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Old Jul 19, 2003, 03:01 AM
OldSchool
Guest
n/a Posts
What to use with 30-size & 30% nitro: tuned pipe, tuned muffler, or muffler?


I have a OS 32sx powered concept. What type of exhaust system is best
with CP 30% fuel?
Old Jul 19, 2003, 03:01 AM
Trowelfaz
Guest
n/a Posts
Re: What to use with 30-size & 30% nitro: tuned pipe, tuned muffler, or muffler?

I am running a C30SRX w/ O.S .32SH-H (non-ring), CP30% and a HeliMax Tuned
Pipe with great success (great power and FAST). Needle is about 1-1/8 - 1/14
turns out. Tower has it for $31.99 (P/N: LXM039
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXM039&P=7 )
The only problems I have had is the coupling blowing out. I since changed to
automotive heater hose w/hose clamps and it works great!




"OldSchool" <OldSchool@here.com> wrote in message
news:l2dghvsfntb1kajhhhl5sfcsb6qlvbljl9@4ax.com...
>
> I have a OS 32sx powered concept. What type of exhaust system is best
> with CP 30% fuel?



Old Jul 19, 2003, 03:01 AM
OldSchool
Guest
n/a Posts
Re: What to use with 30-size & 30% nitro: tuned pipe, tuned muffler, or muffler?

Trowelfaz,

Thanks for the response!

I had almost the exact setup, but the header pipe snapped off just
downstream of the engine as soon as I moved to 30% CP. A friend
commented that tuned pipes only work with low nitro, otherwise they
make a lot of vibration. Does this make sense to you?

How long have you been runing your setup?

Ever have any problems with radio interference or metal parts snapping
themselves?

Thanks!


On Fri, 18 Jul 2003 13:30:24 -0500, "Trowelfaz"
<trowelfaz@MAPSONhotmail.com> wrote:

>I am running a C30SRX w/ O.S .32SH-H (non-ring), CP30% and a HeliMax Tuned
>Pipe with great success (great power and FAST). Needle is about 1-1/8 - 1/14
>turns out. Tower has it for $31.99 (P/N: LXM039
>http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXM039&P=7 )
>The only problems I have had is the coupling blowing out. I since changed to
>automotive heater hose w/hose clamps and it works great!
>
>
>
>
>"OldSchool" <OldSchool@here.com> wrote in message
>news:l2dghvsfntb1kajhhhl5sfcsb6qlvbljl9@4ax.com.. .
>>
>> I have a OS 32sx powered concept. What type of exhaust system is best
>> with CP 30% fuel?

>


Old Jul 19, 2003, 03:01 AM
Beav
Guest
n/a Posts
Re: What to use with 30-size & 30% nitro: tuned pipe, tuned muffler, or muffler?


"OldSchool" <OldSchool@here.com> wrote in message
news:jj0hhvkp0ec2maq5bjbilvao01o3aim0ib@4ax.com...
> Trowelfaz,
>
> Thanks for the response!
>
> I had almost the exact setup, but the header pipe snapped off just
> downstream of the engine as soon as I moved to 30% CP. A friend
> commented that tuned pipes only work with low nitro, otherwise they
> make a lot of vibration.


Someone's talking total bollocks.

Does this make sense to you?

Not even a LITTLE bit of sense. The vibrations come from running too lean
(as a rule) and high nitro fuels and pipe combinations need more fuel to
stop the lean running.

>
> How long have you been runing your setup?


I've been running pipes and nitro since before Nelson lost his eye without
problems, but since moving onto high compression engines that don't need (or
want) nitro and getting more power than with the "other" method, I don't run
ANY nitro anymore.

>
> Ever have any problems with radio interference or metal parts snapping
> themselves?


If parts are snapping hemselves, it's fatigue that's causing it. Fatigue
comes from vibrations, so if you're having hthis particular problem, check
yur mixture and check the rest of the heli for balance. Everything that
turns should be balanced.


--
Beav


Please note my E-mail address is "beavis dot original at ntlworld dot com"
(with the obvious changes)

Beavisland now lives at
www.beavisoriginal.co.uk


Old Jul 19, 2003, 03:01 AM
Trowelfaz
Guest
n/a Posts
Re: What to use with 30-size & 30% nitro: tuned pipe, tuned muffler, or muffler?

Hmmm, been running mine for 5 years now (since day 1) without any problems
except I used to blow couplers until I switched to automotive heater hose.
Mine is an older style where the pressure nipple was not pre-drilled. Also,
I had problems with it loosening until I used longer screws and put a nut on
them (and use automotive gasket sealer on the header-to-engine flanges). I
have also used CP 30% since day 1. As for not using nitro with a pipe - I
believe that is BS. At my plane flying field, everyone on pipes use >15%
nitro. I did try 15% in my heli once, but had to crank the needle out 2.5+
turns, and could never get it right through the whole tank. On my CP 30%, my
high-speed needle works best between 1-1/8 and 1-1/4 turns out. A tweak 2-3
clicks either way and it lean runs or is too rich an will not spin up. This
has been the same with 2 other O.S. 32-SX-H engines I have had in my C30
(stripped the glow-plug boss in one and wore out the other). I would say
your header vreaking is due to fatigue -OR- having the pipe butted right up
to the header. Be sure to leave a little space in the coupler between them
(this is also how you can tune the pipe for torque or speed) else the pipe
will vibrate against the header and cause interference, metal shaving in
your exhaust (and sucked into the engine) and the fatigue you mentioned.


"OldSchool" <OldSchool@here.com> wrote in message
news:jj0hhvkp0ec2maq5bjbilvao01o3aim0ib@4ax.com...
> Trowelfaz,
>
> Thanks for the response!
>
> I had almost the exact setup, but the header pipe snapped off just
> downstream of the engine as soon as I moved to 30% CP. A friend
> commented that tuned pipes only work with low nitro, otherwise they
> make a lot of vibration. Does this make sense to you?
>
> How long have you been runing your setup?
>
> Ever have any problems with radio interference or metal parts snapping
> themselves?
>
> Thanks!
>
>
> On Fri, 18 Jul 2003 13:30:24 -0500, "Trowelfaz"
> <trowelfaz@MAPSONhotmail.com> wrote:
>
> >I am running a C30SRX w/ O.S .32SH-H (non-ring), CP30% and a HeliMax

Tuned
> >Pipe with great success (great power and FAST). Needle is about 1-1/8 -

1/14
> >turns out. Tower has it for $31.99 (P/N: LXM039
> >http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXM039&P=7 )
> >The only problems I have had is the coupling blowing out. I since changed

to
> >automotive heater hose w/hose clamps and it works great!
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >"OldSchool" <OldSchool@here.com> wrote in message
> >news:l2dghvsfntb1kajhhhl5sfcsb6qlvbljl9@4ax.com.. .
> >>
> >> I have a OS 32sx powered concept. What type of exhaust system is best
> >> with CP 30% fuel?

> >

>



Old Jul 20, 2003, 03:01 AM
OldSchool
Guest
n/a Posts
Re: What to use with 30-size & 30% nitro: tuned pipe, tuned muffler, or muffler?

Beav,

What type of hi compression-no nitro engine do you use? What type of
exhaust?

With higher nitro, I need to run richer...right? More turns out on
the main needle I think. Don't laugh, I'm new at all this.

Thanks for the reply!




On Fri, 18 Jul 2003 23:35:45 GMT, "Beav"
<beavis.original@ntloxoworld.com> wrote:

>
>"OldSchool" <OldSchool@here.com> wrote in message
>news:jj0hhvkp0ec2maq5bjbilvao01o3aim0ib@4ax.com.. .
>> Trowelfaz,
>>
>> Thanks for the response!
>>
>> I had almost the exact setup, but the header pipe snapped off just
>> downstream of the engine as soon as I moved to 30% CP. A friend
>> commented that tuned pipes only work with low nitro, otherwise they
>> make a lot of vibration.

>
>Someone's talking total bollocks.
>
>Does this make sense to you?
>
>Not even a LITTLE bit of sense. The vibrations come from running too lean
>(as a rule) and high nitro fuels and pipe combinations need more fuel to
>stop the lean running.
>
>>
>> How long have you been runing your setup?

>
>I've been running pipes and nitro since before Nelson lost his eye without
>problems, but since moving onto high compression engines that don't need (or
>want) nitro and getting more power than with the "other" method, I don't run
>ANY nitro anymore.
>
>>
>> Ever have any problems with radio interference or metal parts snapping
>> themselves?

>
>If parts are snapping hemselves, it's fatigue that's causing it. Fatigue
>comes from vibrations, so if you're having hthis particular problem, check
>yur mixture and check the rest of the heli for balance. Everything that
>turns should be balanced.


Old Jul 20, 2003, 03:01 AM
OldSchool
Guest
n/a Posts
Re: What to use with 30-size & 30% nitro: tuned pipe, tuned muffler, or muffler?

Trowelfaz,

How do you know when it is too lean, just right, or too rich? Do you
have a method for setting the needle valve? How often do you have to
reset it?

Thanks




On Sat, 19 Jul 2003 01:56:26 GMT, "Trowelfaz"
<Trowelfaz@NOSPAMhotmail.com> wrote:

>Hmmm, been running mine for 5 years now (since day 1) without any problems
>except I used to blow couplers until I switched to automotive heater hose.
>Mine is an older style where the pressure nipple was not pre-drilled. Also,
>I had problems with it loosening until I used longer screws and put a nut on
>them (and use automotive gasket sealer on the header-to-engine flanges). I
>have also used CP 30% since day 1. As for not using nitro with a pipe - I
>believe that is BS. At my plane flying field, everyone on pipes use >15%
>nitro. I did try 15% in my heli once, but had to crank the needle out 2.5+
>turns, and could never get it right through the whole tank. On my CP 30%, my
>high-speed needle works best between 1-1/8 and 1-1/4 turns out. A tweak 2-3
>clicks either way and it lean runs or is too rich an will not spin up. This
>has been the same with 2 other O.S. 32-SX-H engines I have had in my C30
>(stripped the glow-plug boss in one and wore out the other). I would say
>your header vreaking is due to fatigue -OR- having the pipe butted right up
>to the header. Be sure to leave a little space in the coupler between them
>(this is also how you can tune the pipe for torque or speed) else the pipe
>will vibrate against the header and cause interference, metal shaving in
>your exhaust (and sucked into the engine) and the fatigue you mentioned.
>
>
>"OldSchool" <OldSchool@here.com> wrote in message
>news:jj0hhvkp0ec2maq5bjbilvao01o3aim0ib@4ax.com.. .
>> Trowelfaz,
>>
>> Thanks for the response!
>>
>> I had almost the exact setup, but the header pipe snapped off just
>> downstream of the engine as soon as I moved to 30% CP. A friend
>> commented that tuned pipes only work with low nitro, otherwise they
>> make a lot of vibration. Does this make sense to you?
>>
>> How long have you been runing your setup?
>>
>> Ever have any problems with radio interference or metal parts snapping
>> themselves?
>>
>> Thanks!
>>
>>
>> On Fri, 18 Jul 2003 13:30:24 -0500, "Trowelfaz"
>> <trowelfaz@MAPSONhotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> >I am running a C30SRX w/ O.S .32SH-H (non-ring), CP30% and a HeliMax

>Tuned
>> >Pipe with great success (great power and FAST). Needle is about 1-1/8 -

>1/14
>> >turns out. Tower has it for $31.99 (P/N: LXM039
>> >http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXM039&P=7 )
>> >The only problems I have had is the coupling blowing out. I since changed

>to
>> >automotive heater hose w/hose clamps and it works great!
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >"OldSchool" <OldSchool@here.com> wrote in message
>> >news:l2dghvsfntb1kajhhhl5sfcsb6qlvbljl9@4ax.com.. .
>> >>
>> >> I have a OS 32sx powered concept. What type of exhaust system is best
>> >> with CP 30% fuel?
>> >

>>

>


Old Jul 21, 2003, 03:01 AM
Beav
Guest
n/a Posts
Re: What to use with 30-size & 30% nitro: tuned pipe, tuned muffler, or muffler?


"OldSchool" <OldSchool@here.com> wrote in message
news:964khvgb33fc5evb8eg9vcksnol4eu3j07@4ax.com...
> Beav,
>
> What type of hi compression-no nitro engine do you use?


Rossi.

What type of
> exhaust?


Rossi pipe and manifold.
>
> With higher nitro, I need to run richer...right?


Yep.

More turns out on
> the main needle I think. Don't laugh, I'm new at all this.


Well you're learning, coz you're right :-)



--
Beav


Please note my E-mail address is "beavis dot original at ntlworld dot com"
(with the obvious changes)

Beavisland now lives at
www.beavisoriginal.co.uk


Old Jul 21, 2003, 03:01 AM
Beav
Guest
n/a Posts
Re: What to use with 30-size & 30% nitro: tuned pipe, tuned muffler, or muffler?


"OldSchool" <OldSchool@here.com> wrote in message
news:ia4khv8h8h77ephm5b5k16bq02rpe1fojn@4ax.com...
> Trowelfaz,
>
> How do you know when it is too lean, just right, or too rich?


O acombination of sound and sight. When you're too rich, the engine SOUNDS
"wet" and slobbery and it doesn't respond well to throttle commands. If it's
TOO too rich, opening the throttle will put the fire out and the engine
quits.

If it's too lean, the engine sounds harsh and "buzzy" and there's very
little evidence of smoke from the exhaust. If it's TOO too lean, the engine
will respond VERY quickly to throttle commands, but sometimes (most times)
it'll rev and refuse to cme back to an idle without "hanging onto" the
previous high revs.

Do you
> have a method for setting the needle valve?


I start with the main needle at 2 full turns out and then begin to lean out
gradually.

How often do you have to
> reset it?


I do it twice per year as the weather conditions change from winter to
summer and back again. It's definitely not something that you should need to
do every flight, every week, or even every now and again.



--
Beav


Please note my E-mail address is "beavis dot original at ntlworld dot com"
(with the obvious changes)

Beavisland now lives at
www.beavisoriginal.co.uk


Old Jul 21, 2003, 03:01 AM
Trowelfaz
Guest
n/a Posts
Re: What to use with 30-size & 30% nitro: tuned pipe, tuned muffler, or muffler?

Beav is dead-on with the tuning of the mixture. With mine, I have about 3
clicks of the needle before is falls out of range. For me, a fast headspeed
(sound and feel - before I installed a governor), overreving on a fast
decent after a fast ascent (hard for a newbie to perform), not as much
oil/smoke as normal and it is too lean. Very sluggish throttle/response,
lower head speed and a TON of oil everywhere is too rich for me. Now, I just
go off of noise and smoke. I usually only reset the needle twice a year -
spring and fall, and that is only about 2-3 clicks. I have yet to have to
mess with the low speed needle after initial set, which usually only varies
about 1/8 turn from factory on OS engines for me/my location. However,
lately I have reset the high speed a few times trying to work out some bugs,
but it still always is at the same position when I am done.

I would suggest getting someone to help with your engine setup. Once they
get it dialed in to where it runs good and you like the response, the next
time you feel like fiddling with it, take note first of how many turns the
needle is out (with the carb barrel closed - and don't crank in the needle
hard else you will bend the end).

On that same note, my planes needles are *never* touched unless I put one in
the ground. Every time, they are nuts on (or close enough for me). I crack
up at the guys at the field who always touch the needle, and usually wind up
dead sticking or spend the entire day tweaking it. They finally get it right
at the end of the day, then start over the next day. These are the same ones
who insist every needle must be exactly 2 turns out. No more, no less. I
just set mine to my tach, and re-tach at every start. Dead on every time. I

Beav" <beavis.original@ntloxoworld.com> wrote in message
news:EKuSa.599943$ZC.89409@news.easynews.com...
>
> "OldSchool" <OldSchool@here.com> wrote in message
> news:ia4khv8h8h77ephm5b5k16bq02rpe1fojn@4ax.com...
> > Trowelfaz,
> >
> > How do you know when it is too lean, just right, or too rich?

>
> O acombination of sound and sight. When you're too rich, the engine SOUNDS
> "wet" and slobbery and it doesn't respond well to throttle commands. If

it's
> TOO too rich, opening the throttle will put the fire out and the engine
> quits.
>
> If it's too lean, the engine sounds harsh and "buzzy" and there's very
> little evidence of smoke from the exhaust. If it's TOO too lean, the

engine
> will respond VERY quickly to throttle commands, but sometimes (most times)
> it'll rev and refuse to cme back to an idle without "hanging onto" the
> previous high revs.
>
> Do you
> > have a method for setting the needle valve?

>
> I start with the main needle at 2 full turns out and then begin to lean

out
> gradually.
>
> How often do you have to
> > reset it?

>
> I do it twice per year as the weather conditions change from winter to
> summer and back again. It's definitely not something that you should need

to
> do every flight, every week, or even every now and again.
>
>
>
> --
> Beav
>
>
> Please note my E-mail address is "beavis dot original at ntlworld dot com"
> (with the obvious changes)
>
> Beavisland now lives at
> www.beavisoriginal.co.uk
>
>



 


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