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Old Feb 04, 2013, 04:02 AM
2 metre rule applies!
DRAMJET's Avatar
BOOGI, Australia
Joined Dec 2008
1,321 Posts
Nigel, would have been an awesome event when all those Vulcans departed for the tag relay to the Falklands in the early eighties. (Well before car alarms became vogue)
Great footage, love that reporter with the approaching Spitfire, you can hear his...um ....anticipation
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Old Feb 04, 2013, 04:19 AM
222 km/hr Parkjet flyer
solentlife's Avatar
Latvia, Ventspils pilsēta, Ventspils
Joined Jan 2010
9,044 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by DRAMJET View Post
Nigel, would have been an awesome event when all those Vulcans departed for the tag relay to the Falklands in the early eighties. (Well before car alarms became vogue)
Great footage, love that reporter with the approaching Spitfire, you can hear his...um ....anticipation
The Falklands raid is on Youtube .... brilliant vid ... just a shame that I doubt such characters and ability today ...

I can remember the sadistic pilots of Lightnings ... on ships round Scotland .. they'd come across the water ... open up and pass over us - deafening ....

I was there for GW1 ... and when we finally were able to get out - we wqent out via Bahrain ... The old terminal building had a plate glass view over the runway ..

First the tanker took of .......... then the 3 Jaguar ground attack jobs in V ... then the Tornado's in V ... followed by Buccaneers ... 3 in perfect V ... Without lifting - they tucked up wheels .... straight down runway ... then up and split 1 to left, 1 centre, 1 to right .... then curved round together and in close V came down the runway feet of the deck ... Everyone stood up regardless of nationality ... applauding what was one of the last sorties before Buccaneers were de-commisioned. Proud ? You bet ... Tears - certainly.

Nigel
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Old Feb 04, 2013, 05:50 AM
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Valkpilot's Avatar
Joined Mar 2012
754 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by solentlife View Post
The Falklands raid is on Youtube .... brilliant vid ... just a shame that I doubt such characters and ability today ...

I can remember the sadistic pilots of Lightnings ... on ships round Scotland .. they'd come across the water ... open up and pass over us - deafening ....

I was there for GW1 ... and when we finally were able to get out - we wqent out via Bahrain ... The old terminal building had a plate glass view over the runway ..

First the tanker took of .......... then the 3 Jaguar ground attack jobs in V ... then the Tornado's in V ... followed by Buccaneers ... 3 in perfect V ... Without lifting - they tucked up wheels .... straight down runway ... then up and split 1 to left, 1 centre, 1 to right .... then curved round together and in close V came down the runway feet of the deck ... Everyone stood up regardless of nationality ... applauding what was one of the last sorties before Buccaneers were de-commisioned. Proud ? You bet ... Tears - certainly.

Nigel
The Vulcan take-off video was good, but in real life, I hope they had a better response time. By the time thet one plane got off, we'd have at least 3 B-52s
in the air.
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Old Feb 04, 2013, 06:58 AM
we can take off without that
green_flyer's Avatar
London, UK
Joined Nov 2008
898 Posts
Here is a static test of the Tenshock 20.5mm 5100kv inrunner with Lander rotor. This motor gives the most thrust on 3s 850mah out of all the motors I have tested so far. Thrust settled to 352g after 17sec (I wanted to run to 20s but mistimed the video).
My reason for testing these (and not going to 4s and bigger batteries) - I am searching for a fan/motor combination that will provide 1:1 thrust/weight with the stock size 3s 850mah battery, at least for a while.

So far, these 2 motors (Tenshock 5100kv and Turnigy 5000kv) have the potential to provide 1:1+ for at least 10sec for a stock JPower jet using a higher C battery of 850mah size. I wouldnt really want to draw any more amps than this from a battery this small.

A-frame__Motor+Fan________Peak T___After10sec__A(after 10s)__Watts(10s)
F35_____Tenshock+LanderR__393g____353g_______20.27 A______206
F35_____Turnigy+LanderR____366g____332g_______21.5 2A______221

price comparison:
Tenshock 5100kv motor $58.21
Turnigy2610 5000kv motor $13.45

F35 Tenshock 5100kv (50g) Lander 50mm rotor (0 min 33 sec)


I'm hoping Hobby King will start selling the Lander adaptor as well as their rotors to make this solution an almost off-the shelf set up (apart from having to sand about 1mm off the tips of the Lander rotor blades).

In the meantime I got 3 adaptors directly from Lander. Their new adaptors are of improved design, tighter fit on the 3mm shaft, excellent, and very tight fit on the rotor. The motor shaft hole is 9.5mm deep, which is fine for the Lander alloy housing, but could be a bit deeper for use in the JPower/Haoye housings.



Because I didnt want to drill out the adaptor and risk making the fit to the motor shaft less tight, I made a simple 2mm plastic spacer ring to insert in front of the motor so rotor would sit inside the housing.



There are several ways of gripping the adaptor when tightening the rotor nut on inrunners (on outrunners you just hold the bell). You can file a flat on the adaptor to hold with pliers, I chose to drill a hole for a brass securing pin in the rotor and adaptor.



Weight of Tenshock motor, Haoye housing, Lander rotor and Phoenix 25.



Final weight of F35 (with approx 30g extra light damage protection added).



I bought one of these piezo vibration senors to help with dynamic balancing.

https://www.sparkfun.com/products/9199

UK source:

http://proto-pic.co.uk/piezo-vibrati...ll-horizontal/

They simply hook up to a volt meter and generate a voltage proportional to vibration.
A word of warning, do not use super glue to attach them to the fan housing, it wicks onto the sensor strip making it less sensitive (luckily I ordered 2).
They are fiddly to use, and to ensure you get a reliable reading ideally you need to use some sort of throttle stop if you want to do your balancing at low throttle. Otherwise, every time you move the tape on the rotor dome round by 45 degrees to get the next reading, you will throttle up to a slightly different setting and the vibration reading may be increased because of the difference in throttle rather than difference in counter weight (tape) position on the rotor.
For this reason I was too lazy to continue balancing with the sensor and just used touch and hearing to dynamically balance as best as I could.

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Last edited by green_flyer; Feb 04, 2013 at 07:08 AM.
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Old Feb 04, 2013, 07:24 AM
Registered User
Vienna, Austria
Joined Apr 2007
2,141 Posts
Great results with the Tenshock, it's loads more efficient than the outrunner, and therefore has to shave off much less heat, way to go if you want that extra efficiency!
Also interesting to see that you're also back to "feel" the fan for vibrations, so far that worked better for me than a dynamic balancer with the small 50mm units...
The AMX without reinforcements (!) would be the most obvious candidate for me to try getting 1:1
With the stocker it's 300g including a 850mA lipo, and even with the stock motor and fan it does pretty impressive verticals. Put the tenshock combo in and it will go up even better...
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Old Feb 04, 2013, 08:02 AM
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Mrgeorgedoors's Avatar
United Kingdom, Warrington
Joined Nov 2012
553 Posts
I've seen that spitfire pass before a while ago, u think he knew it was comin ?lol

That lightning is awesome
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Old Feb 04, 2013, 08:35 AM
222 km/hr Parkjet flyer
solentlife's Avatar
Latvia, Ventspils pilsēta, Ventspils
Joined Jan 2010
9,044 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Valkpilot View Post
The Vulcan take-off video was good, but in real life, I hope they had a better response time. By the time thet one plane got off, we'd have at least 3 B-52s
in the air.
That's XH-558 ... the last surviving Vulcan and definitely not taking off as it would have done in real situation. But they were designed really for one thing - Nuclear delivery ... when the Vulcan went down to Falklands to bomb the airfield ... she had to be worked on to do the job ...

Lets be honest the days of the big bomber are like the big capital ships .. a hangover of old days ... considering the destructive power that can be carried on smaller airframes ... and it's accuracy.

Nigel
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Old Feb 04, 2013, 08:48 AM
222 km/hr Parkjet flyer
solentlife's Avatar
Latvia, Ventspils pilsēta, Ventspils
Joined Jan 2010
9,044 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrgeorgedoors View Post
I've seen that spitfire pass before a while ago, u think he knew it was comin ?lol

That lightning is awesome
I'm told that the Spitty pilot - actually a Civilian Display Pilot who flies it fopr shows etc. is known for his 'antics' ! I'm also told that the Reporter was not aware it was going to happen.

There's actually a better vid of the Lightning ... where a Harrier Pilot goes up with Instructor in a twin seater ... as the Lightning leaves the runway - the Instructior tells pilot to pull back on the stick and 'experience' a real vertical T/O ....

As far as i remember - thr standard Lightning could vertical to about 18,000 ft before speed bled of and is why you usually see them in vids curve of to one side ... and the altitude that one reached to intercept a U2 was 89,000 ft !! According to online reports.

Nicknamed "14 tons of screaming aluminium" ......

Anyway - apologies to others for thread drift !!

Nigel
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Old Feb 04, 2013, 10:40 AM
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gooniac33's Avatar
Sunnyvale
Joined Feb 2009
5,178 Posts
Good stuff!! Only thing is that it was me actually doing the video of mine!! That happened over my house!! An F/A-18 at full afterburner no less....LOL
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Old Feb 04, 2013, 11:27 AM
we can take off without that
green_flyer's Avatar
London, UK
Joined Nov 2008
898 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by mopetista View Post
Great results with the Tenshock, it's loads more efficient than the outrunner, and therefore has to shave off much less heat, way to go if you want that extra efficiency!
Also interesting to see that you're also back to "feel" the fan for vibrations, so far that worked better for me than a dynamic balancer with the small 50mm units...
The AMX without reinforcements (!) would be the most obvious candidate for me to try getting 1:1
With the stocker it's 300g including a 850mA lipo, and even with the stock motor and fan it does pretty impressive verticals. Put the tenshock combo in and it will go up even better...
Thanks! I was thinking the AMX too, the bare airframe weighs only 120g. I think the Hawk bare airframe is around that weight too. Both of these with either set up would be interesting.
120g airframe
30g servos/rx/glue
90g fan&motor&esc (-3g for Turnigy set up, mostly because it can use the lighter stock housing)
76g 850mah Nanotech

316g AUW!
settled thrust 330g - 350g
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Old Feb 04, 2013, 04:49 PM
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Valkpilot's Avatar
Joined Mar 2012
754 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by solentlife View Post
That's XH-558 ... the last surviving Vulcan and definitely not taking off as it would have done in real situation. But they were designed really for one thing - Nuclear delivery ... when the Vulcan went down to Falklands to bomb the airfield ... she had to be worked on to do the job ...

Lets be honest the days of the big bomber are like the big capital ships .. a hangover of old days ... considering the destructive power that can be carried on smaller airframes ... and it's accuracy.

Nigel
Don't count the big boys out. There have been and will be times when you need
to haul a lot of iron to somewhere outside of carrier range. And they do make
a good cruise missile platform. Can you imabine how many Boeing ACLMs
you could strap on to a B-36?
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Old Feb 04, 2013, 05:01 PM
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texbird's Avatar
USA, TX, Austin
Joined Jan 2011
359 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by solentlife View Post
i hope to be home next days .. So will try remember to put together 'nigels cheapo' 50mm mods for ballistic flight !

I hope it will help others on a budget and save them a lot of work ...

If i forget - someone prod me !!

Nigel
prod
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Old Feb 04, 2013, 06:18 PM
hjukhjuk
gooby's Avatar
United States, FL
Joined Feb 2012
1,066 Posts
I love this little jet, so much fun doing low passes. I would give it a 9/10 with the only complaints being the dead servo and slightly warped wing.
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Old Feb 04, 2013, 06:55 PM
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Mrgeorgedoors's Avatar
United Kingdom, Warrington
Joined Nov 2012
553 Posts
Just finished my 2nd sabre can't wait to try again hopefully won't crash this time 😳




Both different setups

Posted in my sabre thread carried on from my 1st build
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1780213

Rod
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Old Feb 05, 2013, 12:53 AM
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gooniac33's Avatar
Sunnyvale
Joined Feb 2009
5,178 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by green_flyer View Post
Thanks! I was thinking the AMX too, the bare airframe weighs only 120g. I think the Hawk bare airframe is around that weight too. Both of these with either set up would be interesting.
120g airframe
30g servos/rx/glue
90g fan&motor&esc (-3g for Turnigy set up, mostly because it can use the lighter stock housing)
76g 850mah Nanotech

316g AUW!
settled thrust 330g - 350g
I love the AMX!! You need to get the rates right to get it flying well but once you do that you will love it! Full throttle low passes are a thing to behold!!
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