Thanks for the info and time you took to do this Richard, its priceless.

It's very so much more rewarding and interesting when we can take the solutions to RC issues to a higher notch than just give up on a product.

Your bench testing, mods and info is very much appreciated.

Thanks!
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Old Jun 14, 2011, 10:58 AM
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Love This Little Gizmo

Got my #11 Jumbo (Post 2, last picture, 4-5 o'clock position) in the mail yesterday (ordered from hxelepro on eBay on June 3rd). I, too, had an initial problem getting my PC (Windows XP) to recognize the camera. But once I had it charging for an hour and switched to the short USB cable (which, I believe, allows charging and camera operation at the same time), my PC recognized the camera and I was off and running. I saved the microSDHC card which came with the camera (so I could always go back to it, if needed).

I formatted a new Transcend 4 GB, Class 4 card with the SDFormatter V3.0 software and checked it for errors using the h2testw V1.4 software. I then loaded the V2 firmware (Time-Date with Blocking) unto the card and put the card into the camera. It loaded fine, so I removed the card and erased the .bin file from the card. Put the card back into the camera and took my first video (feeding my pups a treat).

I was able to copy the .MOV file to my PC, convert it to .avi file using MP4Cam2AVI V2.83 with the ffdshow codex, and edit/trick it out with MS Movie Maker. Turned out great (if you ignore my poor first time camera work).

So, all the software and all the instructions I needed are found in posts 1-5 at the start of this thread. This was my first experience with a cam and I couldn't have been successful without this thread. Thank you one and all!

Rick
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Old Jun 14, 2011, 11:02 AM
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Originally Posted by timetec View Post
I'm going to 'lie low' now - agreed, far too much boring technical stuff, advice and pictures...

Good luck all, Richard
Don't lie low Richard, we're just joking around. Actually your posts are very informative but far above my head (ask Tom he knows about my head )

Learning the keyfobs nuances and how to try to overcome them is a big part of this thread and what it was started for.

SCOPE ON (!), even if I don't understand it.

Yabba
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Old Jun 14, 2011, 11:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KC View Post

........and the #11 is just along for the ride.

Discussion about FPV equipment in this thread is probably not appropriate.

KC
Correct and agreed.

Yabba
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Old Jun 14, 2011, 11:51 AM
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Yup, that is my vid

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Originally Posted by KC View Post
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Old Jun 14, 2011, 12:00 PM
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Originally Posted by geives1 View Post
Yup, that is my vid
The brief pause you mentioned is a typical effect of dropped frames, but this camera does not normally do that. The rest of your video looked smooth, so must have been something that affected the recording briefly. Could be an issue with the flash memory card. I'd suggest reformatting it using the SDformatter utility, then running an integrity check with the h2testw utility.

If you had posted your video on vimeo.com instead of YouTube I could download your original and look at that section of the clip for a better determination of dropped frames. I assume it shows up on your original as well as on the re-encoded YouTube clip.
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Old Jun 14, 2011, 12:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Isoprop View Post
Please don't be discouraged by the non-techies .
I, for one, find your tests just as interesting as the flight videos and thank you for sharing. For me, they are not boring at all! - Actually they are quite exciting!

I would do the capacitor swap without hesitation, but since I don't want any sound on my videos there's not much point! Also, I would first have to buy a "book" (set) of SMD capacitors to play with.

I also love you supply voltage test!

Your tests help us understand the #11 much better and maybe even inspire the manufacturer.

OK, I guess we're in the minority here... ... but should you make any other amazing #11 tests, please do post the results.
agreed the more tests the merrier it all adds interest.
Mike
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Old Jun 14, 2011, 12:51 PM
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Originally Posted by geives1 View Post
Yup, that is my vid
This one is not 720p...
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Old Jun 14, 2011, 01:47 PM
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Originally Posted by reptor View Post
This one is not 720p...
But judged by the orange time/date in the lower right corner, it IS an #11 video. My guess: edited and saved at a lower resolution.

Looks like it was edited with Windows Movie Maker. Use these settings: Resolution should be 1280*720, 30fps, 16:9 ratio. In my case the settings are good when you select something which says something like 'recommended for this project', at the top of the list (followed by HD 1080, computer, burn DVD etc.)
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Old Jun 14, 2011, 04:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timetec View Post
Try this procedure (leave the cable attached between the camera and the PC) :

Briefly press the rear button to switch the camera on as normal.

Usually, the yellow LED blinks twice before it enters standby or file transfer mode (as when connected to a PC).

As soon as the LED comes on for the first time, press & hold the front button down for 4 seconds - longer is OK.

Good luck all, Richard
Well, it worked once. Then the next two times I plugged the camera in, it worked without any special button pressing. But this morning, it's back to its old self and not even the button press between flashes will bring it up. Sadly, I give up and am sending it back.

The vendor, hxelepro360, has been very helpful and solicitous.
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Old Jun 14, 2011, 04:08 PM
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Yup, I used Windows movie Maker & yes I saved at a lower resolution when I edited. Just quicker to upload to YouTube that way. But that same little blip happened in the original before I edited it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by wfvn View Post
But judged by the orange time/date in the lower right corner, it IS an #11 video. My guess: edited and saved at a lower resolution.

Looks like it was edited with Windows Movie Maker. Use these settings: Resolution should be 1280*720, 30fps, 16:9 ratio. In my case the settings are good when you select something which says something like 'recommended for this project', at the top of the list (followed by HD 1080, computer, burn DVD etc.)
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Old Jun 14, 2011, 05:10 PM
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Originally Posted by geives1 View Post
Yup, I used Windows movie Maker & yes I saved at a lower resolution when I edited. Just quicker to upload to YouTube that way. But that same little blip happened in the original before I edited it.
The smaller frame size and/or lower resolution might save you some time, but it defeats the purpose, doesn't it? We'd like to see your vids in all their HD radiant glory and detail. I just start an upload, then go grab a cold one and come back a bit later...
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Old Jun 14, 2011, 09:08 PM
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can you guys critique this video. It seems to have lost some quality. I will double check the WLMM settings, but I think I saved it as 1280x720.

It also has a section of the pic that is out of focuse, like the whole upper left quadrant, is there any way to fix this? The center and near right seems ok. For flying, I will most likely adjust focus closer to infinity than it is now.

The 2nd #11 does not have these issues. Sorry its not flight, but I guess its ok to break the trend every once in a while.

Mid-Ohio June 2011. Sat Qualify HD sample 808 #11 keycam (4 min 38 sec)


Pat

edit, p.s. based on retracing my click, I think I might have selected the 1080p save selection.... would that explain what looks like a loss of quality on the vimeo post??

But vimeo says its a WMM file that is 1280x720>? so I have no idea. It's definately not as good as original on my screen.


Thanks for comments.
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Old Jun 14, 2011, 09:26 PM
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Originally Posted by wheelspinner20 View Post
can you guys critique this video. It seems to have lost some quality. I will double check the WLMM settings, but I think I saved it as 1280x720.

It also has a section of the pic that is out of focuse, like the whole upper left quadrant, is there any way to fix this? The center and near right seems ok. For flying, I will most likely adjust focus closer to infinity than it is now.

The 2nd #11 does not have these issues. Sorry its not flight, but I guess its ok to break the trend every once in a while.


Pat

edit, p.s. based on retracing my click, I think I might have selected the 1080p save selection.... would that explain what looks like a loss of quality on the vimeo post??

Thanks for comments.
Awesome open-wheel racing Pat, love it, nice clips.
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Old Jun 14, 2011, 09:36 PM
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Thanks. I work on them and help the team, but I don't drive.

Looking through the vimeo link, it's difficult to see the lens anomolies. Why is the date so fuzzy. Its very clear on the original.

P
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Old Jun 14, 2011, 10:14 PM
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I'm the guy who drove number 25 car and i wonder why your driver not allow me to pass him?
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Old Jun 14, 2011, 10:20 PM
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Quote:
I'm the guy who drove number 25 car and i wonder why your driver not allow me to pass him?
They are both my drivers, they are brothers actually.! which explains the over-aggressive bump(slam) drafting!

Wow meez, you traveled from malaysia to ohio for a race last weekend?? Thats an expensive plaque and handshake!

It was qualifying, excessive passing only slows you down.!
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Old Jun 14, 2011, 11:46 PM
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Meanwhile.... back on topic...

Wheelspinner, thanks for uploading your clip to Vimeo where your original upload can be downloaded. I retrieved your original from Vimeo, and it is a 1280x720 frame size video. BUT, if you look more closely, your image does not fill the whole frame like it should. Both the image and the frame are 16:9 aspect ratio, but the image is smaller than the frame. I think that is one reason for the lower image quality you see. Keep in mind that your upload to any of the free hosting site is not displayed in the same form as received. The site re-encodes your file into Adobe Flash Player format, and also lowers the bit rate at the same time to save some file space and make playback easier. The net result is your video gets downgraded... there is nothing you can do about that... they all do it.

But that aside, how did your upload get into the strange reduced image condition? Here's what (I think) you did. Open WLMM and toggle to the Project menu. You should see something like the first pic below. Note that the aspect ratio is set for "Standard (4:3)", which is the wrong frame shape for your HD video. It needs to be set to "Widescreen (16:9). When you use the wrong frame aspect ratio, your video is forced to have black bars above and below the image to make it into 4:3 aspect ratio shape as shown in the picture.

Then when you select one of the 1280x720 frame size options for outputting your final video, WLMM fits the 4:3 aspect ratio frame into the 16:9 1280x720 frame size as best it can, which matches the vertical height before it reaches the full width. So now your video also has black bars on the sides as well as on top and bottom. The net effect is that your original 1280x720 video image is now shrunk down with black border all around to fill up the final 1280x720 frame, as shown in the second pic below! And when that is re-encoded by the web site, you lose more detail.

I don't know if I explained it very well, but here's the bottom line. Make sure you have the "Widescreen (16:9)" set for the movie aspect ratio in the Project Menu as I first mentioned. Then your final movie will fill the full 1280x720 frame when it is saved. And since the #11 shoots at about a 7000 kbps minimum average bit rate, pick one of the movie options when you save it that has a similar bit rate. You can make a custom one like I did for the #11HD with 1280x720 frame size, 7000 kbps bit rate, and 30 fps frame rate. Then just use that each time with this camera and you'll get good results.
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Old Jun 15, 2011, 04:21 AM
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Has anyone tested one of these. It doesn't seem to comply with all the HD features but is it any good? I can't find any reviews.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Mini-DVR-U8-US...-/120705870124
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Old Jun 15, 2011, 09:07 AM
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A few posts back HypoThermia, Ian, posted about NTSC to PAL conversion for using the video files to make a DVD.

He gave me a very short sample video, with very high motion, so I can test with my programs.

I just made some tests.
I used:

* Cyberlink Power Director 9
* Corel Video Studio Pro X4

http://hotfile.com/dl/120650343/1627...l_dvd.zip.html

I could use the files to the Ulead (Corel now) DVD Movie Factory 6 so to make a DVD. But they are too small sized for a DVD (it must be at least 1GB so to be compliant with all players).

I do not have a DVD authoring program that handles H.264 videos directly. My old Movie Factory cannot.
But I`m pretty sure that the new version can do what Video Studio Pro X4 did, plus the authoring. So you may use/need only one program.
It does some trimming also, if it is needed.
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Old Jun 15, 2011, 10:37 AM
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Originally Posted by mixer421 View Post
Has anyone tested one of these. It doesn't seem to comply with all the HD features but is it any good? I can't find any reviews.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Mini-DVR-U8-US...-/120705870124
It's not HD. Try the "Mega Keychain" thread for possible user feedback.
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Old Jun 15, 2011, 06:25 PM
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Quote:
I don't know if I explained it very well, but here's the bottom line.
Outstanding Tom, thanks.

I tried to pull up that project and changed the aspect ratio setting. It doesnt want to save it again so I am going to start over and see what happens.

Thanks for the help.

Pat
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Old Jun 15, 2011, 07:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wheelspinner20 View Post
can you guys critique this video. It seems to have lost some quality. I will double check the WLMM settings, but I think I saved it as 1280x720.

It also has a section of the pic that is out of focuse, like the whole upper left quadrant, is there any way to fix this? The center and near right seems ok. For flying, I will most likely adjust focus closer to infinity than it is now.

The 2nd #11 does not have these issues. Sorry its not flight, but I guess its ok to break the trend every once in a while.

http://vimeo.com/25059478

Pat

edit, p.s. based on retracing my click, I think I might have selected the 1080p save selection.... would that explain what looks like a loss of quality on the vimeo post??

But vimeo says its a WMM file that is 1280x720>? so I have no idea. It's definately not as good as original on my screen.


Thanks for comments.
Very cool, I used to race Mid-Ohio in my GT1 Camaro. It brought back memories.

It looks like your focus needs adjusting to a little further away. The fin on the race car is in perfect focus. How to focus is posted in the first few posts.

The transcoding also may have degraded the picture quality.

Bill
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Last edited by Prof100; Jun 15, 2011 at 10:15 PM.
Old Jun 15, 2011, 08:47 PM
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Thanks

Quote:
Originally Posted by wheelspinner20 View Post
can you guys critique this video. It seems to have lost some quality. I will double check the WLMM settings, but I think I saved it as 1280x720.

It also has a section of the pic that is out of focuse, like the whole upper left quadrant, is there any way to fix this? The center and near right seems ok. For flying, I will most likely adjust focus closer to infinity than it is now.

The 2nd #11 does not have these issues. Sorry its not flight, but I guess its ok to break the trend every once in a while.

http://vimeo.com/25059478

Pat

edit, p.s. based on retracing my click, I think I might have selected the 1080p save selection.... would that explain what looks like a loss of quality on the vimeo post??

But vimeo says its a WMM file that is 1280x720>? so I have no idea. It's definately not as good as original on my screen.


Thanks for comments.
SORRY TOM.
I used to race VEE,s at WATERFORD HILLS and MOSPORT in the late 70,s early 80,s, LYNX B.
Thanks for the memorys.

RUD
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Old Jun 15, 2011, 09:33 PM
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Originally Posted by RUDDERLESS View Post


SORRY TOM.
I used to race VEE,s at WATERFORD HILLS and MOSPORT in the late 70,s early 80,s, LYNX B.
Thanks for the memorys.

RUD
Please use PM for off topic discussion. Thanks.
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Old Jun 15, 2011, 10:31 PM
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Sorry for the distraction.... I was always one of those kids in class....

Tom, I changed the aspect ratio in the Project view, re-did the video, and I think I have the same exact result.

I won't post the link to the 2nd vid, if you want to check to verify no change in outcome, you can just go back to the other one and click on it in my video collection.

I think I now regret signing up for the plus membership.!

I remember your brief bike video ( we also do bike tours) its clarity, even online, seemed to be exactly as viewing off of the camera? How many pages back do I need to go to find that site? Don't know the term to search for otherwise I would.

Pat
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Old Jun 15, 2011, 10:55 PM
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I would like to make a custom case for my camera and angle the camera down for better shooting in flight. Has anyone done this?

I took it apart and took the screws out of the board, but it seems the camera itself is glued into the case. Is there a good way to get it out? I don't want to break it.
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Old Jun 15, 2011, 11:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ca323 View Post
I would like to make a custom case for my camera and angle the camera down for better shooting in flight. Has anyone done this?

I took it apart and took the screws out of the board, but it seems the camera itself is glued into the case. Is there a good way to get it out? I don't want to break it.
The glue in my #11 cam is rather soft. I can pull it out of the glue without any problems. Mind the ribbon cable! Dont damage it.

When the camera is out of the housing, you can get the glue out with pliers, pin etc. Re-use the glue by putting it on the point of a nail, heat it (it's hot glue) and put the drop of glue where you took it from, back in the housing, replace the camera (in your case a presumably modified housing so the cam points downward.
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Old Jun 16, 2011, 12:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ca323 View Post
I would like to make a custom case for my camera and angle the camera down for better shooting in flight. Has anyone done this?

I took it apart and took the screws out of the board, but it seems the camera itself is glued into the case. Is there a good way to get it out? I don't want to break it.
I just tape a foam wedge to the normal case, then attach the wedge to the plane... much easier, I think, but maybe yours is meant to be a more permanent mount than mine.
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Old Jun 16, 2011, 12:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wheelspinner20 View Post
...

I remember your brief bike video ( we also do bike tours) its clarity, even online, seemed to be exactly as viewing off of the camera? How many pages back do I need to go to find that site? Don't know the term to search for otherwise I would.

Pat
I think you mean this one?

A tip. Use the "search this thread" link, then select "advanced search" to get a more definitive seach box. Put my user name "tom frank" in the user field, and the work "bike" in the key word field. You'll get just two hits, with the one I linked above being the first one. Quite fast by that method.

BUT, that video is not on the Vimeo web site, but rather exposureroom.com, which has even better video quality. But that site is intended more for semi-pro and very serious videographers, not hacks like us, so I don't direct anyone there normally and only use it when I really want to upload a video and my one per week limit for HD uploads has already been used at Vimeo.com.
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Old Jun 16, 2011, 12:36 AM
Dance the skies...
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United States, MA, Walpole
Joined Dec 2003
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wheelspinner20 View Post
...
Tom, I changed the aspect ratio in the Project view, re-did the video, and I think I have the same exact result.

I won't post the link to the 2nd vid, if you want to check to verify no change in outcome, you can just go back to the other one and click on it in my video collection.

I think I now regret signing up for the plus membership.!

Pat
Your second video does have the same reduced size image as the first, but in a 1280 x720 frame. Does the video look like this when you play it locally on your PC? If it doesn't and fills the entire 1280 frame with no black borders, then there is really something strange going on. If it plays locally with the black borders, then you are still doing something strange. There's no way I know to save a video from WLMM with black borders like yours other than the way I mentioned.

Also, when I do a "save as" to download your upload, the file requester for renaming the file shows your video with an .asx extension, not .wmv. The .asx file is a Windows Media Player play list file extension! Does your file have a .wmv extension when you upload it? What profile method are you using to save the video? If Vimeo is creating this problem, they will certainly want to know about it and are usually very responsive to user email.
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Old Jun 16, 2011, 10:19 AM
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Brazil, SP, São Paulo
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Bought a #11 from hxelepro360 and after the brilliant work of Brazilian post office, it arrived 2 days ago after 1 month sitting in Customs.
I promised Diana I would leave a few good words about it, and I can't complain about the camera and her service.

Although it looks cheap (and indeed it is), the overall quality is better than I expected, including the internal parts and components.

FW upgraded to continuous recording and no date stamp, followed tutorial included in the file and it worked great.

But the camera went for a dive and it's not working anymore, hehehehe...
I attached the camera to my puppy dog and played with her a little... she went for some food and the camera fell into the water bowl... hahahaha... and it wasn't even recording, else I'd have a great shot of a diving cam...

I left it dry but it's not working anymore. It can be charged and turned on/off, but don't do anything else (not even the card reader is recognized).

By the way, I asked about rotating the lenses a few pages ago (twisting the lens/image sensor in 90º if you're looking straight to the front of the camera) and I realized it can't be done, the data ribbon is too short to allow rotation. It should be longer or replaced by wires.

Bought a "JUMBO" to test (black, BMW logo), it's going to my helmet (main priority) and I'll buy another regular #11 for my heli.

"Ture lens", according to Diana are 720p lenses. Don't know what it means, I don't know if there are specific lenses for 720p (don't think so).
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Old Jun 16, 2011, 10:56 AM
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Chilliwack, BC Canada
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank View Post
I think you mean this one?

A tip. Use the "search this thread" link, then select "advanced search" to get a more definitive seach box. Put my user name "tom frank" in the user field, and the work "bike" in the key word field. You'll get just two hits, with the one I linked above being the first one. Quite fast by that method.

BUT, that video is not on the Vimeo web site, but rather exposureroom.com, which has even better video quality. But that site is intended more for semi-pro and very serious videographers, not hacks like us, so I don't direct anyone there normally and only use it when I really want to upload a video and my one per week limit for HD uploads has already been used at Vimeo.com.
HI,

I have a question about the video comparing the original #11 video to the results of running it through a couple of editors. I notice that both of the edited versions seem sharper than the original, particularly the one done with Magix. Does the Magix editor have a adjustable sharpening function? The results make it look well worth the $65.

Regards,
Gord
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Old Jun 16, 2011, 11:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gordks View Post
HI,

I have a question about the video comparing the original #11 video to the results of running it through a couple of editors. I notice that both of the edited versions seem sharper than the original, particularly the one done with Magix. Does the Magix editor have a adjustable sharpening function? The results make it look well worth the $65.

Regards,
Gord
Hi Gord,
Yes, MAGIX does have a user adjustable sharpening filter, and so do the freeware AviDemux and VirtualDub editors (but those two lack many other features obviously). I always sharpen my videos when editing... it makes them look so much better (to my eye), as does toning down the saturation and backing off the contrast a notch.

Recently I've been trying the VideoPad editor (free fully functional trial download, like MAGIX) which sells for about the same price as MAGIX MEP17+. It is easier to use than MAGIX and has some nice features, but not quite up to MAGIX in that regard (especially the titling ability). It has built in adjustable sharpen filter, but it is very sensitive. However, it can use all the Vdub filters, including the less sensitive sharpen filter and one that can reduce the central "hotspot" and vignetting in the #11 video. It works quite well. MAGIX does the latter, too, but can not only adjust the vignetting brightness, but also the color balance.
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Old Jun 16, 2011, 11:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rtogami View Post
...
I attached the camera to my puppy dog and played with her a little... she went for some food and the camera fell into the water bowl... hahahaha... and it wasn't even recording, else I'd have a great shot of a diving cam...

I left it dry but it's not working anymore. It can be charged and turned on/off, but don't do anything else (not even the card reader is recognized).
...
The battery is still connected and supplying power to the camera, even when not turned on, to keep the internal clock powered unfortunately. So, you may have zapped some components with the dunking. But I totally submerged one of my different cameras while it was recording, and although I lost that recording, it still functioned fine after drying it out. So before you give up, try all the tips in the FAQs for bringing a non-functional camera back to life. I'd at least try using the reset, including when connected to USB, flashing in firmware again, and even disconnecting/reconnecting the battery. You never know... it may still function.
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Old Jun 16, 2011, 01:30 PM
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USA, CA, San Diego 92120
Joined Oct 2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rtogami View Post
..

"Ture lens", according to Diana are 720p lenses. Don't know what it means, I don't know if there are specific lenses for 720p (don't think so).
rto..
I sincerely hope you retrieve something off the microSD chip and your cam comes back to life..also hope Diana can repair it too if that fails.. btw.. I asked the same about the lens .. and she told me a "Ture Lens" was actually a typo for "True HD Lens" JimS
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Old Jun 16, 2011, 01:41 PM
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Brazil, SP, São Paulo
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Hey, thanks for the support! :-)

I haven't gave up yet, but chances are it's really gone... tried everything on the FAQ (reset, reset with USB cable, I'll try to cut the battery, haven't tried it yet...). I'm not that sad, anyway, what I really wanted to do was twist the lens/image sensor... just a bit upset for having to wait another month to get a new camera!

The mSD is fine, it's still working and passed h2testw more than 2 times.

Well, I'll be more careful next time!
If it returns to life, I'll let you know...
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Old Jun 16, 2011, 04:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank View Post
I think it is likely a coincidence, but you still can flash in the Release 1 firmware to check the charging function. The camera will still work, only the video frame size will be very small (320x240). You can flash back in Release 2 firmware to restore normal operation afterwards.
OK, thanks for the tip.
I did that and expectedly it did not change anything. Well, it looks like my battery is toasted... at least it still works long enough to be able to flash the firmware

I have a question : has anybody had success with the special cable, an external battery AND a standard USB extension cable in between ? the provided special cable is so small it's hardly usable.
I tried that once to no avail and just after my USB extension cable was dead. I'm pretty sure it worked before this test. Or maybe is it yet another coincidence
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Old Jun 16, 2011, 04:33 PM
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United States, CA, San Ramon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 0xfeedbabef00d View Post
I have a question : has anybody had success with the special cable, an external battery AND a standard USB extension cable in between ? the provided special cable is so small it's hardly usable.
It has to go camera > special cable > any standard USB extension cable > any powered usb port (battery/computer/hub etc.) and it will work just fine. The only reason the special cable is there is to have a special connector pinout for the camera, anything you plug into the other end will work just fine provided the camera gets power through it.
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Old Jun 16, 2011, 10:37 PM
called into work, I'm AIRSICK!
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Oregon
Joined Jan 2009
541 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank View Post
2. Continuous Recording & Remove Time: This is suppose to remove the time stamp and enable recording to continue without stopping until the flash memory card is full or the 4GB file size limit of the FAT32 file system is reached. With the latter, the recording will stop, saving the file to the flash card. It is suppose to then continue with a new 4GB file, but this part is currently non-functional. It will be fixed soon to continue with a new recording. .
Hi Tom,

Great job on this thread, the question/answers on the first three posts is super informative. Is there any time fame when the single 4 GB file will be fixed so that the camera will start a new file after it reaches the 4 GB size?
I am planning a mount for this little HD camera on the tail of my full size aircraft and would like to have the camera run as long as my bladder range at least, 2 to 2.5 hrs would be great. Does the start stop 20 minute file size run until the SD card is full? I think I read in one of the hundreds of post that it does.

Thanks,


jb
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Old Jun 16, 2011, 10:37 PM
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USA, CA, San Diego 92120
Joined Oct 2007
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This Charger is working out well .. you can see when your No 11 cams are each fully charged because the RED LED works .. and charge your Phone or another USB device at the same time..

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001FB578I
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Old Jun 16, 2011, 10:38 PM
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S.E.Michigan
Joined Jul 2010
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Quote:
There's no way I know to save a video from WLMM with black borders like yours other than the way I mentioned.
believe me, I can mess up anything!

I don't know whats wrong. But a few clues. In random order. My version of WLMM is missing the slow motion, or time adjustment feature as you can see. My friend showed me a screen cap of his under the Edit tab, the adjustment section on his has 3 tools, background, duration and a third feature that i don't have.!

Also, I just toggled to the widescreen aspect ration so you can see what I see. Oh yes, black borders... ??

Also, when I play recorded raw video on 3 of 4 different laptops, it gives a wild intermittent pixelatied digital scramble in WMP(see attached screen cap) but Quicktime plays flawlesly.! on one of the laptops, I accidently forgot to open with Quicktime, and his WMP played the clip just fine??? I don't get it.

I clicked on properties of one of the saved finished movies and it is indeed saved as WMV not the other you mentioned.?

Last night, for the first time, I plugged in the cam and windows gave me a prompt that this device would be best used if plugged into a USB 2.0 port.!!?? that was wierd.

Is the wierd pixelation scrambling thing in WMP related to the reduced display size? Is it possible that 3 different machines have a problem child version of WMP? is it a 32 bit vs 64bit OS issue?

When you get a chance. I don't have alot of time to play around with it.

Pat
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Old Jun 16, 2011, 10:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JIMBAKER View Post
Hi Tom,

Great job on this thread, the question/answers on the first three posts is super informative. Is there any time fame when the single 4 GB file will be fixed so that the camera will start a new file after it reaches the 4 GB size?
I am planning a mount for this little HD camera on the tail of my full size aircraft and would like to have the camera run as long as my bladder range at least, 2 to 2.5 hrs would be great. Does the start stop 20 minute file size run until the SD card is full? I think I read in one of the hundreds of post that it does.

Thanks,


jb
Hi Jim,

There's no set schedule for the firmware bug fix, but I let the developer know just a couple days ago we are very interested in that fix (plus a couple other video quality tweaks). They are a small company, and are working on another new camera design right now. Hopefully it will not be too long.

Yes, you are correct....the camera would stop/save/continue at 4GB file sizes until the battery (or external power supply) dies, or the the video card fills. You would need a 16GB micro SDHC card to hold the 2.5 hours duration. A 1 hr. clip is about 3.5 GB (+ or -) on average for these cameras.
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Old Jun 16, 2011, 11:07 PM
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United States, MA, Walpole
Joined Dec 2003
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wheelspinner20 View Post
believe me, I can mess up anything!

I don't know whats wrong. But a few clues. In random order. My version of WLMM is missing the slow motion, or time adjustment feature as you can see. My friend showed me a screen cap of his under the Edit tab, the adjustment section on his has 3 tools, background, duration and a third feature that i don't have.!

Also, I just toggled to the widescreen aspect ration so you can see what I see. Oh yes, black borders... ??

Also, when I play recorded raw video on 3 of 4 different laptops, it gives a wild intermittent pixelatied digital scramble in WMP(see attached screen cap) but Quicktime plays flawlesly.! on one of the laptops, I accidently forgot to open with Quicktime, and his WMP played the clip just fine??? I don't get it.

I clicked on properties of one of the saved finished movies and it is indeed saved as WMV not the other you mentioned.?

Last night, for the first time, I plugged in the cam and windows gave me a prompt that this device would be best used if plugged into a USB 2.0 port.!!?? that was wierd.

Is the wierd pixelation scrambling thing in WMP related to the reduced display size? Is it possible that 3 different machines have a problem child version of WMP? is it a 32 bit vs 64bit OS issue?

When you get a chance. I don't have alot of time to play around with it.
Pat,

Is that clip you showed loaded into WLMM one straight from the camera???? If so, it is flawed with the black borders before you ever start to edit it! What firmware do you have in your camera? Did you install the Release 2 versions yet? They are available here (see the link in the FAQs on post #3). If your camera is recording like that, I'd flash in fresh firmware.

If you loaded back in one that you previously editied, that would explain the black borders, I guess.

Also, go here and download the latest version of WLMM... it's well worth it with the added features.

The latest version of WMP (on my W7 PC) plays the native camera videos just fine... no need for Quicktime. It could be a codec problem on those other machine if they are not running the W7 OS, or don't have the H.264 video codec on their machines.
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Old Jun 17, 2011, 04:41 AM
Fidler & twidler
empeabee's Avatar
Cranfield U.K.
Joined Mar 2004
4,014 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by wheelspinner20 View Post
believe me, I can mess up anything!

I don't know whats wrong. But a few clues. In random order. My version of WLMM is missing the slow motion, or time adjustment feature as you can see. My friend showed me a screen cap of his under the Edit tab, the adjustment section on his has 3 tools, background, duration and a third feature that i don't have.!

Also, I just toggled to the widescreen aspect ration so you can see what I see. Oh yes, black borders... ??

Also, when I play recorded raw video on 3 of 4 different laptops, it gives a wild intermittent pixelatied digital scramble in WMP(see attached screen cap) but Quicktime plays flawlesly.! on one of the laptops, I accidently forgot to open with Quicktime, and his WMP played the clip just fine??? I don't get it.

I clicked on properties of one of the saved finished movies and it is indeed saved as WMV not the other you mentioned.?

Last night, for the first time, I plugged in the cam and windows gave me a prompt that this device would be best used if plugged into a USB 2.0 port.!!?? that was wierd.

Is the wierd pixelation scrambling thing in WMP related to the reduced display size? Is it possible that 3 different machines have a problem child version of WMP? is it a 32 bit vs 64bit OS issue?

When you get a chance. I don't have alot of time to play around with it.

Pat
I may have missed it, but are you playing directly from the camera, or loading the file from the camera to the Hard Disk and then viewing it - in these various machines ?
because some programs definitly don't like playing direcftly from the camera - especially if the machine thinks if is USB1 - not enough bandwidth.
Mike
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Old Jun 17, 2011, 04:51 AM
a.d.m.i.n
reptor's Avatar
Joined Jan 2011
428 Posts
Which version of keychain is this on HK:
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbycity/s...dProduct=11867

Is this last version(v3), is this OK?
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Old Jun 17, 2011, 05:01 AM
Heli collector
livonia bob's Avatar
United States, MI, Livonia
Joined Apr 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reptor View Post
Which version of keychain is this on HK:
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbycity/s...dProduct=11867

Is this last version(v3), is this OK?
From reading the reviews seems to be a #7 camera.. Not OK
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Old Jun 17, 2011, 05:21 AM
Fidler & twidler
empeabee's Avatar
Cranfield U.K.
Joined Mar 2004
4,014 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by reptor View Post
Which version of keychain is this on HK:
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbycity/s...dProduct=11867

Is this last version(v3), is this OK?
try the Mega key cam thread http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1115052

Mike
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Old Jun 17, 2011, 07:44 AM
AMA #903699
Tony_Fletcher's Avatar
USA, VA, Alexandria
Joined Mar 2008
924 Posts
Just wanted to say thanks for a very informative thread. I purchased a cam from one of your post #3 vendors and it arrived in perfect working order.

I then used your tutorial to remove the time stamp and now I'm excited to attach the cam not only to my model aircraft, but a full scale plane too. I'm a student working on my PPL and I hope to use the cam to record some lessons for later review.

I wonder if there's a way to get audio from my headset to the cam? That would be perfect!
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Old Jun 17, 2011, 11:53 AM
Dance the skies...
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United States, MA, Walpole
Joined Dec 2003
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reptor View Post
Which version of keychain is this on HK:
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbycity/s...dProduct=11867

Is this last version(v3), is this OK?
You should read posts #1-#3 in this thread. You'll find answers there to most of the questions you have, and some you haven't even thought of yet.

Don't bother looking for a #11HD at any source than the ones given in post#2 for now.
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Old Jun 17, 2011, 12:07 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
United States, MA, Walpole
Joined Dec 2003
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony_Fletcher View Post
Just wanted to say thanks for a very informative thread. I purchased a cam from one of your post #3 vendors and it arrived in perfect working order.

I then used your tutorial to remove the time stamp and now I'm excited to attach the cam not only to my model aircraft, but a full scale plane too. I'm a student working on my PPL and I hope to use the cam to record some lessons for later review.

I wonder if there's a way to get audio from my headset to the cam? That would be perfect!
Hi Tony, welcome to the thread.

The #11 does not have any audio/video in/out ports. But if you could put a splitter jack in your headset cable, there's a couple ways you could integrate the audio into the video clips:

1. Feed the headset splitter signal to a small speaker next to the camera... it would pick up the audio from that and record it with the video. But the downside is the camera's mic is fairly sensitive, so it would also pick up motor/wind noise as well as any other cockpit sounds.

2. Feed the headset signal to some other recording device that has audio in/out compatible with that signal level. Then after the flight, feed that recording into your computer and save as an audio file (if not directly useable on a flash memory card from the recording device). You can then load the #11 video into a simple editor, mute the #11 camera's recorded audio, and overlay the headset recording onto the video, and save that file. You'd need to sync the headset audio with the camera's video if you don't start both recordings at the same time. This is a lot more work, but the advantage is your final video would have ONLY your headset audio when you play it back.
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Old Jun 17, 2011, 12:20 PM
Episyrphus balteatus
Paxman's Avatar
Sweden
Joined Dec 2008
183 Posts
Hi!

New to this thread but I have been stalking for a while. Just ordered the #11 and a wide angle lens!

A note on Tom Franks suggestion no 2:

When using an separate recorder for sound it is always good to have a sync point for editing. In film production a marker board is used (I´m sure you´ve seen that) but that is a little overkill in this situation. A decent method is to use your hands.

Extend one of your hands palm up and make sure it is in the view of the camera. Take your other hand and make one (1) clap holding the first hand still. This way you will record the sound of the clap on the sound recorder and the picture of the hands coming together in the camera. This is now your sync point.

A tad OT but since its nice to have sound and picture in sync I just wanted to share this little method I´ve used lots of time for TV-productions.

Cheers!
/Fred
(From Sweden, so sorry for my English)
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Old Jun 17, 2011, 01:25 PM
a.d.m.i.n
reptor's Avatar
Joined Jan 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paxman View Post
Hi!

New to this thread but I have been stalking for a while. Just ordered the #11 and a wide angle lens!
What wide angle lens? Can you get a link?
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Old Jun 17, 2011, 06:16 PM
Registered User
Joined Jul 2005
4 Posts
Hi!

I have a strange problem with my #11. About once per second I have a short buzzing sound. Listen to attached file (audio only)... Is is nor very loud, but annoying.
I already read that this sound appears when the battery gets low. But this is not the case here. The buzzing goes throughout the video and does not stop when I connect the camera to USB.

Interestingly, it only appears when I use a Transcend class 6 4 GB card. With a Sandisk class 2 512 MB card the sound does not appear. Unfortunately I have no other card to try. I have no dropped frames with both cards.

Does anyone have an idea?
Maybe the Transcend takes more power? But the battery lasts at least 50 min. Longer I did not try yet.

Patrick
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Old Jun 17, 2011, 06:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pät View Post
Hi!

I have a strange problem with my #11. About once per second I have a short buzzing sound. Listen to attached file (audio only)... Is is nor very loud, but annoying.
I already read that this sound appears when the battery gets low. But this is not the case here. The buzzing goes throughout the video and does not stop when I connect the camera to USB.

Interestingly, it only appears when I use a Transcend class 6 4 GB card. With a Sandisk class 2 512 MB card the sound does not appear. Unfortunately I have no other card to try. I have no dropped frames with both cards.

Does anyone have an idea?
Maybe the Transcend takes more power? But the battery lasts at least 50 min. Longer I did not try yet.

Patrick
The larger the capacity of the flash memory card, the more power it will consume. Have you fully charged the battery and let the camera make recordings until the battery dies? Do that to see if your battery is truly in good shape.

About 40 min. is the most a good battery will last unless you have one of the "jumbo" #11 versions with a larger battery. The sound sample you posted is the low battery sound, and it gets much worse as the battery gets weaker. But, starting a recording with that sound, then attaching to a USB port for power should make the sound go away. If yours doesn't then the camera may have a defect or off-spec component. Replacement might be needed if the condition of the battery can first be confirmed.
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Old Jun 17, 2011, 06:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reptor View Post
What wide angle lens? Can you get a link?
There's info in the FAQs (post#3) on the best add-on wide angle lenses found to date. Did you read that post?
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Old Jun 17, 2011, 06:33 PM
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Joined Jul 2005
4 Posts
Thanks for the quick reply!

The sound also appears with a fully charged battery.

I have bought the Transcend card only today and then did a record of 50 min, on my montainbike. So the battery should be fine... It it true that I first noticed the buzzing at the end of the record, but I also heard it then at the beginning. Unfortunately I then re-formatted the card because I thought this might help... So I cannot tell how much the sound gets louder. I' currently doing a test until end of battery.

If I attach the camera to the USB port during recording, the sound does not change at all.

Patrick
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Old Jun 17, 2011, 06:53 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
United States, MA, Walpole
Joined Dec 2003
17,731 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by pät View Post
...
If I attach the camera to the USB port during recording, the sound does not change at all.

Patrick
That pretty much tells me there is a problem with the camera, and it likely will need to be replaced.
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Old Jun 18, 2011, 05:00 AM
Episyrphus balteatus
Paxman's Avatar
Sweden
Joined Dec 2008
183 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by reptor View Post
What wide angle lens? Can you get a link?
I ordered this one. I had to find a seller that would ship to Sweden so the ones liked to in post #3 wouldn't work for me. Hopefully this is as good but if it´s crap at least it didn't cost that much.
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Old Jun 18, 2011, 06:09 AM
a.d.m.i.n
reptor's Avatar
Joined Jan 2011
428 Posts
Will be this good choice:

-#11 HD Car Key Chain DVR Keyfob Video Record Camera DV
41,99$

-Fish Eye Lens(can I fix normally this to #11 keychain?
$16.75

-Transcend Micro SDHC Class 6 4GB 4G 4 G GB Micro SD New
$10.49
_________________________________
TOTAL: 69,23$ = 50 € (with shipping)

Is there any cheaper than this?
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Old Jun 18, 2011, 10:27 AM
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Fish eye lens $13.30 free shipping
http://cgi.ebay.com/180-13mm-Fisheye...#ht_1540wt_905
Honestly the macro lens is a better fit for this cam, less distortion and no black corners. Also is lighter and cheaper. I am talking about this one:
http://cgi.ebay.com/0-67X-Universal-...ht_4979wt_1139
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Old Jun 18, 2011, 10:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tushev View Post
Fish eye lens $13.30 free shipping
http://cgi.ebay.com/180-13mm-Fisheye...#ht_1540wt_905
Honestly the macro lens is a better fit for this cam, less distortion and no black corners. Also is lighter and cheaper. I am talking about this one:
http://cgi.ebay.com/0-67X-Universal-...ht_4979wt_1139
Yes to USA is free shipping, but to Europe is 5%, so it's not cheaper in my case

Well I just like fish eye, because of GOPRO
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Old Jun 18, 2011, 11:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reptor View Post
Is there any cheaper than this?
I would also look at:
A #11 with the cigarette charger and as well as the 110/220V wall adapter for the charger, and with registered airmail shipping method for the price you tell about.

If you buy a memory card through ebay then I have a very good experience through this seller. As you can see it has 100% positive feedback. Ships with registered airmail, so they arrive very fast. At least in my country every letter or even big package that is sent as registered arrives at 6-10 week days. Regular airmail may arrive as fast, but may delay as much as 22 week days.
http://cgi.ebay.com/Team-Class-6-mic...item45f69e0428 (which I have found it is a superb card)
or http://cgi.ebay.com/Team-Class-6-mic...item1c1aa1afb6 (which I have not bought since the 8GB is the best value for money with so little price difference)

As for the lens. There is some difference. Some are used as wide lens, like in the previous post, or this one or many other.
Note that the lens you linked is mainly used for the fish eye effect, as they differ to the angle.
So if you want the lens you linked then the price difference in ebay is not big, but still there is some. You can search for "180 wide lens" in ebay. Again I would prefer registered airmail, some offer it with $2 more, usually.
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Old Jun 18, 2011, 12:08 PM
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Hi,

I now tested several SD cards for my buzzing problem. I also measured the length of a typical buzz, using an audio analysis software. Here the results:

The freshly charged battery lasted today 44 min (battery dead), yesterday >47 min (I switched of myself)
With all cards, the buzzing appears (or gets louder) with low battery (last few minutes)
Video is OK with all cards.

1) Sandisk 512 MB, class unknown (2?)
No buzzing at all until battery gets low
typ. buzz length 200ms

2) Sandisk 2 GB, class unknown (2?), but newer that 1)
No buzzing until battery gets low
but: if you turn volume as loud as possible, you can hear the "buzz" with full battery as a change in bachground noise
typ. buzz length 130 ms

3) unknown manufacturer, 8 GB, class 4
buzzing already audible with full battery, but quiet
typ. buzz length 100 ms

4) Transcend 4 GB, class 6
buzzing already audible with full battery, louder that 3)
typ. buzz length 70 ms

I think the "buzz" is the time interval when the camera writes to the card. (Right?) This needs power and leads to a voltage drop of the battery, generating the buzz.
This leads to the following explanation:
The faster the card, the shorter the writing interval, but the higher the current the card consumes, and the higher the voltage drop.

It would be interesting if other users also observe this buzzing with full battery in combination with fast cards, or whether only my camera has this problem. It is not very loud, if you are recording in a car or on a model plane, you won't hear it anyway.

Patrick
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Old Jun 18, 2011, 03:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xamindar View Post
It has to go camera > special cable > any standard USB extension cable > any powered usb port (battery/computer/hub etc.) and it will work just fine. The only reason the special cable is there is to have a special connector pinout for the camera, anything you plug into the other end will work just fine provided the camera gets power through it.
Thanks!
I did another test with a new extension cable, all good.
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Old Jun 18, 2011, 05:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pät View Post
Hi,

I now tested several SD cards for my buzzing problem. I also measured the length of a typical buzz, using an audio analysis software. Here the results:

The freshly charged battery lasted today 44 min (battery dead), yesterday >47 min (I switched of myself)
With all cards, the buzzing appears (or gets louder) with low battery (last few minutes)
Video is OK with all cards.

1) Sandisk 512 MB, class unknown (2?)
No buzzing at all until battery gets low
typ. buzz length 200ms

2) Sandisk 2 GB, class unknown (2?), but newer that 1)
No buzzing until battery gets low
but: if you turn volume as loud as possible, you can hear the "buzz" with full battery as a change in bachground noise
typ. buzz length 130 ms

3) unknown manufacturer, 8 GB, class 4
buzzing already audible with full battery, but quiet
typ. buzz length 100 ms

4) Transcend 4 GB, class 6
buzzing already audible with full battery, louder that 3)
typ. buzz length 70 ms

I think the "buzz" is the time interval when the camera writes to the card. (Right?) This needs power and leads to a voltage drop of the battery, generating the buzz.
This leads to the following explanation:
The faster the card, the shorter the writing interval, but the higher the current the card consumes, and the higher the voltage drop.

It would be interesting if other users also observe this buzzing with full battery in combination with fast cards, or whether only my camera has this problem. It is not very loud, if you are recording in a car or on a model plane, you won't hear it anyway.

Patrick
I just made a recording in a quiet room of 38:58 minutes until the battery died. I had to listen REALLY hard to barely hear the buzzing sounds begin to start 10 minutes from the end. If I set the sound level to normal, I would not hear anything noticeable until about 8 minutes before the end. My flash memory is a 4GB CL6 Transcend card.

I could hear two distinct different buzzing sounds... one short buzz at exactly one second intervals, and one more sporadic buzz of slightly higher frequency and longer duration, starting every one to 2 seconds. Some of that could be caused by the write period to the memory card as you theorized. Some might be an artifact of the real time clock.

In earlier tests done by myself and Isoprop with external battery packs, it seemed to indicate the capacity of the flash card was definitely a factor in power consumption and battery duration (more memory to keep powered during the recording). I don't know how much of a factor the recording speed might have been, but your theory makes some sense.

But there must be something about the camera hardware, too, that causes some camera's like your to start having audible sounds sooner than mine. Maybe just component tolerance differences?

Fortunately I normally mute the sound in my AV recordings, but I sure wish a simple fix for the buzzing could be found.
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Old Jun 18, 2011, 06:59 PM
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Micro / SD Card Power consumption

Hi everyone - interesting topic and I thought I'd add some thoughts on this subject.
To my knowledge, the read-write speed of memory in general, is directly related to the wafer / die size and the size of the semiconductor junctions used in it's manufacturer. The smaller the semiconductor junctions are (in nanometers), the faster they can physically operate or switch from one state to another.

Scenario : 2 x 4 GB MicroSD cards from the same manufacturer - one is class 2, the other class 6. If both cards are forced to operate at the same speed, let's say for arguments sake, a sedentary 8Mhz - the class 6 will use less power than the class 2 due to it's smaller, lower power junction sizes.

All well and good, but when the class 6 card is operated at it's 'ideal' higher speed to attain say 6MB/s RW speed, it will most likely use the same power as a class 2 card operating at a lower speed for 2MB/s RW.

In the grand scheme of things, the DSC processor and control circuitry in the #11 camera uses 80% of the battery power. The typical recording current consumption at 4.0V is 280ma. This varies as much as +/- 30ma with variations in the RGB data received from the camera module.

I'd be happy to discuss how you can acurately compare the power consumption of any individual MicroSD card fitted to the #11 camera, if it would be useful to readers.

Further reading :

http://www.dtt8.com/images/micro-sd%20specification.pdf

http://www.sdcard.org/developers/tec...nal_100518.pdf

Richard
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Old Jun 18, 2011, 07:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timetec View Post
Hi everyone - interesting topic and I thought I'd add some thoughts on this.
To my knowledge, the speed of memory in general, is directly related to the wafer / die size and the size of the semiconductor junctions used in manufacturer. The smaller (in nanometers) the semiconductor juntions are, the faster they can physically operate or switch from one state to another.
...
Richard
Makes sense, Richard. What doesn't make sense to me though, is why a 4GB CL6 Transcend card is twice as fast in random writes as an 8GB CL6 Transcend card, both of similar vintage so their on-board controller should function similarly I'd think. If anything the 8GB card physical layout factors you mentioned should be the same size or even smaller to fit the twice the memory on the same physical card size. Maybe you can shed some light on that? Two tests of these two cards done with Crystal Disk Mark benchmarking tool are attached. True, the tool was a beta release in one test (the faster 4GB card test) and the final release in the other, but I don't think that would impact the speed readings as shown in the test results.

p.s. Not complaining... the cards are performing like CL10 cards for all practical purposes!... just curious.
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Last edited by Tom Frank; Jun 18, 2011 at 07:41 PM.
Old Jun 19, 2011, 04:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank View Post

I could hear two distinct different buzzing sounds... one short buzz at exactly one second intervals, and one more sporadic buzz of slightly higher frequency and longer duration, starting every one to 2 seconds. Some of that could be caused by the write period to the memory card as you theorized. Some might be an artifact of the real time clock.
Right. I also hear two different buzzing sounds like you. I determined the duration of the buzz that appears at the one second intervals.

I also noticed that the sound frequency (tone pitch in english?) is different for each card.

I think it's really a problem with component tolerances. Maybe a problem with capacitors, that cannot properly buffer some peak power consuptions? As I cannot stop the full battery buzzing by connecting to a power supply, it should be somewhere "within" the circuit.

@Richard
I'm not an expert in SD details. But I take from your ref. 2 that the card can take different max currents depending on bus speed (Table 3-4)? My two Sandisk cards both are standard SD (SDSC), while the others are SDHC. According to the table, SDSC is limited to 200 mA, while SDHC can take up to 800 mA. Can you shed light on this?
What bus speeds are usually used with the different cards? Does #11 use variable speeds for different cards? I think it's difficult to find out...

Patrick
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Old Jun 19, 2011, 11:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pät View Post
Does #11 use variable speeds for different cards? I think it's difficult to find out...Patrick
Hi Patrick, a 'standard' microSDHC card has a maximum RW current consumption of 60ma to 80ma.
See this link and click on the 'Technical Data' tab : http://www.toshiba-memory.com/en/micro_sd_cards.html
As for bus speed, I can only tell you that #11's clock frequency is 12Mhz. Obviously, the bus speed can't possibly be any higher than this.
The only way to check the data bus speed for definate, is to get a fq counter / scope on pin 5 of the card (clock).
If you can somehow interrupt pin 4 to the card (+ve supply), you could monitor the current consumption of the card in circuit, while it was reading and writing. If you have a 'duff' microSD card lying about and a spare microSD socket, it shouldn't be too hard to knock up an external card slot, allowing easy access to all 8 lines.

Richard
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Old Jun 19, 2011, 01:28 PM
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1) Do all of the HD #11s have a red LED or do some have a yellow LED??

2) Looking for a #11 with time/date stamp already removed. PM if you have a good one.
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Old Jun 19, 2011, 01:37 PM
svo
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141 Posts
Got my camera the other day. It's been too windy to stick it on a plane so I've been messing with sticking it on my 29 ford.

Everything looks okay,..Just having trouble with the sound going to hell with the wind etc.


I've tried lots of different things. maybe the car and vibration is just too much for it.


I also caught the second video yesterday at a fly-in using the #11


29 ford tudor (2 min 50 sec)



debby rhin (0 min 21 sec)
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Old Jun 19, 2011, 01:40 PM
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Sentry, removing the time/date stamp is the easiest thing, no risk at all.
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Old Jun 19, 2011, 01:46 PM
svo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tushev View Post
Sentry, removing the time/date stamp is the easiest thing, no risk at all.


+1 I removed mine,.was fast and easy
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Old Jun 19, 2011, 02:02 PM
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Joined Sep 2010
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I removed mine on my orig cams - but I can't get it to work on the 2 that I have. I got them WAY early - well before this thread existed - LOL. So I think they are too early to hack properly w/out bricking.
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Old Jun 19, 2011, 03:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SENTRY 62 View Post
1) Do all of the HD #11s have a red LED or do some have a yellow LED??

2) Looking for a #11 with time/date stamp already removed. PM if you have a good one.
The #11 has both red and yellow LEDS, for different function indications.

Most of the vendors listed in Post #2 will remove the date stamp prior to shipping if you ask.

Also, the date removal for these cameras is done by loading in new firmware by simply copying the new firmware onto the camera's flash memory card and turning on the camera, not by downloading the firmware from the camera and hacking it to remove the date fonts like the old 808 low res cameras. This thread started shortly after the new #11's appeared and were reported in this forum, so I'm curious if the older cameras you are referring to are the TRUE #11 HD cameras, or the older 808 low-res variety?
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Last edited by Tom Frank; Jun 19, 2011 at 03:37 PM.
Old Jun 19, 2011, 03:45 PM
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Powder Springs, GA
Joined Sep 2010
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I have not been able to get a red LED at all... that fact along with the fact that multiple removal attempts isn't working has me wondering - LOL.

I bought 3 cams at once - and gave 1 away to Derek_S - he performed the date removal and posted the results. Im wondering if they are just the low(er) res cams though. I will say that the quality does look much better than my orginal 808s.

FPV Radian Keychain #11 Test 1 (2 min 44 sec)
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Old Jun 19, 2011, 03:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SENTRY 62 View Post
I have not been able to get a red LED at all... that fact along with the fact that multiple removal attempts isn't working has me wondering - LOL.

I bought 3 cams at once - and gave 1 away to Derek_S - he performed the date removal and posted the results. Im wondering if they are just the low(er) res cams though. I will say that the quality does look much better than my orginal 808s.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HilbTEcN0AU
Did you edit the video you uploaded to YouTube before uploading it? If not, then the video confirms the cameras are definitely NOT the #11 cams. The #11 have a wide screen (16:9) aspect ratio 1280x720 pixels, and YouTube would give the option of displaying in 720 resolution if that is what you uploaded. So, it's no wonder that attempts to flash in new firmware meant for the #11 did not work! See post #1 and #2 for more info on identifying the true #11 camera and links to vendors who sell them.
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Old Jun 19, 2011, 04:13 PM
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Derek edited it - yes.

I will check the 1st posts... but I do find it interesting that Derek used the process in this thread to remove the date stamp - as far I know this process won't work for the low res cams correct?

What's the easiest way to get the LED to illuminate red?
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Old Jun 19, 2011, 04:21 PM
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Joined Oct 2010
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Hey Tom, as a newbie to r/c videoing, this thread is an incredibly valuable resource with tons of great info. Can't wait to put all of this to use.
I know you've put a heck of a lot of time into it. Just wanted to say thanks for the effort.
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Old Jun 19, 2011, 04:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SENTRY 62 View Post
Derek edited it - yes.

I will check the 1st posts... but I do find it interesting that Derek used the process in this thread to remove the date stamp - as far I know this process won't work for the low res cams correct?

What's the easiest way to get the LED to illuminate red?
If the video was editied, it was resized (why, I don't know) and the quality was also degraded.

Yes, the firmware download from this site is only for the #11HD cameras. The red LED should turn on whever the internal battery is charging. Plug into a USB port on your computer. If the battery is fully charged, you won't see the red LED, or maybe just a brief flash as you plug it in. If the battery is not fully charged, the red LED should turn on until the battery is charged, then turn off. I suggest you read the link in the FAQs in Post #3 on basic camera functions.

What is the file name of a video taken with your camera? It should be somthing like "PTDC00001.MOV" (last number will increment with each new video). If it's something else, it's not a #11.
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Old Jun 19, 2011, 04:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tucknut View Post
Hey Tom, as a newbie to r/c videoing, this thread is an incredibly valuable resource with tons of great info. Can't wait to put all of this to use.
I know you've put a heck of a lot of time into it. Just wanted to say thanks for the effort.
Thanks, Tucknut. Welcome to the thread. Hopefully the info in the first several posts will help answer any questions you might have without having to post them first.
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Old Jun 19, 2011, 05:14 PM
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Just to make sure I understand.
The #11 cam can be configured to make files longer than 20-30 minutes.
Apparently the battery will last about 100 minutes.
I plan to get 2 for my sailplane and want to be able to get a continuous video of semi-long duration flights.
If the #11 can work with an external battery to shoot an entire flying session (say 3 hours) that's what I want.
Is that do-able with the #11?
If so, can someone recommend a particular vendor, model number...link to the sale page?
Sorry to be pressing the easy button here but there seems to be too many different models for sale now...having trouble deciding.
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Old Jun 19, 2011, 05:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank View Post
If the video was editied, it was resized (why, I don't know) and the quality was also degraded.

Yes, the firmware download from this site is only for the #11HD cameras. The red LED should turn on whever the internal battery is charging. Plug into a USB port on your computer. If the battery is fully charged, you won't see the red LED, or maybe just a brief flash as you plug it in. If the battery is not fully charged, the red LED should turn on until the battery is charged, then turn off. I suggest you read the link in the FAQs in Post #3 on basic camera functions.

What is the file name of a video taken with your camera? It should be somthing like "PTDC00001.MOV" (last number will increment with each new video). If it's something else, it's not a #11.
That's the answer I need. LOL. I got 2 11s and 1 "other". Great info!!!! TY SIR!!!
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Old Jun 19, 2011, 05:58 PM
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Hi!
I have a camera which has stopped responding. I did update the firmware to the "Recover Date/Time stamp" release two ~09 May 2011, but the camera worked fine for a couple of days following.

After switching to another microSD card, I did get the camera to go into the "USB storage" mode once. After that, nothing.

I tried the reset button with the camera off, with the main button pushed in, and while connected to the USB port as in the recover from dead firmware post (again, I have no reason to suspect a bad flash), but I have not yet clipped the battery wires as I don't have a soldering iron, and I'm not that good at it anyway.

Are there other troubleshooting steps, or a precise sequence of steps (I cannot find the instructions it came with, and only found the one post on troubleshooting a "dead" camera).

I will be traveling tomorrow through the week and was sort of happy to have it, if only for the still camera mode (cameras went to the other party...).

v/r,
C-F
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Old Jun 19, 2011, 06:34 PM
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Does this look like the right camera?
http://cgi.ebay.com/11-HD-Flight-Rec...item23113c3f6a

Thanks for advice!
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Old Jun 19, 2011, 06:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JumpySticks View Post
Does this look like the right camera?
http://cgi.ebay.com/11-HD-Flight-Rec...item23113c3f6a

Thanks for advice!
Yes, it's one of the "jumbo" versions with the larger battery (and larger size/weight), if that's the one you are wanting.

As stated in Post #2, these are the key specs to look for in the ads that define the #11 HD cameras:

720P high Definition Video 1280 x 720 H.264 30fps .mov fomat

Post #2 shows the different styles... they are all #11 cameras, just different case sizes and styles.
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Last edited by Tom Frank; Jun 19, 2011 at 06:52 PM.
Old Jun 19, 2011, 06:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JumpySticks View Post
Just to make sure I understand.
The #11 cam can be configured to make files longer than 20-30 minutes.
Apparently the battery will last about 100 minutes.
I plan to get 2 for my sailplane and want to be able to get a continuous video of semi-long duration flights.
If the #11 can work with an external battery to shoot an entire flying session (say 3 hours) that's what I want.
Is that do-able with the #11?
...
The FAQ link in post #3 tells the tale on the continuous recording firmware. It is currently "broken", but will record a file up to 4GB in size. When the bug is fixed, it will then continue with another 4GB recording, etc. etc. The pause between 4GB clips is only a few seconds, though.
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Last edited by Tom Frank; Jun 19, 2011 at 07:25 PM.
Old Jun 19, 2011, 07:02 PM
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[QUOTE=Tom Frank;18543288]
Quote:
Originally Posted by JumpySticks View Post
Just to make sure I understand.
The #11 cam can be configured to make files longer than 20-30 minutes.
Apparently the battery will last about 100 minutes.
I plan to get 2 for my sailplane and want to be able to get a continuous video of semi-long duration flights.
If the #11 can work with an external battery to shoot an entire flying session (say 3 hours) that's what I want.
Is that do-able with the #11?
...
QUOTE]The FAQ link in post #3 tells the tale on the continuous recording firmware. It is currently "broken", but will record a file up to 4GB in size. When the bug is fixed, it will then continue with another 4GB recording, etc. etc. The pause between 4GB clips is only a few seconds, though.
I did read the threads, but still had questions.
Thanks!
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Old Jun 19, 2011, 07:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CANNONFODDER0 View Post
Hi!
I have a camera which has stopped responding. I did update the firmware to the "Recover Date/Time stamp" release two ~09 May 2011, but the camera worked fine for a couple of days following.

After switching to another microSD card, I did get the camera to go into the "USB storage" mode once. After that, nothing.

I tried the reset button with the camera off, with the main button pushed in, and while connected to the USB port as in the recover from dead firmware post (again, I have no reason to suspect a bad flash), but I have not yet clipped the battery wires as I don't have a soldering iron, and I'm not that good at it anyway.

Are there other troubleshooting steps, or a precise sequence of steps (I cannot find the instructions it came with, and only found the one post on troubleshooting a "dead" camera).

I will be traveling tomorrow through the week and was sort of happy to have it, if only for the still camera mode (cameras went to the other party...).

v/r,
C-F
There's a link to the camera instructions in post #3, but they don't tell you anything!
  • Does the yellow LED come on when power button pushed?
  • Is battery charged? Does it hold a charge?
  • Will camera record with power from car charger?
  • Did you try another USB cable?
  • Did you try a different USB port (one on the PC case, not a remote hub)?
  • Did you reformat the flash card(s) (preferrably with SDformatter utility)?
  • Does the flash card work in other devices?
SInce the camera shows some signs of life off and on, it's an intermittant problem... likely connectivity/data communication problem.
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Old Jun 19, 2011, 08:18 PM
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United States, CA, Irvine
Joined Jun 2009
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Old Jun 19, 2011, 08:20 PM
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Tom Frank's Avatar
United States, MA, Walpole
Joined Dec 2003
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Minimizing the Video Vignetting Blues With Vdub Editor

All of the #11 cameras show darkening at the right/left edges and corners of the video (vignetting). Some are worse than others, but they all show this problem to some degree. Mine is one of the worse ones, I think.

Back in this thread I posted some examples of how this can be corrected using a commercial editor (MAGIX Movie edit Pro 17 PLus). There is another free solution! The VirtualDub (a.k.a. Vdub) editor (freeware) has a rich array of filters that can be applied to videos, one of which is called "hotspot", which uses a mask to adjust the brightness of selective portions of the video frames. When the mask exactly matches your camera's vignetting pattern, it can increase the edge brightness selectively where your camera darkens them!

I've attached two frame grabs from my #11 camera showing a before and after picture of how this filter mask can improve the video. It's not perfect (can't change color shift in darkened areas like the MAGIX editor can), but it can minimize the vignetting edge darkness throughout the entire video. I have also included a .zip file with the hotspot filter for Vdub, the mask I created for my camera, and instructions for anyone wanting to make a mask which matches their camera's vignetting exactly. You can try my filter mask to see how the filter works to see if you might want to use this tool.

You need to know that VDub ONLY works with .AVI format files, so you should first convert the .MOV files from the #11 .MOV format to .AVI using the MP4cam2AVI utility to convert the file without having to re-encode the original (see the editing link in the FAQs on Post #3 for more info on this tool). Or you can re-encode by any other conversion program if you wish. Also, some commercial editors can use Vdub filters, such as the VideoPad editor, to give this same capability it does not have built in.

My next goal is to find a similar filter, or a way to use the Vdub Hotspot filter with the AviDemux free editor, so the conversion of the file to .AVI format is not necessary.

PM me if you have any questions.
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Last edited by Tom Frank; Jun 19, 2011 at 09:37 PM. Reason: Added two new pics
Old Jun 19, 2011, 08:37 PM
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United States, CA, San Ramon
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Originally Posted by turbinefancy View Post
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You know, there is a "Thread Tools" link at the top of any thread that can be used to subscribe. No need to waste everyones time posting useless "subscribe" posts.
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Old Jun 19, 2011, 09:02 PM
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United States, MI, Livonia
Joined Apr 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xamindar View Post
You know, there is a "Thread Tools" link at the top of any thread that can be used to subscribe. No need to waste everyones time posting useless "subscribe" posts.
Also no need to waste everyone's time telling him after the fact.. But It might help him on his next thread subscription. But you could of sent him a PM to tell him... But then maybe there are others that don't know this and that will help them and us all by not having to read that they subscribed. But then maybe he just wanted to let us all know that he is now on the thread.. And we should stand up when reading his post???

Had a nice Fathers Day..
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