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Old Dec 03, 2010, 06:46 PM
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Can anyone give me a feedback on Art tech plane I mentioned above. Someone has a good deal on it with parts available so I need to get it quick if its a suitable one
The plane you linked to in your original post sold by Banana Hobby. Watch the video, and you'll see the owner of Banana Hobby doing the demo flight.

BH has just about the absolute worst reputation, from what I've seen here on RC Groups, of any vendor here.

In addition, the plane does not retail for $450 as BH claims.
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Old Dec 03, 2010, 08:46 PM
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I have had this question for a LONG time and now seems to as good a time as any to ask it. If it has been addressed, I have missed it.

Why not buy a decent 4 channel and only use the rudder and elevator on a 4 channel ... just to begin. Ignore the ailerons for a bit. Use it like a 3 channel for starters. ????
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Old Dec 03, 2010, 09:02 PM
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Originally Posted by dkrhardy View Post
I have had this question for a LONG time and now seems to as good a time as any to ask it. If it has been addressed, I have missed it.

Why not buy a decent 4 channel and only use the rudder and elevator on a 4 channel ... just to begin. Ignore the ailerons for a bit. Use it like a 3 channel for starters. ????
Lack of dihedral in the wing is probably the biggest one. In other words they don't want to naturally fly upright like a 3 channel plane does you have to use the ailerons to keep it upright.
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Old Dec 04, 2010, 03:39 AM
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The plane you linked to in your original post sold by Banana Hobby. Watch the video, and you'll see the owner of Banana Hobby doing the demo flight.

BH has just about the absolute worst reputation, from what I've seen here on RC Groups, of any vendor here.

In addition, the plane does not retail for $450 as BH claims.

Thanks for the reply. the Art=tech Cessna 182 2.4 Brushless link was just the reference to the plane I had in mind. I can get it for $150USD including shipping to New Zealand which to me is a good deal.
I just wanted to know what are the thoughts and feedback on that particular plane for a beginner?


Also there is a Dynam Cessna EP400 2.4 Brushless, I read in few places that it was a poor quality product , can anyone confirm?
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Old Dec 04, 2010, 09:56 AM
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Lack of dihedral in the wing is probably the biggest one. In other words they don't want to naturally fly upright like a 3 channel plane does you have to use the ailerons to keep it upright.
Got it! It is a stability issue. Hmmmm So there are no 4 channel a/c out there with the required/desired dihedral? I'm dying for an excuse to get out of cars and helis buy don't want to go 3 channel then later go 4 channel which likely would mean a new radio. The RTF trainers come with a 3 channel radio.
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Old Dec 04, 2010, 10:24 AM
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Got it! It is a stability issue. Hmmmm So there are no 4 channel a/c out there with the required/desired dihedral? I'm dying for an excuse to get out of cars and helis buy don't want to go 3 channel then later go 4 channel which likely would mean a new radio. The RTF trainers come with a 3 channel radio.
It's not really a stability issue. That's just a side-effect. The issue is that with a 3-channel plane it is the dihedral that causes the plane to bank and turn. With a 4-channel plane you have direct control of the bank via ailerons, so 4-channel planes generally have much less dihedral than 3-channel planes.

If you want to get into flying planes, just buy a decent radio and then you can use it with all of your planes. A good radio is expensive, but consider it an investment that will give you a jump-start into the hobby. Besides, with a good radio, you will have much more range than the RTF radios (1/2 mile or so vs a few hundred feet) and won't have to worry about losing signal.
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Old Dec 04, 2010, 10:33 AM
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Got it! It is a stability issue. Hmmmm So there are no 4 channel a/c out there with the required/desired dihedral? I'm dying for an excuse to get out of cars and helis buy don't want to go 3 channel then later go 4 channel which likely would mean a new radio. The RTF trainers come with a 3 channel radio.
I am sure there are 4 channel aircraft with the required dihedral but I am just not aware of them. Nothing I personally own with ailerons is self correcting and most are not.

All but the very cheapest radios will be 4 channels. Radios are a tough decision to make if you ask me especially for the beginner. There is a bunch of different brands and different models with in the brands. With the 2.4ghz radios once you make your decision you are basically tied to that brand. You hear about more crashes on Spektrum gear than other brands but they have the vast majority of the market. Why that is is open to debate and best left other places. If you look at EFlite and Parkzone planes that come RTF they are all going to use Spektrum gear. I think the RTF everything in one box planes are great I have a bunch of them myself. The problem is if you want a brand of radio other than Spektrum or JR you have to change receivers on some planes which is no big deal but an added cost. When it comes to the micro 2.4ghz stuff like the vapor, micro cx heli, msr heli etc you are out of luck. You either own a spektrum radio or you don't fly them.

Model memory is another thing to consider. Once you get away from the basic radios you gain model memory so that it is easy to fly more than one model with the radio. Thats an added cost especially for a beginner that might decide RC planes are not their thing. I have a Spektrum DX6i as a backup radio. For the beginner that is sure they will get more than one plane I think its a great deal. They are around 150 bucks new (I think) and have a 10 model memory. The DX6i is very flexible as far as programming goes. It takes a fairly complex model before you need a radio with more channels/features than the DX6i. So if you start out with a DX6i or similar it might be years before you need a different radio and maybe never.

If possible find a way to try RC planes before you buy and see if you think you will stick with it. That can help your decision making tremendously. You might think they are great and they might not be your thing.
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Old Dec 04, 2010, 10:33 AM
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Hmmmm So there are no 4 channel a/c out there with the required/desired dihedral?
GWS E-Starter can be flown as 3 or 4 channel. One of the most popular 4 channel aileron trainers ever sold. Flies like a dream as a 3 channel too.

Here's a stock one, using a brushless upgrade, with a stock airframe.... no flattening of the wings, or anything being flown as a 4 channel by a real master... RCG member "sheetmetalflyer", Jay Arzaga.

Chuck

Estarter doing rolling circles (4 min 5 sec)
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Old Dec 04, 2010, 10:37 AM
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See thats exactly my point. If you are used to rudder on the right stick and the plane being self righting if you let go of the sticks its an issue. Bank an aileron plane over and get in trouble after changing from three to four channels whats the first thing a new flyer is going to do ? They are going to let go of the sticks and wait for the plane to self correct. The plane is going to smash itself while they stand there and watch it.

I guess I just see it as being easier to learn four new things all at once than trying learn three things and let them become reflexes and then try to unlearn part of what you are used to and throw something new in the mix on top of it.
So what's the first thing a new flyer is going to do with a 4-channel plane if they have not flown 3-channel? Pull the stick to the side, hold it, and watch the plane bank over and nose-dive. Regardless of your previous experience, you are going to make mistakes.

Even with 3-channel planes, you don't rely on the dihedral to level the plane. You still have to steer out of turns if you want to have any control over which direction the plane ends up going. The extra dihedral simply gives the plane a natural desire to fly level which is very helpful to a new pilot who already has his hands full trying to keep the plane from hitting the ground or the trees.

I would say that it is easier to learn the basics and then add more later than to try to learn everything at once. Personally, I think it would have been far more frustrating if I had attempted to teach myself to fly starting with a 4-channel plane.
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Old Dec 04, 2010, 10:43 AM
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I just saw the eRC J-5 trainer thread and looked at the on-line manual. It shows that the dihedral is changed via the strut mountings when you cut the ailerons loose to convert to 4 channel. But it seems it is very new and not many owner reports. I'm in no rush so I'll keeping watching. In the meantime I'll look up the GWS E-starter. Thanks to you all for good info and TRYING to steer me in the right direction!
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Old Dec 04, 2010, 10:56 AM
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So what's the first thing a new flyer is going to do with a 4-channel plane if they have not flown 3-channel? Pull the stick to the side, hold it, and watch the plane bank over and nose-dive. Regardless of your previous experience, you are going to make mistakes.

Even with 3-channel planes, you don't rely on the dihedral to level the plane. You still have to steer out of turns if you want to have any control over which direction the plane ends up going. The extra dihedral simply gives the plane a natural desire to fly level which is very helpful to a new pilot who already has his hands full trying to keep the plane from hitting the ground or the trees.

I would say that it is easier to learn the basics and then add more later than to try to learn everything at once. Personally, I think it would have been far more frustrating if I had attempted to teach myself to fly starting with a 4-channel plane.

Yeah everybody makes mistakes when they are learning. Heck I hit a parked school bus when I was learning with a 40 size nitro trainer. I still get grief over that and it was ten years ago We subscribe to two different lines of thinking about how to best learn. I guess probably the best way is up to each individual and what they are comfortable with.
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Old Dec 04, 2010, 11:03 AM
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HobbyZone Champ. $89 includes the plane, batteries, 2.4 GHz transmitter, and battery charger. Does loops, rolls, and flies inverted as you can see. 3 channel...


Hobbyzone Champ crazy flying (5 min 6 sec)
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Old Dec 04, 2010, 01:50 PM
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Still no one answered my question above !!!
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Old Dec 04, 2010, 02:00 PM
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Still no one answered my question above !!!
The reason no one has answered your question is that so few of us own this plane.
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Old Dec 04, 2010, 02:01 PM
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The reason no one has answered your question is that so few of us own this plane.
So what have owned as a 4-ch trainer?
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