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Old Nov 04, 2012, 04:16 PM
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Australia, QLD, Burua
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Originally Posted by TopDave View Post
Thought I should post this here as well as the MM450 Egyro section just for the info:
Got the conversion to E-Gyro done on the ol' VMX'r! Along with the Big Bore shock converted and installed and about 5 battery packs worth of re-tuning the chassis/radio setups to get the bike to go around my basement SX track as good as the MM450!
One of the biggest issues was the 4800 motor. Holy Horse Power Batman! Think jumping off a CR125 Honda onto a CR250 for the first time! I tried changing the throttle curve -did not like that- so I just dialed the thr. EPA back to 88%- Still faster than the MM450 motor but manageable. The steering was inconsistant and unstable at low speeds so I started looking for a reason for it. I had jumped straight to 80 wt oil in the steering damper so I suspected that , but I found 4 things that combined prolly cause it. First the right side front wheel bearing adapter (hex shaped) was a vvery loose fit in the wheel letting it wobble to and fro. shimmed that with some vinyl sheeting I found in my junk box. 2) found the steering damper's fork mount ball stud had loosened and was sloppy 3) The old HiTech buggie servo has some slop in the gear set -gonna live with that for a while. 4) The bike still wasn't as stable as the MM450, so I set the 2 bikes next to each othe and noticed the rear ride hights were different. the MM450 was lower in the rear, giving the bike a little more fork rake, so I lowered the VMX to match and now the bikes handle very simlar to each other. Happy now!
Glad you're sorting out the VMX Dave. You are right about the 4800kv motor, I enjoy the challenge of getting it around my track but in reality the 4200kv motor probably would be more consistent and much easier to put the power down. I like to use the big motor geared with a 13 pinion for big open spaces. I was out yesterday running in the paddock and even with 6000mh batteries its still hard to keep the front end down. While I was over their I played a little more with the rear shock. Since testing the rear shock with different wts and pistons and settling on 70 as the best I could find, I was running today on the big open paddock and it seemed slightly bouncy to me. I couldn't push the bike as hard as I would have liked. I tried 80wt but the rear didn't settle well ( too much pack ) and I ended up cartwheeling under brakes on bumps that had previously not been a problem. I was about to try 75wt when I thought bugger this I'm going back to what worked really well before which was 1 cap full of mugen 1000wt ( this time I'm using a cap full of axe rossi 1100wt oil) diff oil and the rest filled with 60wt Losi oil. Went for a run and don't ask me why but this setup works better than anything, the 70wt is close but not as good for some reason. Maybe 75wt might be the hot ticket. I suggest you try the oil mixing for the best results. Try 1000wt mugen oil and 60 wt Losi.
Just a thought, I run on hard packed slippery stuff usually and had to dial the rear brake down to 90 to reduce rear wheel locking as this motor also has more braking power.
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Old Nov 05, 2012, 09:06 AM
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Malaysia, Johor, Johor Bahru
Joined Nov 2011
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Hi there! I've been following this thread for some time and have learnt alot from this forum, I just upgraded my VMX450 to the egyro and the stability is just great!!! I can do slow turns now which was unthinkable with the mech gyro.
Just one question; the egyro makes a very loud noise when it runs. I lubed all the bearings before installation so is that normal?
Thanks in advance.
Nachi
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Old Nov 05, 2012, 10:04 AM
MY '75 CZ "FALTA REPLICA" 2010
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Waterford, Michigan
Joined May 2006
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Originally Posted by Nachiappan View Post
Hi there! I've been following this thread for some time and have learnt alot from this forum, I just upgraded my VMX450 to the egyro and the stability is just great!!! I can do slow turns now which was unthinkable with the mech gyro.
Just one question; the egyro makes a very loud noise when it runs. I lubed all the bearings before installation so is that normal?
Thanks in advance.
Nachi
yup, pretty noisy. Wouldn't worry unless it's a rubbing (missing a shim) or rumbling noise (bad bearing), or a big vibration (shaking, out of balance) noise.
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Old Nov 05, 2012, 11:20 AM
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United States, WA, Redmond
Joined Apr 2011
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As folks dust off their VMX's, install the egyro and run, I'm curious what gearing suggestions are for general bashing with the 4800kV motor? After the first few back flips, cracking the body and destroying Vinnie, the crazy power makes running an exercise in throttle control more than anything else.

Any gearing suggestions out there? EPA and throttle expo settings? I'm hoping the final solution is not buying the 4200kV motor (or less), as the total price for the egyro + motor is right around 65% of the AAR (even closer if you need tires, body, rider, etc.).
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Old Nov 05, 2012, 12:03 PM
MY '75 CZ "FALTA REPLICA" 2010
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Waterford, Michigan
Joined May 2006
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Originally Posted by marksp View Post
As folks dust off their VMX's, install the egyro and run, I'm curious what gearing suggestions are for general bashing with the 4800kV motor? After the first few back flips, cracking the body and destroying Vinnie, the crazy power makes running an exercise in throttle control more than anything else.

Any gearing suggestions out there? EPA and throttle expo settings? I'm hoping the final solution is not buying the 4200kV motor (or less), as the total price for the egyro + motor is right around 65% of the AAR (even closer if you need tires, body, rider, etc.).
No throttle expo because it ruins the throttle response ya need for low speed manuvers and the snap ya need for quick accelleration to make it over jumps right out of corners (on a track). Just dial back on the EPA until you like it. I set my EPA to 88% and it's still pretty punchy for my little basement track. Plus you can loosen up the slipper to your liking to avoid the wheelies if you are just bashing. Taller (bigger pinion) will help smooth out the power too. Chris (chktm) will chime in on the gearing, 11 12 13?
The cheapest (but hardest for me, lol) improvement you can make is training your throttle finger not to pull so hard. Hope this helps!
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Old Nov 05, 2012, 04:05 PM
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Australia, QLD, Burua
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marksp View Post
As folks dust off their VMX's, install the egyro and run, I'm curious what gearing suggestions are for general bashing with the 4800kV motor? After the first few back flips, cracking the body and destroying Vinnie, the crazy power makes running an exercise in throttle control more than anything else.

Any gearing suggestions out there? EPA and throttle expo settings? I'm hoping the final solution is not buying the 4200kV motor (or less), as the total price for the egyro + motor is right around 65% of the AAR (even closer if you need tires, body, rider, etc.).
I've never heard of anyone complaining of too much power, usually people want more lol. But I agree the 4800 is a handful. Maybe try what Dave has suggested as by gearing it up you usually do smooth out the power of a motor but in this case it has so much torque this only makes it harder to put down power. Maybe try an 11 or 12 pinion. I use 13 usually.
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Old Nov 06, 2012, 01:57 AM
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Speaking of motors, I've been having a run on the track this afternoon with the Tenshock motor and this is where you can pick the characteristics of the power. I was expecting an increase over the board on the 4800 one. This is not the case. What it feels like is the bottom end of the 5200 is smoother and less punchy, but then when you want it all you need do is squeeze a little more. Seems to keep pulling nicely throughout. Almost feels like a 4200 motor down low going into a 4800 up high. This allows me to stay nicely in control through and out of the corners and then have more zing for the straight. I'm quite enjoying it . The 4800 motor seems to have a little too much instantly and I found it harder to control out of the corners. Especially geared with the 13.
Conclusion is a more usable motor that still goes really hard. Just not what I was expecting. See what you think TJ.
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Old Nov 06, 2012, 10:14 AM
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chktm: That sounds about right. A motor with a lower wind (or higher kV rating) will have less torque. That's why you usually have to gear down when using a motor with fewer winds. You'll still get the benefit of higher RPM, but shouldn't expect more low-end punch.
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Old Nov 06, 2012, 10:24 AM
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I was wondering what the results would be once you got on some dirt your familiar with. I guess being 4 poles (3 more than the stock motor) the low end power is expected for sure but I would have thought it would be even more abrupt than the stock so thats nice that its not. Maybe the extra 400kv just isnt a big enough difference when your used to the 4800. (I guess the smaller kv tenshocks like a 4200 are pretty good on torque.) Wonder if you would see a bigger difference if you dropped 1-2 pinion sizes, so that the tenshock will have even more power on 12t but still pull up in speed like a 4800 on 13 at top end. Oh yeah, and TJ is saving his pennies before buying the egyro so it may be a while.
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Old Nov 06, 2012, 04:01 PM
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Stepping up from the 4200 to the 4800 was a big increase of power across the range and I was expecting a similar step up again. Was pleasantly surprised at the traction that could be found still and then revved to the moon. The gearing felt pretty good.
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Old Nov 06, 2012, 06:17 PM
If u aint 1st your last
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That sounds good Chris, i found that with my road bikes going from low kv to high the power delivery is a lot smoother & a higher top speed & still have plenty of punch for wheelies, but maybe try a 12 pinion just to see if it is more like the 4800 down low but it sounds like you are happy with 13 set up i can't wait to try mine, for crazy stupid power for a bit of fun i reckon i could run it on 3s if i used a separate small 2s with a switch in between it & the e-gyro speedo like the e-gyro set up on my arx.

Yes John my save a penny e-gyro fund is coming along nicely should not be long now, i am also accepting donations.
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Old Nov 06, 2012, 06:34 PM
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lol, glad to hear it. Hey TJ, whats the story with your friend getting his mm450. Did it get lost? Is the mail man playing with his bike or something? Is he able to track order?
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Old Nov 06, 2012, 06:44 PM
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Originally Posted by JohnnyMc View Post
lol, glad to hear it. Hey TJ, whats the story with your friend getting his mm450. Did it get lost? Is the mail man playing with his bike or something? Is he able to track order?
lol, it arrived not long ago i think it done the world tour, i should charge it & give it a run before i tell him it is here lol.
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Old Nov 06, 2012, 10:30 PM
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Just been having a look at my mates mm the forks are fully stuck i tried to push them in but i did not want to use too much force in case it ruins the o-rings so i will have to do the fork service before he can even use it.

And Deegan is much firmer & feels tougher than vinnie.
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Old Nov 06, 2012, 10:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Guidoracer View Post
chktm: That sounds about right. A motor with a lower wind (or higher kV rating) will have less torque. That's why you usually have to gear down when using a motor with fewer winds. You'll still get the benefit of higher RPM, but shouldn't expect more low-end punch.
Going from a single pole to a four pole was what gave me the impression it may have more pull down low. Still very happy. In fact more impressed that it is usable on the slippery dirt.
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