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Old Oct 19, 2012, 05:21 AM
Southern Pride
everydayflyer's Avatar
Haralson County GA. USA
Joined Oct 2004
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Quote:
With HH gyros revo mix can't be used. It would cause the heli to yaw whenever the stick was moved away from the trimmed position.
How many here using fairly inexpensive gyros and tail servos have a perfect tail ? OK then stop reading!


I have a Blade CP with sucky e Flite gyro from a Blade 400 from year past, The CP has been converyted to BL with a Hi Max 175 watts motor. I only fly it in HH mode and without Revo Mix in rge Transmitter it will do a 180 to 270 during a hard punch outmwith Revo it moves perhaps 10 dregrees max.


Had exactly the same issue with B400 with a 401 gyro on it and Revo mix fixed it.


I have read all of the Do Not Use Trims etc. with FBL / HH Gyros etc. Some seem to think that every rule or everything they have experienced applies in all cases.


In the past two weeks I have read thousands of post on FBL units. Some say do not use Trans. trim as the unit will see the trim at the sart of each flight and adjust for it thus canceling it thus requiring more etc. etc..


Some say Do Not Use any Trans. Trim at startup as in Normal Flight Mode but you can trim in St.1 / St .2 etc., as the FBL sees no trim when booting up and will see the trims inother flght. modes as normal stick inputs.


Some read what another post and repost it till it becomes internet fact.

IO have seen first hand a Tarot ZYX-s on a B450 which has has had some Trans. trim in Normal / St1 and St2 since the first flight over a month ago to correct a very slight drift. It has not gotten worse, has not self canceled .


For years a Gyro seting of less than 50 placed X gyro in Rtae mode and a setting above 51 placed it in HH mode.
What if I told you I have FBL units that stay in HH mode with Trans. set as low as 20?

Setting D/R to 70% or 50% etc. with servos connected to receiver does not change their travel ( EPA) correct and does not change their speed ,correct?


Guess what some FBL units changing the D/R (EPA) to less than 100% does in fact slow the servos down and does not reduce (limit) their total movement.

Charles
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Last edited by everydayflyer; Oct 19, 2012 at 05:37 AM.
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Old Oct 19, 2012, 06:14 AM
I don't want to "Switch Now"
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Toronto (Don Mills), Canada
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Quote:
Originally Posted by everydayflyer View Post


In the past two weeks I have read thousands of post on FBL units. Some say do not use Trans. trim as the unit will see the trim at the sart of each flight and adjust for it thus canceling it thus requiring more etc. etc..


Some say Do Not Use any Trans. Trim at startup as in Normal Flight Mode but you can trim in St.1 / St .2 etc., as the FBL sees no trim when booting up and will see the trims inother flght. modes as normal stick inputs.


Some read what another post and repost it till it becomes internet fact.

IO have seen first hand a Tarot ZYX-s on a B450 which has has had some Trans. trim in Normal / St1 and St2 since the first flight over a month ago to correct a very slight drift. It has not gotten worse, has not self canceled .


I have used and suggested the idle up trim trick for the 401B gyro to correct drift. It works well
As you say, the gyro gets its reference on boot up in normal mode, then flipping to idle up the rudder trim fixes the gyros zero offset error. No reason why the same trick could not be used with an FBL unit since they have similar methods of operation.

Quote:

Setting D/R to 70% or 50% etc. with servos connected to receiver does not change their travel ( EPA) correct and does not change their speed ,correct?


Guess what some FBL units changing the D/R (EPA) to less than 100% does in fact slow the servos down and does not reduce (limit) their total movement.

Charles
This makes perfect sense. With an FBL unit the stick input does not command the servos, it commands a rate of movement from the heli.
It is up to the FBL unit to decide how much servo travel is needed to produce it. This is just like a conventional gyro in HH mode. ATV/EPA affects yaw rate, limit of servo travel is done on the gyro itself.

Pat MacKenzie
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Old Oct 19, 2012, 07:17 AM
Looptastic!
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Enschede, Netherlands
Joined Nov 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by everydayflyer View Post
How many here using fairly inexpensive gyros and tail servos have a perfect tail ? OK then stop reading!

....


I don't know Charles, do you? May i keep reading or not?

Q:
Can a trimmed 401B do fast backwards flight and consistent traveling piro rate? If so i'd say it is acceptabel to use beyond simple forward flight and loops skill level. If not, its a waste of money.


For me this topic is starting to feel like that post of a "Othmanskn" that used 3 HH gyros to make his first ever CCPM flybarred heli "easy to fly"
Some are immune to reason or logic it seems
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Old Oct 19, 2012, 08:55 AM
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This is kinda like apple VS IBM or Using a computer VS video game system lol! Why a lot of people like or love eflite because they pick the electronics that come with it and for the most part fly out of the box. One reason Align has started only selling combos. These companies have already tried and tested what works and what don't. They are not perfect (eflites servos suck and so does align 3gx) . I guess we should just be glad that you can take out what comes with them. Soon they may start making every thing propitiatory and you will have no choice (apple)
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Old Oct 19, 2012, 12:46 PM
Southern Pride
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Haralson County GA. USA
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Yet some say the eFlite DS76 servos are very good. rated a post of HF where someone stated they had over 400 flights on their B450X with all original electronics.
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Old Oct 19, 2012, 03:45 PM
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I have gone threw three ds76t. One burned up and I mean on fire, one didn't work out of the package, and one started twitching after about 10 packs. The lhs has returned a lot.

On the other end I have three 75's on one of my 250's that has gone threw 100's of flights.
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Old Oct 20, 2012, 08:14 AM
rcflyer
UK
Joined Jun 2010
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Do I need to get an ESC with governor mode? What does it do?

Cheers
Jim
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Old Oct 20, 2012, 09:03 AM
just gotta mess with it!
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North West Louisiana
Joined Nov 2009
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Governor mode

Most heli ESC's come with a governor mode feature. With nitro helis, governor mode is almost essential for maintaining a constant headspeed, which for helis is just about the holy grail for making the heli respond responsively to control inputs.

Electric motors have more favourable torque characteristics, though, so headspeed doesn't tend to drop as much under load as it does for a nitro engine, so many electric flyers don't bother with governor mode, especially on smaller helis.

I started out with nitro helis, so I think that's why I like to use governor mode on my 450. It means the heli will feel the same at the end of a flight as at the beginning, which I prefer. Some governor modes are better than others. Of the ESC's I've used thus far, I would rank the governor modes in the following order - Turnigy Superbrain 40A, Hobbywing Platinum Pro 40A, Turnigy Blue Series. The Superbrain does a great job keeping the HS within a really tight range, but at the expense of accelerated OWB wear. Though the Hobbywing doesn't hold the HS so well, it also doesn't cause premature wear of the OWB.

When you use governor mode, your throttle "curve" is set to a flat line - eg you might use 75% in normal mode, 80% in stunt 1 and 85% in stunt 2. That means you have to power up the heli in throttle hold, and then start it by flipping throttle hold off. Governor mode usually enables a super soft start feature in the ESC, which enables the heli to spool up without doing a mad "chicken dance".

One benefit of using governor mode is that you can make your normal mode into another aerobatic flight mode. I guess you could do that even without using governor mode, but only if your ESC has a sufficiently soft start.
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Old Oct 20, 2012, 09:19 AM
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FWIW, I tried a Turnigy Blue to see if the governor worked. As far as I could tell it did absolutely nothing.
A lot of the cheap ESC programming cards have "governor mode" on them (Turnigy Plush for example), but it does nothing at all.

If you want a good governor then consider getting a Castle Phoenix 45., but you will need an external BEC.

Pat MacKenzie
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Old Oct 20, 2012, 12:36 PM
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Just set this one up today

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...ontroller.html

With this motor

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...ize_heli_.html

I tacho'ed it @83% at 2950 rpm with a nanotech 2200ma 35-70c

With my audio android app tacho, I gave it some good old pitch pumps, and the headspeed never dropped more than 80 rpm, way better than my hobbywing platinum, whichyou can hear bogging with the same manoevers.
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Old Oct 20, 2012, 01:24 PM
just gotta mess with it!
2Doggs's Avatar
North West Louisiana
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Weight?

I keep hearing good things about the YEP ESC's, and their active freewheel feature seems like a great idea.

Does the 45A really weigh 62g though? That seems really heavy. My 80A Superbrain only weighs 52g.
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Old Oct 20, 2012, 01:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2Doggs View Post
I keep hearing good things about the YEP ESC's, and their active freewheel feature seems like a great idea.

Does the 45A really weigh 62g though? That seems really heavy. My 80A Superbrain only weighs 52g.
It's massive, it doesn't fit under the tray unless you stick some out of the front, but it's really impressive for the money. It's less than $25 for crying out loud!
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Old Oct 20, 2012, 02:02 PM
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Turnigy AE-45 is another good one too.
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Old Oct 20, 2012, 02:40 PM
Southern Pride
everydayflyer's Avatar
Haralson County GA. USA
Joined Oct 2004
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Waiting on stock for the YEP 45A as I too have read a lot of very favorable post on it.


My B400 has a puny eFlite 25A ESC in it and I feel I am pushing it a bit to hard. I just tacked the HS in St.1 75% 3050 and St.2 77% 3200. eFlite 4,200Kv with 10T , HK nanotech 2200 45C. ThunderPower CF blades, Tarot ZYX and Tarot FBL head..

Charles
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Old Oct 20, 2012, 03:46 PM
just gotta mess with it!
2Doggs's Avatar
North West Louisiana
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Originally Posted by fishfiend View Post
It's massive, it doesn't fit under the tray unless you stick some out of the front, but it's really impressive for the money. It's less than $25 for crying out loud!
Yes, and that's why it's always on back order! I can add you to Paul 1968 as being one of the so-and-so's responsible for that - and Charles will be my competitor for the next lot of stock!
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