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Old Oct 06, 2010, 12:49 AM
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jfetter's Avatar
Miramar, Florida
Joined Jul 2007
8,517 Posts
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What's with these other sites where they just trash vendors?

A few months ago TAM left RCG, he complained about excessive moderation and people reporting everyone just to aggrevate. While I agree the reporting system here stinks (make it so it's not anonymous, that will fix it!), the truth is this is a public forum and it's not supposed to be a complaint fest or a way to personally attack people or vendors. I understand why RCG does it despite the hassle.

So Tam leaves and starts his own site and the first thing he does is become uber administrator! He's deleting other peoples posts, reading private PM's between users, I mean this was all public and kind of funny considering he became the very thing he left this site to avoid! Some people left his site but in the end I think he actually learned something and stopped doing it. What he didn't learn thogh is his board shouldn't be a complaint fest against other vendors, specifically one vendor.

So what does he have now? There are some decent folks posting jet-related content, though their total posts for all users is less than my posts alone for RCGroups (yes, it's a little slow) but he also has (and seemingly condones) the sad (but common with some of his customers) BVM bashing that runs rampant on his board. All it takes is one look (I've been reading up from time to time, it's anonymous read) and I'm surprised by these angry, sad people that just attack BVM when of course no retort or counter argument is possible.

Tam says "Here is the rules... no personal attacking, harassing, racism, trolling. Bring your personal issues somewhere else. If anyone comes to my forum with personal issues toward any members or to Tamjets, you will be kicked off from the forum and there is no warning. Please, don't put this forum or my company in any harms way." yet he allows the unabated bashing to continue. See Tam has a beef with BVM, though he talks like he's not at all concerned, he knows they are the top dog and always will be, just ask him why his new fans are really EVF 2 clones, it's no secret.

He rails against BVM and talks about them going under (sure thing Tam) and their being expensive and him beating Bob in speed runs, blah, blah but it just comes across as sad. Yes, he has supporters, they rush to his side and gang bash anyone that challenges him, even more sad because Tam should be able to defend his point. In the end they say your just a shill, well what's worse, being as shill and talking UP a company and trying to get all their good points across or hiding behind a keyboard taking pot shots at a vendor day after sad day?

These guys hate BVM for reasons they proudly post but in the end, most are full of it, take Tam's 2008 "speed runs" @ E-Jets where he supposedly beat Bob. I have a post from one of HIS PEOPLE telling me there was no official run and heck BV himself didn't even know they were racing, funny how in the end the two sides of a story are so different. I'm tired of it, I really despise this guy for the ways he acts yet I don't sit and post day after day. I finally broke down because I think any vendor hosting a hate site against other vendors, no matter who and what product they sell is just sad.

So why the rant? Well, a fiend of mine joined Tams site and the first thing Tam did was accuse him (or me, I heard my name was used?) of trying to sneak in. Why I ask, it's all public and free to read and really nothing but anti BVM or worse, anti RCG stuff regurgitated from Gene Haban's site to Tam's site back to Gene's fake "EDF Monthly" hate site. Yes these guys left but only to bring all the content from RCG that they think sucks or is funny or is anti-BVM over to their hate sites to bash (sloppy seconds). Check them out yourself, many of his friends don't like it but they stick around and say no harm, I disagree, I think it does harm and the people that don't stand up and say enough already are just as bad...

Jack
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Old Oct 06, 2010, 01:59 AM
HAL... Open the damn doors!
jfetter's Avatar
Miramar, Florida
Joined Jul 2007
8,517 Posts
Geez, I thought Tam was smart enough to understand his own board but I guess not. The first thing he did was what looks like threaten to ban some poor schmuck thinking it's me an then announce on his board "I know which user he is on my board, ban his fat @$$". Hey Tam, your board is guest read, it's called anonymous and it means all your content is available to read, you just have to logon to post, duh. I guess it only proves he can't stop coming back to RCG after all...

Jack
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Old Oct 06, 2010, 02:12 AM
Fly allot, Crash allot, next?
United States, CA, Corona
Joined Feb 2006
7,246 Posts
Jack, you are way off base, as normal.

Jim Drew stopped posting so now Jack being bored goes over to Tams site. Jack, you will get hurt at Tams site, it's a one sided affair even though some good things are discussed concerning other vendors. It was mentioned several times that BVM makes nice sleek air frames and that TamJets EDF units makes those airframes fly pretty fast. I don't see that as being negative toward another vendor. However, I just love the interview of Bob V on EDF monthly.

I won't even comment on what you said above, but Tams site is a vendor site, RCG is a so called public forum. Big difference. At a vendor site, the vendor supports his products and I say again, it's usually a one sided affair.

Even though Tams is a one sided affair, and doesn't have nearly the participation of members as RCG, I find the conversation entertaining, stimulating, educational, and FREE of ARGUMENTATIVE PEOPLE, like you. People that think that they were put on earth to set everything straight and tell others what they think of them by pointing out flaws in certain statements. This shows a complete lack of respect and can only take place by cowards hiding behind computers.

I dare you to go on Tam's site and call someone a liar, it will get very personal, very quickly.

By the way, does BVM have a vendor site for enthusiast participation? If so, I want to join.
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Old Oct 06, 2010, 02:36 AM
HAL... Open the damn doors!
jfetter's Avatar
Miramar, Florida
Joined Jul 2007
8,517 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by SCALEFAN View Post
Jack, you are way off base, as normal.

Jim Drew stopped posting so now Jack being bored goes over to Tams site. Jack, you will get hurt at Tams site, it's a one sided affair even though some good things are discussed concerning other vendors. It was mentioned several times that BVM makes nice sleek air frames and that TamJets EDF units makes those airframes fly pretty fast. I don't see that as being negative toward another vendor. However, I just love the interview of Bob V on EDF monthly.

I won't even comment on what you said above, but Tams site is a vendor site, RCG is a so called public forum. Big difference. At a vendor site, the vendor supports his products and I say again, it's usually a one sided affair.

Even though Tams is a one sided affair, and doesn't have nearly the participation of members as RCG, I find the conversation entertaining, stimulating, educational, and FREE of ARGUMENTATIVE PEOPLE, like you. People that think that they were put on earth to set everything straight and tell others what they think of them by pointing out flaws in certain statements. This shows a complete lack of respect and can only take place by cowards hiding behind computers.

I dare you to go on Tam's site and call someone a liar, it will get very personal, very quickly.

By the way, does BVM have a vendor site for enthusiast participation? If so, I want to join.
As I expected, in comes self-proclaimed defender, why don't you argue for yourself and let others do the same. Do you know what "personal" means Scale? It's not when I say you are lying or I think your conclusion is wrong or your stats are absolutely incorrect it's when someone says "that's why your Wife left you" or "no wonder you drink so much" or "anyone with a nose as big as yours would be wise to hide it", that's personal and you can keep it. I've found in life that those that can't argue/debate on a factual basis immediately fall back to personal insults and name calling, exactly the kind of stuff that happens on Tams site.

Likewise the content over there is just recycled RCG stuff for the most part, you guys sit over there so high and mighty making fun of the stuff over here anb BVM and anything you don't like or understand and you miss the entire thing. You guys broke up the community to what, act like seventh graders! Why not pass a note in study hall calling me a fatty! Truth is quite a few of the Tam folks have come back and have said privately (sadly most are just trying not to rock the boat) that Tams site is just a commercial for Tam and a name calling forum for things he doesn't like, i.e. BVM. There is more disinformation on his site than anywhere else, congratulations...

Jack
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Old Oct 06, 2010, 02:45 AM
There was a crease in the plan
Steve Haynes's Avatar
Joined Jun 2010
1,332 Posts
Jack

If you dont like Tam's. ignore it.

I had a bad experiance and got angry, not worth it I wont go back.

Its a vendor site and he can do what he likes so long as its legal.

Most people will migrate to the location that they feel most at home with the company and the attitudes.

Are you going to Arizona Jets?
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Old Oct 06, 2010, 03:16 AM
HAL... Open the damn doors!
jfetter's Avatar
Miramar, Florida
Joined Jul 2007
8,517 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by steve haynes View Post
Jack

If you dont like Tam's. ignore it.

I had a bad experiance and got angry, not worth it I wont go back.

Its a vendor site and he can do what he likes so long as its legal.

Most people will migrate to the location that they feel most at home with the company and the attitudes.

Are you going to Arizona Jets?
Steve,

I ignored his site for a long time, too many others have let him get away with lies as well, I've got at least 20 PM's from a few who witnessed some of his maidens and have told me flat out some of Tam's stated figures are made up, especialy the power and capacity used during flights, I'd love to post it but that would betray the two that sent it, can't do that.

I can ignore that kind of thing, after all his numbers rarely add up and are easy to see through but I've also seen things over there about me and that just rubs me the wrong way. Mostly I don't think it's very professional to keep hounding BVM when Tam has nothing to show that's better or even unique. If BVM had a forum where all he did was slam other vendors I'd feel the same way. Man-up Tam and hold yourself to the same standards as the users of your forum.

As for Arizona, I'd actually like to get back out west but I use all my vacation and Wife's patience with the 4 events a year I go to out here. Until I retire or hit the lottery I don't think I can ask for more time off for events. We're lucky enough to have year-round flying and I love the events I already go to, I just can't see changing them up until I can add them to the list rather than substitute. As it is I am already counting the days to the next one!

Jack
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Old Oct 06, 2010, 08:57 AM
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Daren's Avatar
Los Alamos, NM, USofA
Joined Nov 2000
3,123 Posts
Ho hum. Nothing here. Moving on.

Daren
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Old Oct 06, 2010, 10:02 AM
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Doug Bateman's Avatar
Swarthmore, PA 19081
Joined Dec 2004
2,846 Posts
I left Tam's site cause i got tired of the tea-bagging avatars. You don't see that crap on RCG....
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Old Oct 06, 2010, 10:41 AM
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bri6672's Avatar
San Diego
Joined Jul 2009
2,288 Posts
What's this about Jim Drew not posting??
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Old Oct 06, 2010, 10:49 AM
HAL... Open the damn doors!
jfetter's Avatar
Miramar, Florida
Joined Jul 2007
8,517 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by bri6672 View Post
What's this about Jim Drew not posting??
This was just ScaleFan saying since Jim isn't around to argue with, I picked a fight with Tam. Jim has posted a lot of stuff on RCG from what I've seen and still does...

Jack
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Old Oct 06, 2010, 11:12 AM
Fly allot, Crash allot, next?
United States, CA, Corona
Joined Feb 2006
7,246 Posts
Jack,

I have seen your builds, the latest is just one beautiful plane and was drawing alot of insterest.

How about continueing on with that build thread?

I don't get a disount at Tams and what I say is just my opinion. I never said anything negative about BVM. I have no experience with them so I can't comment. However, I have had experience with Tam and like with every small business, the personal touch really helps with customer satisfaction.

If you want to continue posting this negative stuff, then follow your own rules, produce facts so that they can be cross examined. If some of you other guys don't like the TamJets site, don't particpate, it's your own decision.

Al
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Old Oct 06, 2010, 11:17 AM
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unknown flyer's Avatar
Fairbanks Alaska
Joined May 2010
182 Posts
Until this thread popped up, I was thinking to myself how it seemed like some amount of civility had returned to the forums this past week.

It seemed the vendors, shills, fanboys, sock-puppets and other had all taken a break for whatever reason and the nonsense had subsided.

Maybe it was just wishful thinking on my part.
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Old Oct 06, 2010, 11:24 AM
HAL... Open the damn doors!
jfetter's Avatar
Miramar, Florida
Joined Jul 2007
8,517 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by SCALEFAN View Post
Jack,

I have seen your builds, the latest is just one beautiful plane and was drawing alot of insterest.

How about continueing on with that build thread?

I don't get a disount at Tams and what I say is just my opinion. I never said anything negative about BVM. I have no experience with them so I can't comment. However, I have had experience with Tam and like with every small business, the personal touch really helps with customer satisfaction.

If you want to continue posting this negative stuff, then follow your own rules, produce facts so that they can be cross examined. If some of you other guys don't like the TamJets site, don't particpate, it's your own decision.

Al
There is one difference Scale and that's what I'm pointing out. This site is public and clean, it has to be or you alienate folks. This means there needs to be moderation and that moderation (as tedious as it can be) means both sides get an equal say and as soon as it becomes personal, that gets removed. On Tam's site (and Gene's fake site), it's just a bunch of hate mongering with no controls in place and there is no counter argument as those users simply get banned!

So I ask you, is it fair to start a one-sided forum and ban all those that oppose? I seem to remember a guy getting trashed on Tam's board for simply suggesting a heat sink wasn't mandatory, that's it and he was hammered! If you want to host a hate site do it openly but don't try and hide behind a legitimate forum (the word "forum", suggeststing "a public meeting or assembly for open discussion"), not! Any one of us can register "such-and-such-is-a-jerk.com" and host a hate site, very mature...

Jack
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Old Oct 06, 2010, 11:25 AM
HAL... Open the damn doors!
jfetter's Avatar
Miramar, Florida
Joined Jul 2007
8,517 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by unknown flyer View Post
It seemed the vendors, shills, fanboys, sock-puppets and other had all taken a break for whatever reason and the nonsense had subsided.
Aren't shills, fanboys and sock-puppets the same?

Jack
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Old Oct 06, 2010, 11:32 AM
smug in granny panties
monkamarm2000's Avatar
NorCal Silicon Valley
Joined Aug 2002
11,779 Posts
I know how he feels! I'm a Chevy fan and last week I saw thesr guys in a ford forum saying there stuff was good and Chevy sucks! The nerve of them thinking for themselves and talking about what they want to in there own places! Don't they know I'm right! You'd think when I drove them out of open forum they would learn there lesson! But its ok cause I know I'm justified to go in there under a false name and corecy there independant behavior.


Barry
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